Patterson stretchered off in Nations League match

21/09/2022 135comments  |  Jump to last

Everton full-back Nathan Patterson could be set for another spell on the sidelines after he had to be carried off the field at Hampden Park this evening in Scotland's Uefa Nations League match against Ukraine.

The 20-year-old, who has been in magnificent form for the Blues after his first start in the Premier League last month had been delayed by ankle surgery earlier this year, suffered what appeared to be a knee injury when he collided with an opposition player on the wet turf.

Both of Everton's first-choice full-backs were due to face off tonight but Vitalii Mykolenko only made the bench because of a knock of his own.

Mykolenko reportedly picked up a minor injury during Sunday's victory over West Ham and has been left out of Ukraine's line-up to face Scotland at Hampden Park as a precaution.

Article continues below video content

Patterson started the match, however, as the Scots look to move above this evening's opponents into top spot in Group B1, but he managed just 20 minutes before sustaining an injury that will have Everton's medical staff sweating before scans can reveal the full extent of the damage.

The former Rangers player initially tried to hobble off the pitch but a stretcher was then called to ensure he didn't exacerbate the injury.

“It doesn't look too good when they go off on a stretcher,” Scotland head coach Steve Clarke said afterwards. “He felt something on his leg. We'll wait and see what the medics say.

“Obviously we don't know [yet] because he's got to go away and get assessed but it doesn't look like a good one. Fingers crossed it's not too bad.”


Reader Comments (135)

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Ricky Oak
1 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:15:18
Patterson, Everton that.
Rob Halligan
2 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:15:45
For fuck's sake… Patterson injured after only 25 minutes and going off. Doesn't look good. Going off on a stretcher.
Pat Kelly
3 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:15:46
And Patterson stretchered off
Paul Davies
4 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:16:33
Patterson just off on a stretcher.
Steve Shave
5 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:18:55
Oh for fuck's sake, we are cursed!!!!

Anyone have any idea what type of injury it was?

Bryan Houghton
6 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:20:13
For fuck's sake, Stretchered. Looks in pain. Un-fucking-believable.
Rob Halligan
7 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:21:02
Looked like an ankle injury, Steve. Was chasing back and seemed to get his feet caught up in-between a Ukrainian player's legs.
Neil Copeland
8 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:21:15
Knee injury according to the BBC, just hope it's not serious.

Seamus Coleman – come on down!

Alan McGuffog
9 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:21:16
McFadden on BBC suggesting it may be medial ligament damage.
Kieran Kinsella
10 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:22:26
James McFadden speculating it's a medial ligament?
Brian Murray
11 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:22:32
Stupid fucking meaningless tournament. We can't go a month without an injury.
Bryan Houghton
12 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:22:50
Accordng to James McFadden on BBC commentary – he reckons it's the medial ligament. I don't know much about it.

Other than its fucking typical of our luck. I have a bit of sick in my mouth. Fingers crossed it's not too serious. Bit gutted for him, and us if serious.

Rob Halligan
13 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:23:04
Alan, not quite sure how McFadden can come up with that diagnosis within a couple of minutes?
Paul Hughes
14 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:24:42
We are cursed. Fucking internationals.

Luckily we have only 3 or 4 players going to the stupid World Cup in November.

Brian Murray
15 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:27:02
Nothing against Seamus but I was hoping the likes of him Keane and Holgate were a thing of the past. He's been a great servant but 3 years too long.
Paul Birmingham
16 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:28:41
Bloody typical.

Poxy international games. Let's hope that Nathan's injury recovery goes well.

McFadden suggesting it's his medial ligament, gutted for the lad as he has been superb this season.

This will test Everton's squad strength and shape, but let's pray for a swift and full recovery for the lad.

Lee Courtliff
17 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:29:23
Didn't he injure his ankle just before the West Ham last season? Hope it's not a recurrence of the same problem.
Alan McGuffog
18 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:29:32
Rob... he said Nathan was indicating the problem was on the inside of the knee. But as you indicate... who knows yet?
Rob Halligan
19 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:30:39
Patterson was injured just before he was due to make his debut against West Ham last season. Injured again tonight… cue the 'sicknote' comments.
Peter Neilson
20 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:35:37
Anyone else absolutely fed up of these meaningless internationals?

Rebranded Nations League by the beyond reproach Michel Platini. We just don't have enough games!!

Kieran Kinsella
21 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:35:41
I wouldn't count on Seamus. Ireland have a game on Saturday. We seem to get more injuries playing for Ireland than any other country.
Brian Murray
22 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:38:03
A bog of a pitch at Lansdowne Road cost us the double as Southall landed awkwardly in '86. We just can't catch a break. Hope his pointing at the inside of he knee means not medial damage.
Kieran Kinsella
23 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:41:42

The thing lost all credibility (if it had any) at the end of the first season when Germany were "relegated" from the top tier for about a week until they decided to revamp it make the top tier bigger so Germany, Iceland and all got a reprieve.

And now, with a World Cup in a little over a month, who gives a crap about the Nations League? Anyone smart would play rubbish players so they get relegated into the easy group and then they can win the spot for every Euros as the best of the complete crap teams.

Rob Halligan
24 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:42:07
The annoying thing is it was a challenge he didn’t even have to make. The ball was probably no more than 10 - 15 yards outside the Ukraine penalty area.
Jim Bennings
25 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:43:05
How very typical of our luck.

If that's medial ligament damage, then that's Patterson done for the season.

Looked very much like the Andros Townsend injury last season to me, I hope and pray I'm wrong otherwise it's a season of old man Seamus or square peg in triangular hole Holgate, neither can play that right back role to a high standard anymore for different reasons.

I hate these pointless international breaks so early in the domestic season, it's bad enough this year that we have the Slave Labour World Cup in December without these matches.

Danny O’Neill
26 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:46:25
I didn't like international breaks previously but what is the point of this competition? Don't we already have a European Championship?

I hope not but I'm guessing that is serious.

Ukranian player got away with assault there!!

Jim Bennings
27 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:50:19

I have long grumbled about the amount of international football during the club season.

For me, there's only the World Cup (a proper World Cup in the summertime – not when the Christmas decorations are up) or the Euros that will ever gain my attention.

There has always been far too many stop-start breaks, September, October, November, March, there's just too many games of irrelevant meaning.

Now we've potentially lost a key player for a good number of months if it is what we suspect.

Peter Carpenter
28 Posted 21/09/2022 at 20:57:58
Oh, fuck!
Rob Halligan
29 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:01:18
If Mykolenko is only a sub due to carrying a “minor knock”, then why haven't Everton demanded that he be withdrawn from the Ukrainian squad so he can receive treatment at Finch Farm?

Knowing our luck, he will come on and that minor knock will turn into a major injury.

John Crook
30 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:09:21
If it's a longer-term injury, then this could force reverting back to a 3-5-2 (3 in midfield is a must now I believe), and either Iwobi goes to right-wingback or Stanley Mills gets a chance to show what he can do.

Really hope it's only a short-term injury but judging by the negative responses it has a gut feel of months rather than weeks.

Ray Smith
31 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:09:40
Mina and Holgate not due back until 19th October. Godfrey out to end of December. Mykolenko taken a knock with Ukraine.
Which leaves us with Coleman and Keane as recognised defenders.

As several have said in this thread, we seem to be cursed, one step forward, two back. I'm sure other teams have similar problems, but it always seems to be us!!!

Nick Page
32 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:10:01
Oh no!!! Why the fuck are we playing these completely pointless games, when the season is only a few games in.

Also, we have a winter World Cup which has already ruined the fixture schedule anyway….in a country that doesn't play or care about football, let alone human rights, and anyway couldn't fill two stadiums with locals. Industrial scale corruption.

Every single injury on international duty should be compensated for by the national FA and sanctioning body (in this case Uefa). That's all his wages paid for and our league position compensated. It would soon stop all this shite because the bastards couldn't afford it.

If he's done his ankle ligaments, I feel for him as it took me 6 months to run post ATFL reconstruction. And that was in a straight line.

Can't believe it.

Tony Hill
33 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:13:24
Let's wait and see how bad it is but it looks serious. Actually, I think Coleman might still do a good job but my word we do seem to have these injuries just when we're getting into some form and when people's hopes are raised.

In my old age I realise how critical "luck" is in life and, of course, in sport.

Very best wishes to young Nathan.

Lev Vellene
34 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:13:38
Fingers crossed, but for once we might have a deputy in that position! Ain't that a silly thought??? Everton??? Go(!), ye unknown, forgotten Irishman... :P

Dale Self
35 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:14:51
I'm not sure if someone already stated this but he walked off the field on his own.
Nick Page
36 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:15:10
Brian - just saw your comment #21.

If he's pointing to inside of knee, it's the meniscus. Could be a tear. If it's a bucket handle tear (displaced) then he wouldn't be walking … did mine a few weeks ago. Absolute mess.

I'd choose ankle injury over knee as you can support it with a boot.

Rob Halligan
37 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:16:04
Quick bit of research says that a medial ligament injury can heal from anything between 1 - 6 weeks, depending on the severity of the injury. Can often recover without the need for surgery. If surgery is required, then the recovery period could be a lot longer.

Obviously we don't know the full prognosis of his injury yet, but the good thing is he walked off towards the touchline, before the stretcher was called. I guess by walking off, it would indicate it is only a strain, rather than a tear, so hopefully he won't be missing too long.

We have eight Premier League games and one Carabao Cup game before a 7-week break due to the World Cup. Hopefully his first game back will be Wolves at home on Boxing Day.

Jim Bennings
38 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:17:16

I don't know, Seamus looked completely shot at the end of last season, certain games he was so far off it, it became painful watching a long serving player so bad.

But as we say, what are the options?

Rob Halligan
39 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:20:23
Scotland now lead, but who gives a fuck!
Danny O’Neill
40 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:20:35
That sounds a bit more positive, Rob. Walking wounded and young. A few pain killers and we'll see him at Southampton!!
Brian Murray
41 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:22:11
Can't go through all that again.

Coleman going on a Patterson-style run then checking back because he hasn't the legs although as a defender he's still street wise and not many get the better of him.

Got to find another option.

Jim Bennings
42 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:22:55
Scotland lead but how has VAR not looked at that goal?

If that's us scoring that goal then it gets ruled out every day of the week.

Joe McMahon
43 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:23:22
FFS, he's been great this season. I don't believe it. I don't want any Everton players in meaningless internationals again.

It seems to hit us more than any other team. I get laughed at when I say this, but someone in past history put a Hex on this club. Things have been generally shite since the late 80s.

Rob Halligan
45 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:30:00
2-0. At least Mykolenko won’t be coming on.
Tony Hill
47 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:32:26
Jim @41,

I'm interested in John's @29 mention of Stanley Mills having a possible role but, of course, Stanley is very young.

Anyway, it's a challenge we have to meet and I have faith that Ashley Cole and others will do so. We have to be tough.

Michael Lynch
48 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:33:40
Pointless competition, driven by greed. There's more than enough international games as it is, without this Mickey Mouse tournament.

And yet again it's clubs like us, with weaker squads, that suffer the most when we lose one of our players.

Tony Hill
50 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:44:29
That's a very good point, Kieran @45. It can be done and I am starting to think that Lampard and his coaches are getting more savvy and more steely by the week.

We also now have proper, influential hard cases in the centre of our defence to help marshal things.

Terry Farrell
51 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:45:03
Just when he was playing great!

Seamus can do a good job if it's 1 game a week but he could do with knocking the internationals on the head so that he is at his maximum. Let's hope it's not a bad one but he didn't walk off – he was stretchered off!

Mike Gaynes
52 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:48:16
Ah, fuck, what a horror story.
Lyndon Lloyd
53 Posted 21/09/2022 at 21:50:23
The last player of ours I can recall sustaining a medial knee ligament injury was Bernard and he missed 3 months I think which (assuming that's the injury he has picked up) would put Patterson's return at around the end of the year when the Premier League season resumes.
David West
55 Posted 21/09/2022 at 22:05:48
We can't just have one week where we get 3 points and enjoy the week, can we?

Hopefully Seamus is fit and raring to go. He hasn't had a decent centre-back pair next to him for a while, so maybe he can roll back the years and give Patterson a masterclass over the next couple of months if it's as bad as feared.

James Mcfadden can diagnose an injury from a replay… get him back to Goodison on the medical staff!!!

Fingers crossed for the lad, though – he's been a joy to watch so far this season.

Danny Baily
56 Posted 21/09/2022 at 22:10:08
Massive blow, made worse by the fact it's come about in a pointless friendly. Rubbish luck.
David West
57 Posted 21/09/2022 at 22:15:24
Ray 30 You recognise Keane as a defender ????

Just please not 3 centre backs. 🙏

Colin Glassar
58 Posted 21/09/2022 at 22:19:38
Can’t Scotland play anyone else other than Ukraine? They seem to play them all the time.
Christy Ring
59 Posted 21/09/2022 at 22:21:45

Patterson looking the real deal, injured in a Mickey Mouse match. McFadden not an expert, but hope he's right about a medial injury, and it's not too severe, especially with our defensive injuries.

Tommy Carter
60 Posted 21/09/2022 at 22:23:28
A crying shame as it looked like this back 4 were going to be a consistent solid unit.

Whereas some teams can field their full-backs 50 times a season for 5 years on the bounce, we cannot.

Fingers crossed that it's not a very serious one.

Jerome Shields
61 Posted 21/09/2022 at 22:37:50
Bad news that.
Ciarán McGlone
62 Posted 21/09/2022 at 22:43:59
What an absolutely pointless competition.
Chris James
63 Posted 21/09/2022 at 22:45:58
Fuck. Right. Off!

Another meaningless international game... another injury to someone who's become a key first-team player.

Why is it always us?

Si Cooper
64 Posted 21/09/2022 at 22:51:28
Snapping the cruciate used to be the real career-ender, didn't it? And even that is fairly routinely repaired these days, I believe.

Let's hope it's basically just something tweaked and the lad is sensibly being acutely sensitive about it following his ankle injury.

Tom Bowers
65 Posted 21/09/2022 at 23:03:45
As soon as I saw a player down, I just knew it had to an Everton man.

Never fails in these darned internationals.

Eddie Dunn
66 Posted 21/09/2022 at 23:04:30
It all depends on the severity. I have had a few minor injuries on the sides of the knee and soldiered-on. Hopefully it is low grade.

I also hate these shitty internationals. So close to the World Cup – it's ridiculous.

John Keating
67 Posted 21/09/2022 at 23:10:34
Well, at least we can be thankful he got injured playing in a tournament that has us all on the edge of our seats, watching every game on telly knowing we'd never get a ticket.

Yet another meaningless, useless game signed off by a corrupt body only interested in lining their own pockets.

Bill Watson
68 Posted 21/09/2022 at 23:23:20
There's rumours Calvert-Lewin has had a setback but nothing on the Everton website.

Is it people putting 2 and 2 together and coming up with 5 because he was omitted on Sunday?

Lev Vellene
69 Posted 21/09/2022 at 23:28:07
Danny #70,

like Gomes got back from that???

It's a good thing no-one ever thought he was a liability ever after...

Nicolas Piñon
70 Posted 21/09/2022 at 23:34:28
What a blow... Anyway Seamus is a hell of a sub..

Can we buy someone for it? How far away are Holgate and Mina from being back? No news on them?

Paul Kossoff
71 Posted 21/09/2022 at 23:48:06
You couldn't make this up, could you?

22 players on the pitch; I say to my son, "I hope Patterson doesn't get injured." 20 minutes later... bang, oh what a surprise.

And the fucking idiot trainers are walking him off the pitch to put him back on again. Over 10 minutes before he left the side of the pitch on a trolly stretcher! Cursed we are.

Brent Stephens
72 Posted 21/09/2022 at 23:54:31
I fear nobody from the U21s is ready to step up. Welch is a centre-back, not a right-back. I think Mills has played a few games at right-back(?) but not of late. All too risky.

I assume Vinagre couldn't switch to the right?

Paul Kossoff
73 Posted 21/09/2022 at 23:59:25
Rian 22,

It was that bastard Aldridge that done Southall. He went up under him that caused the awkward landing. Cost us the double that fucker, was he playing for Oxford at the time?

Pete Fishwick
74 Posted 21/09/2022 at 00:01:07
Personally, this is why I hate our players being selected for call-up. Why anyone would promote it is beyond me...

I'm gutted for him and for us. Praying it's a lesser injury than it looks.

David Bromwell
75 Posted 22/09/2022 at 08:07:26
What I don't understand is why a young inexperienced player is being allowed to play every Premier League game and then is selected for a meaningless international as we hear constantly that players are 'over-played'.

To make matters worse, young Patterson's likely deputy seems likely to play for Ireland this weekend. Surely the club has the right and responsibility to manage game time for its players?

Dale Rose
76 Posted 22/09/2022 at 08:17:43
Just to echo what others have said, a useless competition with the World Cup and Euros coming up. Hope the lad recovers quickly.
Robert Tressell
77 Posted 22/09/2022 at 08:43:39
The emergence of Patterson this season has highlighted just how poor Coleman had become for us both defensively and offensively.

Holgate, unfortunately, is probably the better bet at right-back.

Hopefully Patterson is not out for long. If he can stay fit, he's going to be an absolutely tremendous player for us.

Christopher Timmins
78 Posted 22/09/2022 at 08:48:47
Hopefully, he will be back sooner rather than later; however, in a scenario where he won't be back before the World Cup, we can manage.

Martin Reppion
79 Posted 22/09/2022 at 09:01:18
Whilst this tournament is 'meaningless' as most on here have stated, we have always had international friendlies in the run-up to World and European Cup tournaments.

The Nations League was introduced to keep an element of competitiveness in these matches. If it didn't exist, there would still have been an international break to allow the national managers to complete their pre-tournament selection and tactical issues sorted.

The problem with this year is that the various national bodies allowed this clearly corrupt World cup to go ahead. This made the timing of the international break and the need for ambitious players to play in the warm-up games so awkward.

It is too late now to change things but, if the big Euro leagues had said they would not release players for this tournament at the outset, the rest of the world would have followed. FIFA would have lost its corrupt monopoly of the game.

Stu Darlington
80 Posted 22/09/2022 at 09:07:27
A young up-and-coming talented footballer, a long-term investment for his club,s eriously injured in a Mickey Mouse meaningless international football competition? I don't get it.

Shouldn't the club be heavily compensated by the organising body? If not, clubs should refuse to release players for this kind of competition (including international friendlies).

I get players want to achieve the honour of representing their country, but surely this should be in some meaningful competition?

Clubs invest a lot of money in acquiring and developing players to compete in the Premier League, that's where the big money is and their bread and butter, so to have that undermined by serious injuries to key players in this sort of competition is mind-bogglingly stupid to me.

Rant over.

Michael Kenrick
81 Posted 22/09/2022 at 09:35:53
But Stu @97,

The huge ironic riposte to your rant is that the powers that be, who govern football and maintain the parallel career paths for club and country, invented this not-quite meaningless competition precisely because of the opposition to meaningless international friendlies.

And more competition, perhaps inevitably, seems to increase the risk of more injuries.

Brian Harrison
82 Posted 22/09/2022 at 09:49:16
Very disappointing for the lad as just when he was in a great run of form, but I am sure the medical team will have him back in hopefully 4 to 6 weeks.

Luckily we have Coleman to come in – not the Seamus of a few years back but he can still do a job for the team while Patterson recovers.

I see the Bobble was saying that Calvert-Lewin has a slight groin injury now, I guess that's why he didn't make the bench for the West Ham game.

Bob Parrington
83 Posted 22/09/2022 at 09:59:32
Joe@43 - I've said it before and repeat it now. It is that wicked witch of LFC, stirring her pot of Hubble, Bubble, Toil and Trouble to EFC. Nasty piece of work that LFC pot stirrer!
Brian Murray
84 Posted 22/09/2022 at 10:16:04
We at the moment are a finely balanced team especially at the back and midfield without any quality back-up.

Those on here saying we will make do is exactly that. Making do should be our motto.

We have to somehow find a clever real option to Patterson – not a full-back who is well past it.

Tony Abrahams
85 Posted 22/09/2022 at 10:16:28
That was the first thing I thought when I heard about Patterson getting injured, Bob@103.

He had just had a little laugh and joke with McFadden about having Nunez in his pocket during the Merseyside derby. Whilst I was watching it, I was genuinely thinking that someone from the Devil's club will be wishing a little bad on you now, Nathan.

Michael Lynch
86 Posted 22/09/2022 at 10:48:42
Early twitter nonsense, I mean rumour, is suggesting he'll be out until after the World Cup, which would be terrible but not the worst possible outcome, I suppose.

We are going to get injuries of course, but our current revival has been built on a solid, unchanging, back four. Having said that, Coleman is probably the best cover we have at the back right now – I'd be more worried if Coady was injured at this stage.

Of course, Coleman is with Ireland at the moment, so the chances of him coming back fit are no better than 50-50.

Michael Lynch
87 Posted 22/09/2022 at 10:55:45
I see Lucas Digne is out for a while too after breaking his ankle with France. Villa are in big trouble with injuries, they've got most of their first choice defenders out of action.
Steve Brown
88 Posted 22/09/2022 at 11:06:13
Wonder if we’ll have to switch to a back three if Coleman comes in?
Michael Kenrick
91 Posted 22/09/2022 at 13:54:39
Back on topic (!!!):

"According to the Daily Record, Patterson is now on his way back to Everton for a scan so that the Goodison Park club can determine the extent of the injury."

That doesn't sound too good, sad to say.

Mike Keating
92 Posted 22/09/2022 at 14:09:16
Martinez saying he might think twice about using Onana as he arrived in the Belgium camp with ‘a knock'. If he was carrying any sort of injury, why was he allowed to go?
Stu Darlington
93 Posted 22/09/2022 at 14:13:13
Michael @100,

Yes but they didn't get it right, did they? Simply added another competition and we still have meaningless international friendlies, adding up to 60+ games a season for players at top clubs.

As you say, more competitions will increase the chance of injury and it is the club that pays the price. I suspect the opportunity of another way of screwing money out of football supporters may have had some influence.

Am I a cynic or a realist?

Jim Lloyd
94 Posted 22/09/2022 at 14:17:28
Thanks Bill, appreciated.

Well, whether these tournaments are really important, we've got to send players, haven't we, unless they're injured or sick. In one way, it's good to see our players wanted; but there's always that chance of injury. I think the countries can send their own doctors if there are doubts. Not sure though.

Good job that Seamus is fit and ready. Though it might mean a reorganisation again.

Bernard Dooley
95 Posted 22/09/2022 at 14:52:47
Not much point in speculating on the extent of the injury or the amount of time Nathan could be out until the scan has taken place.

"A grade 1 (mild) MCL tear usually heals within one to three weeks. A grade 2 (moderate) MCL tear generally takes four to six weeks to heal with treatment. A grade 3 (severe) MCL tear can take six weeks or more to heal with treatment."
But we don't know if it is an MCL.

Dominic had an LCL and that was predicted to be a 3-month absence in some quarters.

We wait, hope, and cross our fingers

Eddie Dunn
96 Posted 22/09/2022 at 14:54:49
Actually, if Seamus gets some minutes for the Republic, it will most likely be of benefit to him and us, as he will be short of real match fitness otherwise.

As for young Patterson, it is a real shame as the lad is showing his quality and potential. I suspect that we will see some goals from him in the future.

Michael Kenrick
97 Posted 22/09/2022 at 15:07:12
Stu, I think it's a difficult one to unpack.

Yes, the players are contracted to clubs for their 'bread and butter'... but they all seem to say that playing for their respective countries is the pinnacle of achievement for their careers, and very few appear to turn down the honour, if selected.

My perception is that most players want to play, but they do plenty of training thank you very much, and what they really want to do is play in competitive matches. Be that for club or country. As I say, they see it as an honour and a privilege to be selected.

Whereas we fans see it as an annoyance, an interference in the priority games for clubs that are paying the wages. And maddening if they get injured. Ah, but them wages have to come from somewhere. That's mostly club income – only a part of which is funded by gate money.

And what about the gate money for internationals then? Is that a driver in setting the competitive international fixture schedules? Rather I think it's the imperative of the competitions themselves: World Cup; Euros; Copa America; Afcon... yes, Nations League.

The games themselves cost money to organize, stage, police, etc. And yes, a chunk of money is going to go to the participating National Football Associations... to be used for what? Paying the salaries of officials who need to be bribed to vote for staging the World Cup in Qatar (allegedly)?

Realist or cynic? I think you have to be a bit of both or you'd go mad!!!

Stu Darlington
98 Posted 22/09/2022 at 15:37:24
Thanks for that, Michael.

Your comments are much too rational and balanced for me!

Please don't confuse me with the facts, I enjoy a little rant when one of our players are injured in these “minor“ competitions, particularly after the fairly miserable couple of seasons we have had, and the fact that we now seem to be putting a reasonable squad together, only to have it disrupted in this way.

Perhaps I'll consider ditching cynic to become a lateral thinker!

Lyndon Lloyd
Editorial Team
99 Posted 22/09/2022 at 19:21:19
Note that comments related to Bert Trautman and members' own horror injuries, those regarding concerns over the trajectory of ToffeeWeb discourse and the conduct of certain individual(s) have been moved to the ToffeeHouse Chatroom in an attempt to keep this thread a bit more on-topic.
Tony Abrahams
100 Posted 22/09/2022 at 19:33:25
Onana definitely stretched his right leg towards the end of Sunday’s game, Mike.
Christy Ring
102 Posted 22/09/2022 at 19:52:39
Robert #77,

I hope Patterson is only out short term, but to say Coleman is so poor for us defensively and as an attacking threat, is totally wrong.

In case you have forgotten, Coleman is nearly 33 and last season he played nearly every game, even when he was carrying an injury. If he had a break, fair enough, but he never got a chance of a rest, which is not fair on him at his age.

Tony Dunn
103 Posted 22/09/2022 at 20:35:56
Eddie Dunn @66,

I agree about knee injuries after years of too many of them. 5-a-side seemed to be the worst for them. It's always great when you felt you'd shaken them off but now, at 61, I do feel them.

Good luck to Patterson.

Sam Hoare
104 Posted 22/09/2022 at 21:39:19
Hope Patterson is not out long but Coleman is still a decent option in the short term. Mills could be given minutes and either Godfrey or Holgate could be back in the not-too-distant future.
Alan McGuffog
105 Posted 22/09/2022 at 22:08:39
The blessed Ramon, the finest full back I have seen, won a World Cup medal at, I think, 33.
Larry O'Hara
106 Posted 22/09/2022 at 22:10:29
Just read a gushing plug on the BBC Sport website for pedestrian Man Utd player McTominay playing for Scotland. Not one sentence about Patterson being injured despite generalising about all Scotland players doing just fine. The sooner this RS-loving cesspit is defunded the better…
Mike Keating
107 Posted 22/09/2022 at 23:52:11
Thanks Lyndon - is the ToffeeHouse Chatroom code for the Naughty Corner?
Have to say, one of the joys of TW is the fact that it’s subscribers stray off in all kinds of weird directions.
Anyone remember the ‘What happened to white dog turds” debate?
Went on forever.
Kieran Kinsella
108 Posted 23/09/2022 at 00:04:37

Hopefully at worst it's the 9 games before the World Cup, in which case, as you say, we should be covered. We only have two midweek games in that period so, if Seamus can't handle two a week, we should be able to survive two games with AN Other.

Ian Hams
109 Posted 23/09/2022 at 01:26:03
What did happen to them, Mike?
Kieran Kinsella
110 Posted 23/09/2022 at 02:05:42
Ian Hams

Mystery solved


Barry Williams
111 Posted 23/09/2022 at 05:27:40
Here is a left field option - Tom Davies! (pre-empt - wish he'd left the field etc.)

It might not sound as mad as it initially does. I remember seeing him play as a right back a few years ago - he did a decent job, and for some reason centre midfield and RB do seem to be interchangeable to a degree - Snodin, Harper and Neville for example.

Just a thought!

Martin Reppion
112 Posted 23/09/2022 at 09:04:28
Kieran #110

Thanks for that. As a dog owner I lost sleep not knowing the true reason.

Oliver Molloy
113 Posted 23/09/2022 at 09:38:55
No news is good news, not in this case I suggest. The longer the silence on the extent of the injury, the worse we can expect.

Hope I'm wrong as Patterson was starting to settle and show a bit of form.

I see already speculation that Onana won't be with us too long due to the impressive start!

Steve Shave
114 Posted 23/09/2022 at 10:44:06
Feeling like an anxious parent, checking the news every hour to see how our boy is doing. I am keeping everything crossed for good news.

If he is out for a while, one of two things is likely to happen: one is we stick with a flat back 4 and Seamus can slot into that system, perhaps with us looking to the left-bck position as more of an attacking outlet.

The other is that Frank might want to switch to wingbacks again (I can hear the groans already), in which case, either Iwobi or Mills could fill in. We could see the birth of Mills's Everton career. If it's Iwobi, then Doucouré can fill in in midfield, a poor deputy in my eyes but it's all about opinions, eh.

Tony Everan
115 Posted 23/09/2022 at 11:27:39
Yes, me too, Steve, maybe the first scans were inconclusive and they are retaking them? They will have to be sure of the diagnosis so that they can hopefully conclude that surgery is not necessary. Fingers crossed here as well.

I think Seamus will fill in okay, and give his all as usual, as long as he can stay fit. Especially so as our third choice emergency right-back Holgate is still out.

Steavey Buckley
116 Posted 23/09/2022 at 12:42:10
Kyle John, 22 next February, should be considered as an adequate replacement if Patterson's injury is considered as bad as first believed.

Many others would prefer Coleman, but he lacks the pace and stamina to get up and down on the right side.

Brent Stephens
117 Posted 23/09/2022 at 12:53:39

I don't think Kyle John has been on the bench or played for the first team yet.

If any U21 were to be put at right-back as a temporary measure, it could be Mills??

Garry Martin
118 Posted 23/09/2022 at 13:04:50
Typical EFC luck, tides turn for the better and we get 2 key players injured (Pickford &Patterson).


Michael Connelly
119 Posted 23/09/2022 at 14:34:03
As well as he has played this season, it looks like he's a bit of a sicknote, and he may not be the long-term solution for the right-back position.

Thelwell will be on the lookout for right-backs that don't get injured, like he was for durable centre-backs this summer.

Jeff Armstrong
120 Posted 23/09/2022 at 14:58:46
Rob 19, took 100 comments, but you were right.
Rob Halligan
121 Posted 23/09/2022 at 15:09:08
Jeff, and roughly 43 hours before the first one! It really does begger belief how someone who has suffered two injuries, two separate injuries at that, can suddenly be labelled a “Sicknote”. Still, it was bound to happen, just surprised it took so long!
Mike Gaynes
122 Posted 23/09/2022 at 15:13:58
Nailed it, Rob. There's always one in the crowd.

Also astonishes me how people want to plug in untried rookies or out-of-position teenagers for a vital defensive role... instead of the club captain who helped keep us up.

Seamus will be just fine. He's 34, not 64. Geez.

Brent Stephens
123 Posted 23/09/2022 at 15:21:37
"Thelwell will be on the lookout for right-backs that don't get injured."

Has sports science developed to a point where it's able to predict that a player won't get injured?! Really?! Those sports scientists must be big earners if they can do that.

Kieran Kinsella
124 Posted 23/09/2022 at 15:42:30
I heard Alistair Crowley is going to do an ancient ceremony to try and revive the mummified remains of Coleman.

Meanwhile, Frank said pre-season "hopefully Patts can step up until Seamus is fit." Which implies that he saw Coleman as the starter.

Since then obviously Patts more than stepped up and put Seamus on the bench. Therefore, there should be few qualms about Seamus "stepping in".

Mike Gaynes
125 Posted 23/09/2022 at 16:18:53
Wonder why we haven't heard anything... it's been almost 48 hours. Maybe he couldn't get an appointment for the doctor?

Certainly different in the US... if a player is hurt in an evening game the coach has an update for his morning press conference.

Michael Connelly
126 Posted 23/09/2022 at 16:41:46

Appearance record for Conor Coady in the Premier League:

18-19 - 38
19-20 - 38
20-21 - 37 (couldn't play the one game due to + covid test)
21-22 - 38

Appearance record for James Tarkowski in the premier league:

18-19 - 35
19-20 - 38
20-21 - 36
21-22 - 35

Not much science required to predict how likely players are to get injured and why those 2 were drafted in, and why Thelwell will be eyeing up right-backs if that is another serious injury for Patterson.


Steavey Buckley
127 Posted 23/09/2022 at 16:45:40
Brent #117,

Kyle John has played in preseason matches for the first team, and looks a far better prospect than Coleman, who has slowed down considerably.

Joe McMahon
128 Posted 23/09/2022 at 16:55:30
Steavey, correct and we have been hindered by Seamus continuing international football, when players such as Paul Scholes retired from the international games to concentrate on his club aiding his fitness.
Brent Stephens
129 Posted 23/09/2022 at 17:12:34
Michael #126 yes, comprende. It was just the possible implication that past good record of injury would mean that the future would be equally injury-free. We just can't predict these things.

"It looks like he's a bit of a sicknote, and he may not be the long-term solution for the right-back position." I can't see from his past record that he's had injury issues. Did he have issues at his previous club?

Jeff Armstrong
130 Posted 23/09/2022 at 17:21:01
Paul Bracewell

Stoke 80-81-40 games

“. 81-82 -42 games

“. 82-83 -41 games

Sunderland 83-84 - 38 league games(less teams)

Everton 84-85 - 37 league games

“ 85-86 - 38 league ga

It just takes 1 tackle from a shithouse like Billy Whitehurst to sideline a virtual ever present for the next 2 seasons.

Kieran Kinsella
131 Posted 23/09/2022 at 17:29:40

I remember Man Utd fans saying Giggs was a sicknote when he was 19 or 20. Thought it was better to give time to Lee Sharpe. How right they were to write off that useless Giggsy…

Brent Stephens
132 Posted 23/09/2022 at 17:54:36
Steavey #127

"Kyle John has played in preseason matches for the first team".

Ah, ok. I'd forgotten about that. I actually like Kyle John, Steavey; love the way he bombs forward down that right wing – though if he were to step into the first team, I'm sure he'd be told to sit.

"and looks a far better prospect than Coleman, who has slowed down considerably."

[I know you didn't mean it this way but...] I'm sure Coleman is no longer a prospect! I watched Coleman play the first 45 minutes in a U21 game earlier in the season and, even though still regaining fitness, he stood out a mile.

Jeff and Kieran - quite.

My question at #129 is serious (Michael) - I can't see anything about previous injuries for Patterson at Rangers. Am I missing something?

Bill Watson
133 Posted 23/09/2022 at 19:51:26
Kieran. #131

He was for Wales and then had the cheek to manage them!

Kieran Kinsella
134 Posted 23/09/2022 at 19:58:24

That is certainly true.

Steve Daniells
135 Posted 23/09/2022 at 21:57:03
Any updates on Patterson? Guessing it's a couple of days for swelling to go down before they can properly assess the extent of the injury.
Michael Connelly
136 Posted 23/09/2022 at 22:57:22

He's only been with us since January and this will, by the looks of it, be his second extended period out of the side. His durability surely has to come into question on that basis. Don't think he played that much for Rangers.

A previously good injury record is no guarantee of avoiding future injury, but it sure improves your chances of it. In the same way that a previously bad injury record makes a future injury more likely. I will use Yerry Mina as Exhibit A for that last statement.

Mike Gaynes
137 Posted 24/09/2022 at 00:28:27
"A previously good injury record is no guarantee of avoiding future injury, but it sure improves your chances of it."

Does it? Why?

Michael Connelly
138 Posted 24/09/2022 at 07:50:15
Probability, Mike
Brent Stephens
139 Posted 24/09/2022 at 09:18:09
Michael #136 - yes, Michael, I think you're right. I'd forgotten that other injury.

But I do hate that term "sicknote". Usually used to imply somebody is faking it. I know you don't mean it that way.

Jeff Armstrong
140 Posted 24/09/2022 at 09:23:16
I remember his last injury for us, and I don't think he's a sick note. Good or bad injury records are mostly based on luck, or mitigating circumstances like build and running style (Mina).

Patterson is 21? Far too young to be labelled as injury prone.
Si Cooper
141 Posted 24/09/2022 at 17:44:04
"A previously good injury record is no guarantee of avoiding future injury, but it sure improves your chances of it."

That depends on how you are defining future injury .

If you mean one that is a recurrence or consequence of previous injury, or from some sort of physiological abnormality that makes an individual more at risk, then it's obvious.

If you mean an injury that is completely unrelated to previous ones, then it's just not true.

I think most people would judge there is just not enough clear data available on Patterson to start making conclusions. If the two injuries are unrelated, there is no pattern.

Rob Halligan
142 Posted 26/09/2022 at 20:47:14
Surprised that nobody has posted about the length of time Patterson could be out for (Not that I can see anyway).

Several reports, including one from the Red Echo, indicate that Patterson will be out for up to 6 weeks. Seeing as this pretty much takes us up to the break due to the World Cup, it does look like he will be back in time for the return of the Premier League on Boxing Day.

Everton games Nathan Patterson could miss after injury diagnosis reported

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