Transition for Some... But Not For Me!

Time will tell how good RM is as a manager, but like our FM he will have to find players nurture them and sell them, that as much as anything will define RMs tenure as manager. Because we have to buy small and sell big otherwise there is no transfer kitty and if we stop doing this then when that happens there is only one outcome, we will be in the relegation battles.

But first thing to do is get to 40 points and quickly and let RM develop the team. I never felt through DM's pragmatism that he had any plans to build a team and due to chasing the holy grail of European football, he never had the opportunity to test out different strategies.

RM will have to muster a greater sense of urgency out of the current crop of players and get them to play with a passion in every game and not just the ones that they feel like performing.

I'm going to wait and see where we are and how we're playing at the end of October before getting over-excited one way or the other.

Got to agree about Jagielka especially, it was mental torture for him having to pass rather than hoof it yesterday - great defender, but doubt very much he will ever be a ball playing centre-half.

Kone should be judged after a run of games though, or are we writing players off after an hour now?

I thought Mirallas, Osman & Pienaar were all very poor on Saturday, yet we still dominated that game.

But I think you're about my age and may remember how much stick some of the players took if it looked as if we weren't going to mount a serious challenge for the League in the mid to late 80s, we never envisaged how bad it would get and how far off revisiting those days we really are.

As for City, I was very surprised that they lost yesterday, it might just be one of those seasons this year, I hope not because the Devil's spawn are getting results and they might do a Derby and sneak in amongst all the big boys - so as much as DM is not my favourite person, I don't want his team to get clobbered next week and I certainly don't want the other lot to re-emerge as proper challengers.
That would be truly unbearable.

Its going to be much harder for Martinez then it is for Rodgers, because Brenda is backed by his board and has been able to splash the cash and build a squad much quicker.

I don't think Kone is in anyway a tap in merchant. He's very much an all round striker, he can cause defenders lots of problems with his pace and trickery(remember him destroying Heitinga last season). He can create chances for others like he did when playing along side DI Santo. I really hope he starts our next game.

As for how we improve the team with this Board - haven't a clue.

Malky McKay was my second choice (Moyes on roller skates) and Phelan and his German mate would have done a job.

All the above are no nonsense guys who have won things and don't talk in riddles.

But it's only my opinion.I respect your thinking of Roberto as the second coming. Lets hope he is !

- RM is never going to enjoy that kind of luxury whilst Arkright is in charge. Instead he's going to largely have to make do with what he has, and use the meagre transfer funds at his disposal wisely. Unless there's a big sale. Sound familiar?

In terms of player assessments, agree with most of what you say, but think you're a tad harsh on:
- Jags - showed in some England games that he can pass. At Everton he needs someone to pass to, and in Gibson's absence the option is often the HOOOOOOOOOF!
- Kone - definitely not a tap-in merchant! He's got pace to burn, and whilst he has that, he will be a threat in many more situations than Jelavic will ever be.
- Deulofeu - why take him on loan if you're not going to give him game time? James Martin's description of him makes him sound like a slightly better and younger version of Drenthe. I think he will be useful, mainly as a sub, and possibly when we need to play more on the break - similar to Mirallas, but as we've already seen with our number 11, he blows hot and cold too.
- I also wouldn't write off Heitinga just yet. He may fit better into the RM style than most, and may yet enjoy some sort of Indian Summer with us.

Overall I think it'll be evolution rather than revolution. Finances dictate we can't hope to do much else, until this deluded billionaire that Bill dreams of turns up to pay grossly over the odds and take us forward.

Thought-provoking piece though!

I don't think it is much of a problem for Coleman, Barkley, Distin, Pienaar, Baines, Fellaini, Kone, Gibson - hence we have dominated possession.

Mirallas hasn't looked his old self at all, Jelavic still seems lost, Osman and Jags seem rusty. And with Jags, that goes for England too.

I'm especially disappointed with Mirallas, I thought he was going to light up this season.

My biggest disappointment is the lack of transfer funds for Martinez. If you get a new manager, you've got to give him a fighting chance to do his thing.

We simply don't have the players or the money for the Roberto project and this transition bollocks could see us in the bottom half by Christmas.I support Roberto but would like some pragmatism.

The squad is not finished and due to dissipate sometime before xmas due to extreme old age
Wholesale changes are not (in my opinion) good for a club, teams need time to gel together. At least we are adding to a resilient squad, a few more and significant additions would be a great stride.

Having Barkley play 2 successive games (one in which he scored a screaming potential winner) is as good as a signing and a breath of hope

The premiership isn't won after 2 games, and neither is Roberto's fate decided by then

Keep yer powder dry Blues, we've had far worse starts to decent seasons during the reign of miseryarse and his silver allergy

He operates much better when Gibson is behind him. That's the current weakness that Roberto is trying to address - cover for the defensive midfield slot.

We look and operate as a good outfit with Gibson, Fellani and Barkley in midfield and Kone will start to score us a few goals. Finish the season 8th-10th and then he can start to wheel and deal to get in some players more suited to his style.

Your main objection appears to be because he was relegated with Wigan.

Wigan let their best players go to bigger clubs each year, and he had to replace them with players costing £2m with the odd £5m player, I wonder how Fergerson at Utd would have fared selling his 3 best players each year and replaced by inferior ones. Sounds familiar!
He made £15m on his transfers while there( I've checked ), shudder to think what deficit the Chelsea managers have run up in 4 years.

Your main objection appears to be because he was relegated with Wigan.

Wigan let their best players go to bigger clubs each year, and he had to replace them with players costing £2m with the odd £5m player, I wonder how Fergerson at Utd would have fared selling his 3 best players each year and replaced by inferior ones. Sounds familiar!
He made £15m on his transfers while there( I've checked ), shudder to think what deficit the Chelsea managers have run up in 4 years.

Our build up is painfully slow and no amount of possession, unless it hurts the opposition, is going to open up defences. So, in summary, until we inject some pace and incision into the team, I don't see that things are going to change very much. The first two games of the season could well have been played out under Moyes. The only difference that I have seen is Fellaini playing in a more withdrawn role, which quite honestly, might suit him in certain teams that play in a certain way, but it doesn't suit the way Everton normally play - which, given the lack of pace, involves getting the ball forward as directly as possible for Fellaini to knock the ball down for supporting players.

In summary, I don't expect Martinez to be able to change much until he gets the money to change the personnel. Perhaps Fellaini should be sacrificed (not literally!) in order to start the process of evolution. It's clear that with the existing team that we don't have the wherewithal to consistently hurt the opposition at pace from midfield.

So true Ged. Martinez must get rid of the attitude of going to Old Trafford just 'hoping to get out alive'. He must also rid the club of this type of attitude that Moyes took with him to Anfield, Stamford Bridge and Highbury/Emirates. This is going to take more than two games.

As a supporter, I am saddened to hear Moyes speak as he does as it now proves what many thought of his 'Frankie Howard' tactics. I would love to know Bill Kenwright's views when hearing the man he supported spout such shite. He's insulted everything about MY club with his loser attitude.

Fuck you, Moyes, you have shown what you really are.

The first eleven from the last two games, with the exception of Barkley, is Moyes' team, with all that comes with it in terms of ethos and style. Expecting Martinez, or any manager with a different style and ethos, to suddenly chance things around is nonsense. But, then again try telling any football fan to be objective and not subjective.

Complaining after two games may allow me to vent my frustrations post match day, but I can't really complain until I see what use Martinez makes of squad players who never got a go under Moyes, and by extension what way he uses of this squad as a whole to try out his new style.

Take Barkley for example. I think that him getting two full games rather than ten minutes here and there has made him seem more like a proper squad player now rather than just a bit part player. Joking aside, and I know how this reads, I do think he is like a new player in ways. While not the be all and end all, it does seem to give our midfield another option. That is one positive that I can already give Martinez credit for. Who knows, Kone getting two or three proper competitive games in a row may show him to be a excellent option and something to also be positive about.

In terms of introducing more players, and developing from within, the cup game on Wednesday can't come quick enough. I think it could give Stones a chance to impress, as well as Oviedo and Lundstram. It will also give Martinez a proper chance to see what he has and what he can do with them. Another favourable draw, if we win on Wednesday, will give players not used to the starting eleven the chance to stake a claim, get used to playing first team games and also give both the manager and fans confidence.

Unfortunately, we do not have the luxury that Liverpool have in terms of being able to spend our way through a season of transition. It will mean promoting from within, or selling to buy. But, hey that's what we're used to. I will just have to be patient and give Martinez the time to do his take on this.

What the OP is actually seems to be saying is that Moyes left us with an aging squad. Thanks for that. BTW have you noticed OFM now speaks of himself in the third perso ?. I thought only the reigning monarch did that, but it now obviously is used by hypocrites too.

RM's biggest problem is his Chairman. Interesting times ahead in the run up to the Transfer window closing as RM tries to stop BK lifting his skirts for Manure and his first love Davie M; who apparently he still speaks to all the time. Nice

Far easier producing basic hoofball and the cagey stuff to protect their multi million pound jobs.

Martinez deserves support just for showing some courage - massive job ahead.

"Fellaini for Welbeck"?????? (David, 171). He may have scored two last week but Danny Welbeck's scoring record is actually a little poor isn't it? There are many promising young strikers I would have before him (as if we actually have a choice!). I suppose we all see players differently depending on our own personal bias.

On that subject, I am surprised that Peanuts seems to have slipped under the radar during our last two games. He may be working hard and ever-willing, but his final ball / decision making at the crucial moment has seemed woeful to me. He is not alone in that unfortunately and I think RM has been very unfortunate that the players haven't seriously threatened with a higher percentage of the opportunities that the possession and pressure has yielded.

What RM is attempting to do is turn OFM's modus operandi inside out. Despite his respectful comments and diplomatic tone he is putting an 11-year-in-the-making footballing strategy to the sword.

Ergo, technique and control comes first (and at all costs), which can/will be honed as the tempo rises (al la Bayern Munich). Tempo will only increase as players reach a level of comfort with possession. By comfort the very least I mean is not falling over or twisting out of shape while trying to play simple, fluid football.

And that brings us back to personnel. Do we posses the right personnel to reach the requisite 'comfort on the ball', before upping the tempo to a devastatingly effective level? Ged has nailed that one in the OP.

What we are left with is a debate as to the merits of the possession first strategy (initial slow tempo so as to drive the 'possession' mantra so far down the players throats that they dare not lose the ball).

My guess is that it will take two seasons of RM indoctrination before we unleash hell on this league. And for that I can wait.

The RS did better last year under Rodgers than under Clown Kenny.

Managers of rich clubs with strong squads find it much easier to drop popular players for all the obvious reasons.

There again, Jurgen Klinsmann had the same problem as Martinez when he took over the USA squad. The players couldn't adapt, they lost games and the fans started to turn against him.

This is all from memory and I can't remember the exact details but he put his foot down. Hard. He even dropped the star player Landon Donovan for lack of discipline and letting himself get out of condition.

He now rules with an iron fist and woe betide anyone who doesn't put in a full shift or gives the ball away needlessly.

They are now enjoying a long winning streak and are heading to Rio full of confidence.

None of these guys are £20 mil superstars. They are decent footballers who work for the team, don't give the ball away and follow Klinsmann's orders to the letter.

Maybe it'll take a few bad results to stir Martinez into action. Too many players in a blue shirt are aimlessly strolling. Compared to the verve and tenacity of Shane Long, our lads hardly broke sweat against West Brom and it was nothing to do with the new system.

The "shipping out and shipping in" approach isn't an option, we just don't have the cash flow

So, Roberto coaches who we do have to do what he envisages, and we accept (as he does) that this will not be instantaneous

We all want improvement but improvement frequently requires removal before replacement and upgrade, and in football that also includes practice to fine tune

Our players may be paid a "Kings Ransom", that doesn't mean that as soon as Roberto draws a few diagrams on the chalkboard that they'll ALL go out and tippy-tappy and shimmy past the next half dozen opponents scoring a bagfull each week !
And given that even if Roberto had £500M to immediately go out and buy his fantasy dream team they would still need to "bed in"

After 11 years of "stability", maybe we are a little "set in our ways", heaven knows how it must feel to have a new manager after 25 extremely successful years !
Bloody agonising, is my hope !

Brendan Rodger has done what seems to be a good job at Liverpool in the year he has been in the job. He had a plan, an idea of how he wanted the team to play, spent a year getting the squad to play the way he wanted and now, from what I have seen, they are playing good football and have won the first two games of the season.

If Martinez is going to be successful he is going to need the same sort of time and support (He is never going to get the financial backing though).

In the first two games there has been a noticeable difference in the passing play, even if it is not producing better results.

his two outstanding players now are Sturridge and Coutinho, £ 20 mill for the 2, lets see what RM could do with the same cash

so I agree with you lets give him time and hopefully some backing...

If our manager had the money to spend that Rodgers has, our transition would be much quicker and have a greater chance of success.
He's attempting the impossible to change Moyes team into a different animal, especially with some of the shall we say mature players.
With this present ownership the clubs best path to take, is an all out attempt to produce our own players through the youth system.
I'm sure RM will try to do that the Spanish way, where control of the ball is a prerequisite before anything else.
Ok, this is not an original idea, but I'm talking of at least doubling the resources available to the youth system and bringing in 1 or 2 foreign coaches.
Obviously this will only pay off some time in the future with the younger kids, but increasing the emphasis on skill for the more mature youths can only be for the good for Everton in the short term.

Two games, six points and now people are starting to say Brenda's patience (not to forget his splurging of loads of dosh) has come to fruition. Wait until they play a decent side and Sturridge or Coatman gets injured.

I like the way he has tried, very successfully so far, to keep the squad together and hasn't come in and made sweeping changes that could upset the solid team Moyes put together. He has had little choice to stick with players like Osman as there is little money to replace them with. He has suffered the usual injury to Gibson that has highlighted our weakness in that area. On the other hand he has shown great faith in Barkley and within two matches helped him into the England squad. Mirallas can, and will, improve and I expect Kone to take over the lone striker role from Jelavic soon.

I have been impressed with some aspects of our game, but there is clearly improvements needed, both from the players and from Roberto himself. I hope he learns that only sending three up for corners when we really need a goal at home is not the way to go. I know it's early days but the meltdown of our defence that many feared has not materialized. It is the attacking side of his tactics that many were looking forward to seeing that has been lacking. We need to get more players in the box when attacking, especially when our two fullbacks are capable of providing such excellent service.

Obviously the midfield needs strengthening. I do see Fellaini as a dominant defensive midfielder, but when required we need the players to take over that role so he can be pushed further up the pitch, much like Man City do with Yaya Toure. I hope for one or two additions to the midfield by the deadline, even if they are only loans, so that we can be more flexible with Fellaini and Barkley and so that we don't have to play Osman in such a deep role.

I for one still have faith in our new manager, but I'm realistic enough to realise it may take some time before he has us running like a well oiled machine.