Funes Mori to undergo surgery on injured knee

We now have two creaking old center halves and one promising but still developing centre-back who may be deployed at right-back. Perhaps now would be a good time to give Pennington a run out.

At least Lallana has been ruled out of the derby. Henderson is doubtful too.

They are both starters for them, so it's pretty even on the injury front and no excuse for a poor performance.

Davies, Schneiderlin (if fit), Gana
Ross
Lukaku

To complete the team!! We need to adopt a siege mentality for this one!

I'm inclined to agree. Liverpool could smash the geriatric pairing. But will Koeman be more concerned with that? Or the risk of throwing a youngster into the derby day cauldron?

The first half of this season I'd say he pick Jags/Williams but now I'm not so sure. He was bold enough to blood Davies and Lookman so maybe he will take a chance with a younger guy.

We're now short of two likely defenders and two midfielders.

Three at the back against their pace is dangerous. I'm thinking seriously about taking Monday off.

Not sure Jags and Williams are going to be able to keep them out. I think we should attack with reckless abandonment and just roll the dice.

Which is why I'd make a terrible manager. Hopefully Koeman will come up with a tactical masterclass, and hopefully whoever plays will play out of their skins for Seamus.

Baines, William, Pennington, Holgate
Gana, Davies, Barkley
Mirallas, Lookman
Lukaku

Stekelenburg
Browning Holgate Williams Baines
Gana Davies Barkley
Valencia Lukaku Mirallas

Anyway, Everton held the RS well in the last game and they only scored at the end, as they usually do.

Everton have to get to them early and ram the advantage home. They rely heavily on Coutinho and Mane so get them bottled up and with Lallana out, we have a chance.

We can use that money to build a flood barrier for the new stadium.

Lookman or miralas in for calvin-lewin only other possibility.

Barry has to be sub at best only to be used to keep our lead if we have one.

Valencia, Pennington, Stekelenburg etc as subs.

I'd prefer Coleman, Funes Mori, Bolasie and McCarthy all to be fit enough to give us a headache but shit happens.

That just tells me we should just bombard them with crosses... bloody shame Koeman has released all the wide men.

Koeman has some massive decisions to make for the derby. Jags and Williams at the back would mean not much pace, sitting back to deny space behind but difficult to high press as a team. Introducing the pace that youngsters like Holgate and Pennington can give is attractive but the lack of experience could tell.

Apart from CB there is the RB issue and at LB I expect Baines to be occupied by Mane which curtails his offensive. So the supply forward has got to come from other sources. Hopefully Schneiderlin is fit to play alongside Gana and Davies and scrap in the middle.

Then there's a mixture of Mirallas, Lookman or Calvert-Lewin supporting Barkley with a massive point to prove Southgate should have played him and Lukaku who can get something out of their defence.

It might not be pretty but I'd love us to put a shift in and turn over the media darlings.

Jags is nearing his end with us but I think he could do the job for us on Saturday. We couldn't risk putting Pennington or Browning for their first match in ages. Although Pennington would have to make the bench. This forced move could be a silver lining in this cloud. He's a good prospect.

I wouldn't go near Lennon in the starting 11; Holgate is a better defender and a better attacking full back. Fingers crossed that Morgan is fit, if he is combined with their losses we can win... not sneak a draw, but win the match. We've got to be positive or else we'll get nothing.

On a positive note I watched Logan, very good movie, I highly recommend it. 😝

This is where Koeman earns his millions, a sound game plan and have the players up for the challenge. Any player picked has a opportunity to cement a place for the rest of the season and secure a starting place for next season.

Ross and Rom to be on target 3 -1 to the blues... There you go positive mentality...

What? FFS, give it a rest. He showed the loyalty to the badge certain posters on here want or require of all players, so stop knocking him.

As for Tom Bowers, right, because South America produces no good footballers. BTW, how far exactly did Coleman travel? Should you just limit the distance to the outskirts of Liverpool then? I swear, the comments on here just get dumber and dumber but yours wins the gong award.

What was the Belgian trip to Russia all about? A friendly when all the major leagues are approaching the crucial stage of the season? Ffs.

I just wonder if there is any casualties over at Mordor?

Put Lukaku and Valencia up-top; Holgate right-back; Barkley right midfield; Jagielka and Williams centre-backs; Gana and Davis central midfield; Mirallas left midfield... with both wide players given instructions to put the ball in the box early.

Beckham has made a life out of doing that; I've not once saw him run past a full back. Doing this, you'll be deep enough to help out our defenders, it might be boring but who cares if we beat Liverpool playing this way?

As far as the derby goes, and concerns about the lack of pace at the back, I could have my wires crossed but I was of the understanding that Jags was one of the fastest players in the club? I would certainly play him in this match, and also play Kenny at right back.

Provided Schneiderlin is fit, I have no concerns about the rest of the team. We still have options in midfield and plenty of fire power up front.

My team would be (checked to make sure I haven't tried to sneak a 12th man in, Michael):

Robles,
Kenny, Jagielka, Williams, Baines
Gueye, Schneiderlin, Davies,
Barkley, Mirallas
Lukaku

Plenty of good options on the bench – Lookman, Calvert-Lewin, Valencia, Lennon, Holgate.

I would have no qualms about playing Davies and Kenny. They will be up for it.

Baines. Jagielka, Williams, Holgate, Kenny.

Let's hope it's nothing serious; get fit soon RFM.

As Charlie Lloyd notes above, I expect them to try and go at Baines through Mane, and Leighton will need help. We obviously have to set ourselves up astutely but I think Koeman will do that and we absolutely must not go there on our knees.

I would have played 5 at the back

Kenny, Holgate, Williams, Funes Mori, Baines

But now will probably go 4 at the back:

Robles
Holgate, Jagielka (c), Williams, Baines
Idrissa, Schneiderlin, Davies
Mirallas, Barkley
Lukaku

Subs: Stekelenburg, Pennington, Kenny, Barry, Lookman, Calvert-Lewin, Valencia.

We are a little short in midfield cover but Barkley can drop deeper if necessary... Pennington & Kenny are both capable enough off the bench, in my opinion.

Hopefully Schneiderlin is fit – if not; Barry in for him and Walsh on the bench.

Think positive, Blue Boys – I'll be there on Saturday praying for a repeat of that great performance all those years ago. COYB

This might be a bit of compensation against our 2 injuries.

Just a thought? Any of you got the flu? Maybe go shake Mane's hand, eh?

Totally agree... now pass it on to the Blue Army at Anfield on Saturday.

How does 'kissing the badge', after needlessly getting sent off and dragging your teammates deeper into the shit, demonstrate "loyalty" to anything other than the latent desire to cover your own arse and a liking for amateur dramatics?

It was nothing more than shameful playing-up to the crowd in an attempt to convince them he hadn't just pissed all over their shoes.

The fact some lapped it up is bemusing. Since when do people go around beating their chest after dropping a bollock and how does it in anyway make the act itself, or the consequences, any 'better' or easier to bear?

It would have been a far greater display of 'loyalty to the cause' if he could have concentrated on not acting like a self-destructive loon and did his best to stay on the pitch.

As for those now worrying about a lack of pace at the back after his loss? Since when has Funes Mori been faster than Jagielka? He moves like a disorientated Daddy Long Legs after it's just been lamped by a fucking dish cloth half the time.

Oh and, no, none of the above means I'm "pleased Funes Mori is injured", but it does mean I'm not exactly gutted, cursing the God's or looking for a ready made excuse just in case we rollover far too easily on Saturday once again.

I'm also not bothered he's out for the derby (from a selection point of view). I find the general feeling towards Jagielka baffling. He's getting on alright but isn't he one of the quicker players at the club? If he could just stop giving away silly penalties, we'd be sorted.

The team more or less picks itself depending on whether Schneiderlin and McCarthy are fit.

Less whingeing and talk of "just our luck".

2-0 to the blues.

Robles
Holgate Jagielka Williams Baines
Gueye Schneiderlin Davies
Barkley Lukaku Mirallas

Subs: Stekelenburg, Kenny, Pennington, Barry, Calvert-Lewin, Lookman, Valencia.

Martin Nicholls (#51) – I was at that game also. As you say Andy Rankin played a blinder and pulled off one of the best saves I have ever seen in my life from a shot by Roger Hunt. Here it is (have a look at the state of their midden).

Link

I can remember being very worried we would get hammered before the game – but, as Ken would say – oh the joy!

Much merriment was to follow in Tarleton Street that night.

But that was then and this is now – we need a win against this shower. I am convinced that the next time we beat them (this weekend) will see us on then road back to the glory days of the sixties.

Besides Kevin and Delboy scoring, there was this:

"Elsewhere, Dominic Calvert-Lewin scored for his English youth side against Senegal, helping them to a 2-0 victory in the Four Nations Tournament. Ademola Lookman registered an assist in the game as well."

It's been a bad few days for Coleman, McCarthy and now Funes Mori but Deulofeu must be delighted with himself since his move to Milan. I was shocked he got picked for the Spanish squad but to come on as a sub and actually score will give his confidence a huge boost. His girlfriend must be due to have their baby soon too so life is looking up for Geri... though you would worry he won't want to come back to England now and it will be interesting to see if Barca show interest in taking him back now he's pushing for the Spanish team. I think he wants to stay with Milan.

Mirallas also scored a penalty last night for Belgium which will help his confidence for Saturday.

It's hard to believe we've not won an Anfield since 1999. We had Barmby, Xavier and Hutchinson all in our team that year. When you look at our team back then and compare it to now, you would imagine we have a better chance now but it depends how we approach the game.

Everton last beat Liverpool at Anfield in 1999... Sportsmail looks at what became of the men who played all those years ago.

Would a player dare to do that now? In those days the relationship was a little more 'polite' (tongue in cheek)... years before the RS fans ruined our chances of the European Cup with their crap behaviour!

Time to get back the Mojo!

With Coleman and Funes Mori now out, that's a large chunk of weekly wage – cash being spent by the club on players who were injured not playing for EFC.

We loan out a winger who can't get a game for us but he makes his international debut for Spain and scores. We sell a 20-year-old midfield player to Oxford for a nominal fee and within 6 months he has been nominated as Football League Player of the Year.

Then we have a whole host of contributors to TW who include Ashley Williams in their suggested line ups. When will people realise that he is useless. That isn't an opinion, it is a fact. Slow, can't head a ball and can't pass to save his life so why is he anywhere near the first team?

Who do you play centre-back then?

Holgate's playing right back, most likely.

"The governing body's Club Protection Programme enables teams to claim up to 𧴨,731 (€143,836) per week of a player's wages if he is injured while on international duty."

FIFA to pay Seamus Coleman's Everton wages while out with broken leg

"He is useless. That isn't an opinion, it is a fact".

Guess there's no point in debating then.

Adversity is what we have faced before and let's hope Morgan is fit.

I hope Funes Mori makes a swift recovery but this may be a mixed blessing for us: good if Holgate plays.

Seamus is a big loss but we won't lose the derby due to not having Funes Mori available. Would anyone have thrown a half-fit McCarthy in anyway?

Any update on Schneiderlin yet?

Regardless, we'll put out a team that is capable of winning there against the odds. Let's not forget, we have the most effective English player and the league's top scorer. We've got a bloke in midfield that covers enough ground for two or three men.

Come on, you Blues!

Time we, as fans, put the boot on the other foot, turned the telescope around and focused on what threat we pose to them for a change?

For the majority of the last 10 to 15 years, we all know we should at least have shared the spoils with the rag bag assortment of players they have put in front of us. Instead, we've showed them far too much respect and allowed their 'reputation' to continually intimidate us.

Same thing this time. But they have Henderson and likely, Lallana missing and although Mane, Coutinho and Firmino are lively, they are not Messi, Suarez and Neymar.

Wolves, Southampton, Swansea, Leicester and Hull have beaten them convincingly out of the 10 games they have played this year and they've only won three.

We, meanwhile, have won six and drawn two over the same period, losing in a freak performance to Leicester and by a similar one goal margin to Spurs.

We have the league's top scorer, backed up by Ross Barkley and the most exciting youngster to debut this year in Tom Davies.

We have the league's best tackler in Gana and if Schneiderlin is fit, we can surely boss the midfield against the likes of Can, Lucas and Wijnaldum, for goodness's sake?

So let's get some perspective here when it comes to who should be more worried about who?

If we, the fans, don't have confidence in our team, how can we expect the players themselves to have any?

I'm thoroughly fed-up of this 'we are not worthy' approach to those arrogant Anfield arseholes.

Time to think positive. Play to our strengths. Exploit their obvious weaknesses and go for it, not sit back and try to eke it out.

Believe, Blues. We are better than them right now. Get out there and show that we're a club that's ambitious to go places – elbowing the likes of the Gobshites aside on the way.

Clearly I'm keeping my cards close to my chest on that one.

If I did rate him, it certainly wouldn't be on the back of a bravura display of "loyalty to the badge" such as him... err... licking it, during a walk of shame, after stupidly wellying a Red Shite and waving goodbye to any remote chance of us getting something out of the game, or for him bring selected for Argentina.

If I were to hold him in high esteem, it would be on account of his actual performances, while on the pitch (not while taking his leave from it), for Everton alone. In that respect, he has been decidedly hit and miss.

Give him his due, since regaining a starting place this season, he had been half-decent, but then came the Spurs game and a 30-minute spell of absolute fucking insanity the likes of which I don't recall ever seeing from an International centre-half before. He was doing perfectly fine one minute and the next he was all over the shop and got steadily worse and worse as the pressure was cranked up. He was shocking.

If we were to come under the cosh on Saturday, would you have full confidence in Funes Mori standing firm in the face of it, remaining composed and running no risk of a repeat performance?

I worry I wouldn't be able to unclench my arse for a week if it was a matter of watching to find out.

Always split by him. But Jags worries me more these days... Hope I am wrong.

Only two games that I get sick with worry over in a season, and both are against the Red Shite. Behind the couch for me on Saturday – no radio, no TV, and my son with strict orders: "Don't come near me with scores unless it's a blue win or a draw."

I share your nervousness with regard to Funes Mori. The journos were yacking on about six months ago about Barcelona wanting him, but that seems to have died down. Some of his passing manoeuvres from defence have me reaching for the Rennies (or worse). One thing he does bring though is a genuine threat when we get a corner.

I see him as a poor man's Derek Mountfield: not as good as Degsie in defence; and not the same level of threat up front (anyone remember his 14 goals in a season?)

I used to feel the same level of nervousness about Robles, but he seems to have brought much more consistency to his game of late.

Whatever the final score, I don't want to see the capitulation begin before we have even kicked off, confirmed by an ultra-negative line up. We have nothing to lose as they are no world beaters.

I would like us to assume a 'fuck you' nasty attitude from the off, and by that I don't mean kicking shite out of them from the first minute but a desire to attack them. It seems like a lifetime ago since we didn't look like we were shitting ourselves when we played at Anfield, probably got to go back to Joe Royle's time as manager for that mental approach.

I would play people in their proper positions so, to my mind, that would mean Holgate and Kenny should both start. Of course, it's unlikely to happen as Koeman will probably be desperate to accommodate Barry in the team should Schneiderlin not be fit.

Duffy wasn't good enough, simple as that.

Like several on TW, my main concern is with Williams who can be unreliable in dealing with crosses into the box, Our main threat of course will be Lukaku and he will the target for special attention from the likes of Can & Co, as will Barkley – one hopes his England snub will fire him up,

Just read about young McAleny's second hat-trick for Oxford and his nomination for top player in his league. As far as I know, Geoff (#70), the lad is on loan to them for the season only

I'm not very optimistic for Saturday, but have set my alarm for 6 am as the game is live here in Ontario, at 7 am. Fingers crossed it will be worth watching; I fancy at least one pen could be given. COYB

To Ed, Laurie and others who have Kenny in their preferred starting lineup... I say no thank you. The little lad might have fine potential, but to have him make his starting debut for the first team at Anfield of all places would be lunacy in my opinion. (His only previous first-team appearance was as a sub against Norwich last year, and few of us have seen him except for that.) We can win this game without taking shots in the dark like Kenny.

If Schneiderin is passed fit we have a great chance of getting a result, I keep hearing Coutinho Mane, what about the form of Schneirderin, Barkley, Gana, Davies, Lukaku.

When was the last time we could have danger players like Lookman, Valencia, Calvert-Lewin, Mirallas fighting to even get into the starting 11.

Which team have only lost one premier league game this year, who are regularly bagging 3 goals.

If the players get rid of the fear factor, without being biased, we have the form team and better all round team than our neighbours.

The only team that will beat Everton on Saturday is themselves, go there believing in themselves and there will only be one result, a win for the Blues.

Forget the hiding behind settees, bad feeling, lady bad luck etc, this is it Blues, our big chance, time to deliver, coyb.

Liverpool will be facing the unknown, Lukaku will be like a raging bull when he comes off the bench.

Liverpool know everything about Lukaku, their game plan will go right out of the window, their tactics will change and that could work in our favour, we need to try something different, catch our neighbours with their kicks down.

It's madness to drop Lukaku, but sometimes you need to try something different, if it goes pearshaped then bring the big guy on earlier, but it might just work trying two in attack.

Williams is without doubt a dubious defender at times but, if there's one reason I'd pick him for Saturday, it would be the fact that the lad does have bottle. We need some attitude. Schneiderlin, Gana and Holgate too for the same reason plus their undoubted ability.

Now if we can see Ross and Rom with some real passion and fight then Saturday could bear some joy. Every season it feels like going to the dentist for an extraction, walking up to that ground. We need the "all clear" before it's dentures all round.

This week we really do have a chance I feel. Gana can stop Coutinho. Schneiderlin is key to our plans. The main thing is the fear factor. It has to stop. No rolling over.

----------------- Robles -----------------
----- Holgate - Williams - Jags ----
Lennon ----------------------- Baines
---- Schneids - Gana - Davies ----
------------------------- Barkley --------
------------- Lukaku --------------------

that when the prematch handshake took place the Everton players were saying "hello" and he was thinking "wtf", basically the game was already won as far as he was concerned because of the mental approach. The players were weak mentally and expected to lose and were too nice. The RS players were wound up and ready to kick ass.

Something that definitely needs to change. I wonder if Koeman has instilled any of that mentality.

Davies. Gana. Schneiderin Barkley

Lookman. Valencia or Calvert-Lewin

Lukaku and Marallas to come off the bench.

I have no doubt Klopp will be working his tactics around attack and isolating Lukaku, throwing two into the mix and their game plan goes down the pan, outfox him.

Can you imagine his face an hour before kick off and we have two strikers, less than an hour to try and rework his game plan.

It could be sheer madness to attempt it, on the other hand it just might work.

Our away form is a concern. Draws against Stoke and a very poor Boro,coupled with albeit a deserved win at Palace hardly fill me with optimism. Let's face it – no matter what we think of them, their a tough side to beat at home and always turn up for the big games. Whereas we don't.

We were totally walloped at Chelsea, overran at Spurs, and lucky at Man City due to the missed penalties. And that alone will tell you where we are as far as big games go.

Talk all the blind optimism you want but the truth is we are fucking petrified of them and that ground of theirs – as 18 years without a win there will tell you. Call me a pessimist all you want; I prefer to call myself a realist. I'm shitting myself for Saturday because I've seen it against them all my life. Nearly 58 now and I doubt if ill see an Everton victory there as long as I live... And how sad is that?

Play him and the Red Shite will be very wary and dare not move too high up the pitch for fear of him getting the chance to run at them.

They don't have a natural goalscorer but we do – we must give him plenty of service... and, if we do, we will win.

So, no surprise to see Argentina floundering in their World Cup qualifying group.

Talk about playing into their hands....

That's fucking insane. Even on here, on the subject of Lukaku.

Brian Wilkinson (#100). Seriously? Going to Anfield with no Lukaku in our first 11, may as well chuck them the 3 points and refund all the away tickets. Their game plan will involve getting the ball and playing around our aged centre backs, which won't be fucking hard. To give us some sort of hope we need our number one striker and top scorer in the Premier League, presently in the form of his life, to give them something to worry about... and that's not Valencia.

I think Holgate will get the nod and that will be fine with me but Jonjoe would also be fine with me. He's 20 years of age and will not let Everton down and will not bottle it – that's for sure.

So your masterplan is to leave our best player on the bench...because they wouldn't be expecting it?!!!

That's genius.

My post clearly states a Plan B: try something different; how does anyone know how two strikers will do there? We've gone there even with our best attacking options and have to go back to Kevin Campbell's goal for our last success.

I simply said give those two a run out, nothing to do with Lukaku being dropped, just a case of a different formation... then, when those two have had the defence chasing, bring Lukaku on to reap the rewards.

If we go with Rom at the start, then we need one of the other strikers alongside him.

I stand by what I said so feel free to correct me on Saturday if we start with Lukaku as a lone striker and he bags a goal or two.

He is liable to be caught for pace or on the turn. With the right partner, he can be very good. Wales got to the semis in the the European Championships. That's way better than England . Ashley Williams is just the player for the derby, but he needs some pace alongside. Jags still has pace, he just needs to stop his eagerness to put a foot in.

Holgate should start on the right, but I would put Lennon in front of him , with a defensive brief. Lukaku has to have Valencia or Calvert-Lewin with him from the start. I'd rather go out on my shield than die hiding under it.

I just hope we go to attack them. Any away game is uphill but I like our chances... we're due.

Their most dangerous player is Mane with his pace and dribbling skill but that is negated when the opposition sits deep.

With our aged centre-halves I would pick a team to defend deep with pace up-front for the direct-ball counter-attack.

Gana, Barry and Davies to sit deep with Coutinho man-marked. Lukaku, Lookman and Mirallas up-top for the breakaway.

Schneiderlin fit gives us a massive chance to take 3pts. It would be great just to view this as another 3 pts... just another match to catch up with the rest above us and get the derby thing out of our heads. We've got a better team than them. Let's just bloody well prove it.

Why don't we start with Jags in goal, he played there for Sheffield United apparently.

Imagine how pissed off Robles will be, imagine his face. He will be steaming mad. By the time we get him on, no-one is going to score one past him.

[See above...]

Last few comments have said if we sit deep we will be overrun – that is why I suggested playing Lookman and one of the other strikers, so we can get behind them.

If we play Lukaku as a lone striker, they will snuff out and ensure he doesn't see much of the ball.

Play the likes of Lookman, Calvert-Lewin or Valencia and we have a chance of not sitting deep but getting behind their back line.

We never seem to start a game til midway through the first half; change might or might not be the answer.

Lukaku coming off the bench at half-time will certainly strengthen our hand.

You are seriously deluded. If your issue is two strikers, play someone alongside him.

Not playing your leading goalscorer and the Premier League's leading goalscorer is just crazy.

What might surprise the fuckers is if we go out and have a go at them for a change.

If an element of surprise is your plan, why not have the players line up before the game and dance to The Macarena?

Their heads will be spinning.

Sorry, Brian, but it's just nuts.

That knocking at your door, it's the fellahs in the white coats wanting a quick word.

You should have stopped at your post @ 92. That was a cracking rallying call and a sentiment I can agree with.

Drop Lukaku? Our best player? The Premier League's leading goalscorer? For the Mersey derby? At Mordor?

Very recently, Wenger tried that for the Arsenal at Anfield and started without his best player, Sanchez. It didn't end well.

For what it's worth, all I can say to you is that I believe I will see the day when we will beat them fair and square at Mordor – and they will be amazed.

Try to imagine the post-match interviews:

Klopp, wide-eyed brushing his hands through his hair and waffling – "I felt alone".

Koeman looking down at the ground with a smile on his face then looking up at the interviewer saying: "That's what we want!"

Never, never, never, give up.

3. Brexit
2. Trump
1. Brian's team selection.

If we managed to hold them or even nick a goal, then having Lukaku and Mirallas come off the bench would make us strong for the second part of the match.

Fair enough with everyone else saying Rom dropped is madness; on that point, then play another striker alongside if need be.

If we play Rom as a lone striker and pack the midfield, we can kiss goodbye to this great chance of getting a result over there.

I hate to be the one telling you this but...

You are in a minority of one.

The past is the past, and it'll repeat itself only if Koeman hasn't learned from past tactical mistakes. I'm hoping he's learning, and that he's instilling a winning mentality.

On the right back position... I just got a memory of Tom Davies running a game from that position in pre-season (or early in the season). Did I imagine that? No idea who it was against either. Could be an option...

His rashness and hot head won't be missed in the derby. I thought he was unlikely to figure anyway.

The team needs to be fit and mobile. Oh what the fuck we doing at centre-back then?

Rephrase, 'fittish & able to walk'. Ultimately Koeman now has the green light to play cautiously with the red carpet excuse of injuries.

The lack of pace at the back will force us to sit deep. Nothing changes for me, I want to see Koeman make a go of this game and show me why he gets paid £6M a year.

Be brave, Ronnie laa.

Extremely well said sir. I watched (by accident) a snippet from the RedShite's equivalent of ToffeeTV last night and I couldn't believe the smugness of the debate:

How many were they going to win by, who in Blue was going to get sent off, would we fill out our miserly ticket allocation, and why should the Council help us secure Bramley-Moore Dock.

And then the hilarity over the potential flood risk of global warming! Come on you blues. As Jack Nicholson's secretary in the film 'Wolf' commented on his new found aggression... "It's about fucking time..."

Up to now, they haven't been able to cope too well with teams who sit back... Commence 'Operation Rope-a-Dope'

Challenge them from the outset.

Personally, I've slipped into over-think mode and have nothing further of any use to offer, without posting about seven different speculative line-ups.

I do think we need to go at it hard, and a little differently, though. With the enforced variables we have due to injuries, belief and team spirit are going to be the most important elements.

Not sure how many times you intend to tell Brian how mad/insane/deluded his idea is, but before your next attempt, you may want to check the number of derby victories The big fella has on his CV.

I'm not advocating Lukaku to be dropped, but it's not as daft an idea as those acting like we don't have any hope at all if he doesn't play. What will you do if he gets an early injury? Stop watching?

Lukaku is having the season of his life, but in football, there has always been more than one way to skin a cat. You need to start imagining life without Lukaku, because, at some stage, he WILL leave.

I'm sure we all hope that's not the plan though.

Selection will be intriguing and tell us a lot about Ronald. As John Piece said... he doesn't have to look too hard for an excuse to go negative... hopefully he's not looking for excuses at all.

Looking at it logically, we're the form team, they're the ones with the pressure on and poor record against non-top six.

I've seen worse Everton teams beat better Liverpool teams. If we play the game rather than the 'mental block', I'm confident.

Thinking caps on... Let's drop Lukaku.

Seen some corkers on here, that's right up there with the best.

Lots of us have long suspected as much; our entire team has been made up of quiet, nice boys and until we get a nasty streak we'll have no chance. He even said it was one of the things he was most proud of in his career, stopping them being bullied by our 'dogs of war'!

The interview is on GOT TV and is a definite eye-opener for anyone interested.

Going in hope rather than expectation – never say die – but normally, we just go there to collect the cash... Oh for a Reid, Bracewell, Labone etc – players who cared.

If it moves... tackle it please... just tackle, and hope for officials' incompetence... but it's on the box, so perhaps, forget it!!!

COYB

It's not time to consider how to play without Lukaku while he's still here and banging in the goals. We need to be focusing on how to create for him opportunities to score. The idea of dropping him is ridiculous. He is on current form one of the top strikers in the league. Whatever tactical plan we have will only work if Lukaku is on the pitch.

When he has gone, we can worry about finding a replacement and moving forward without him. But at the moment, he is here, in the form of his life, aspiring to finish as the league's top scorer, and by far the best we have.

To say that he hasn't been involved in any derby victories is true, but it also applies to our entire current squad apart from Jags, Baines, and Coleman. Lukaku has scored 5 in his last 9 league appearances against them which is far better than most!

Our team has improved, he has improved. He has earned his chance to smash into them in full beast mode. I fully expect him to do so on Saturday.

It's not that we have zero chance without him, we simply have a far greater chance with him. Therefore Brian's suggestion will thankfully not be under consideration.

I recognise the fact that you were not advocating it, and that you were simply stating that it may not be as daft as most of us believe. It is daft and beyond comprehension.

My apologies.

Maybe it's the pasting you got on the other thread from Eugene makes you want to get right back in the saddle.

I considered your viewpoint and reconsidered Brian's post.

On reflection, I still think it's batshit crazy.

She's bound to understand, isn't she?

How fond are you of your testicles? Have you made your will?

Well it is. And of course one day he will leave but I don't think that should influence whether or not he starts the derby!!

Let's see how many who have made me more of a whipping boy than McGeady and Osman put together, post on Saturday if we play a lone striker and Lukaku gets isolated with his hands on his hips.

Lukaku might have a stormer as a lone striker, so too might an alternate two strikers starting. No-one knows, but I will guarantee one thing: if Lukaku gets snuffed out, you can bet your life most posters will be commenting, shite, same old Everton, he did not get the service etc, come Saturday afternoon.

If it goes the other way and we win without the need of Calvert-Lewin, Lookman or Valencia, and Lukaku bags a couple, I will come on ToffeeWeb and apologise to each and everyone of you, it's the least I can do.

And if she did not acquire said bollocks, and was therefore still my auntie, I apologise for suggesting she could have been my uncle.

I think thats the gist of your post @166?

I think you would get a lot of support for 4-4-2. On a number of occasions this season Rom has been left isolated because of our overly defensive set up.

What still doesn't make sense is not having him as one of the two strikers. It's absurd frankly.

Personally I would like to see 4-4-2 with Valencia partnering Rom. They seem to have built a good understanding and sometimes trying to overcome a high press having a willing runner like Valencia running into channels can be effective.

Surprisingly you still seem to be proposing that as an option despite the weight of argument against it. Be prepared to remain the current whipping boy then!

Fortunately though your suggestion is never, ever going to happen.

Lukaku's goals against top 4 sides, not the best, could very well be down to playing only one striker in those games. I've looked at Lukaku's biggest impact and his goals more often than not come in the latter end of matches.

If my suggestion of trying out two forwards and trying something different against a top four side, using Lukaku's strength if needed at half time.

Everyone one else wants Lukaku to start, undroppable, I get that by you all, but we need to try something different, a lone striker against the top 4 is not going to bridge the gap we need, one point is no good, we need maximum points against our neighbours and Man Utd; with that it has to be two strikers.

I'm sick to death of every season, going over the park, rolling over and having our bellies tickled.

It's time to take the game to them, put them on the backfoot; to do that, we need 90 minutes from our players and that includes two attackers.

Forget the lone striker argument, it's just confusing you.

Let's accept for a minute we are going to play two strikers. It's your suggestion that Rom shouldn't be one of the two that is the ridiculous thing.

Firstly, the three players you mention have a grand total of four career Premier League goals between them. Rom has 21 this season including 13 goals in his last 12 games in all comps in 2017.

I think we all agree that we are fed up with our record over there. Let's hope we see something different this Saturday. And if that includes Rom's Blackfoot, all the better.

Excellent, point. We do them at the very death. Great point.

My logic is that we have few options defensively. Hanging out for a narrow win could see us hand out a freebie.

Their defence is dysfunctional. Despite the opinions of many; I feel that Valencia is returned to the player he was when he joined WHU.

Everton, Koeman & Koeman have restored him.

Organise to win. We can. Plus, our Diamond from Wavertree.

I'm sure you would have liked it to be, you've done your level best to try to deem it so, but sorry, you are talking out of your rear end.

I enjoyed the back and forth with Eugene last night. He is a funny man and, although I realise that it was his links that caused a lot of chuckles, I also noticed a lot of people saying they were enjoying the thread too, so I carried on... but only the exceptionally dim or somebody with an axe to grind would deem a couple of funny links in a footy debate a "pasting".

I don't think any of my points were disproven and my main point about Lukaku not enjoying the support of the "overwhelming majority" still, IMO remains incontestable.

I'm always suspicious about people who desperately want to refer back to another thread. I get the feeling they are unsure about their own points and are looking for a diversion. So back to this one.

Take your claim @135 for instance, the one where you gleefully told Brian that he is in "a minority of one". I hate to tell you this, but Its bollocks, utter bollocks and if you believe it you know nothing about this club and the wide range of opinions held by the fans – not just those who want Lukaku gone.

Do I believe Brian is right? Well no, IMO Lukaku represents our most likely source of goals and I want him starting... but the existence and future success of this club does not and will not depend upon one player, Lukaku is no exception. If Brian is talking shite, then the members of the flat earth society who have convinced themselves that we we will fall off the end of the world without Lukaku are talking even more shite.

Garry Lineker scored nearly twice as many as Lukaku, but that didn't stop us absolutely pissing the league when he left. Comments like "whatever tactical plan we have will only work if Lukaku is on the pitch" make me despair.

Lukaku will leave, Mockers and those who think the fortunes of this club rest upon him better start preparing themselves. People like you will feel a huge void in their lives. (What on earth will you talk about?)

Seamus's injury was heart breaking, Funes Mori's and Macca's were bitter blows too, but we need to stop lamenting our outrageously terrible luck, we need to free ourselves of the belief that we are absolutely dependant on any one player, we need to remember (cliché alert) that it still is eleven v eleven.

The last sentence in post #151 may not be an irrefutable fact, but it doesn't half feel like one to me. That's what I'll be taking into Saturday's game.

Obviously any tactical plan to win the game will require Lukaku. Why are you so concerned with life without Lukaku while he is still here? If he goes, then we will replace him.

Life will go on and we will move forward, but right now he is here and is arguably our best player. Any tactical plan should and will revolve around him. So despair away.

I'm always suspicious of people who want to call people by a name no one else uses. It's all a bit passive-aggressive. No-one other than you calls me Mockers. Mocky normally suffices.

When you quote me saying he was 'a minority of one', I was obviously referring to his description of being 'a majority of one'. You know, that context thing.

As it happens I have not yet seen anyone who agrees with his view that Lukaku should be benched on Saturday, not even you. However, there be some other crazed lunatics out there. Maybe with your super attuned hearing, you might have picked up a few at the game last week.

You as usual play the game of telling me what I think. To save you time, let me tell you what I actually think.

We could beat Liverpool without Lukaku.
It is more likely though if he plays.

I expect him to leave this summer. I'd prefer him to stay.

The club continues whatever. There is a chance Lukaku leaving could be to the club's long term benefit.

Hope this all helps.

Looking at the thread. What team and formation would you like to see start on Saturday?

Let's assume Schneiderlin and McCarthy are both fit.

4-3-3

Just read what has been written and stop making such ridiculous assumptions.

I think it's fair to assume that McCarthy won't start, and with Coleman and Mori out, I don't think we can go with 3 centre backs. Holgate will probably play on the right and is unlikely to replicate the attacking threat of Coleman.

I can't see us going two up top with an unsettled defence. I think we'll start with a 4-3-2-1. I'd love to see us take it to them with attacking intent, but I suspect we will begin with caution.

Any formation is, of course, subject to change, and all 3 of Davies, Gueye, and Schneiderlin have shown they aren't afraid to go forward. So a 4-3-2-1 can quickly become 4-1-4-1 or 4-1-3-2 and we have players that can adapt.

I am trying to feel confident but am filled with dread.

I also thought Paul's final paragraph was telling, and for that reason I would play Jonjoe Kenny, who is another scouse kid, who won't give a fuck about Liverpool, or reputations, which is exactly what you need when you're going into games like this?

Hear hear... I'd go:

Robles
Kenny Jagielka Williams Baines
Gueye Schneiderlin Davies Barkley
Valencia Lukaku

I suspect Koeman will go for Holgate and Barry instead of Valencia.

For me, this is a defining game for the coach. We can win, we can win well. They are, in my view, fragile and spineless. This is the day to hurt them. It is time for Ross to be great, it is time for Lukaku to answer every doubter and be a legend.

I would bring Holgate into a back three, and use both Kenny and Baines out wide but I would play them both conservatively. I would play Gana with Davies and then use Barkley just ahead of them, at the point of the triangle, with Kid Calvert-Lewin, playing up-top with Lukaku.

5 defenders, with 2 midfielders looking to break up Liverpool, and then Barkley looking to break-away, and get forward to help the two strikers? Good subs in Mirallas and Valencia because I would expect our forward players to run out of steam!

Graham, it's all about opinions of course, but Liverpool are the most energetic team in the league for me and I think they struggle more when teams deny them space to stop them doing what they are good at, which is essentially running and working very hard?

I do feel it's a big risk to throw Kenny into the Derby at their place for his first senior start this season; however, he is a right back, as for Holgate he looks more comfortable at center back, he didn't look too convincing out on the right when we went to Stoke.

Jonjoe's been at Everton, for a long time, and he was brought up about half a mile from both grounds, so I would imagine that he would fuckin love to roll up his sleeves, and have a good go at Liverpool?

We can talk all we want on ToffeeWeb but alls I want from every Everton player is to give what you say, Andy... give everything, and if they do, then Saturday could be a special day for us all, especially for the young kids including my own who have never seen us win a game at our old ground!

One thing kids do is play without fear, which is something Everton haven't done for fuckin years, mate.

We are not a one man team, anyone who think we would be in relegation without Rom's goals, here are the facts for this season alone taking Lukaku goals out of the equation.

We would have dropped 2 points against Sunderland, one point against Man City, 1 point against Palace and finally 3 points against Bournemouth, that's a total of 7 points.

On that showing, other players goals have given Everton the points total this season.

People think without Lukaku we are beaten, each and everyone can croon til the cows come home about Lukaku, the one player that has given 23 points out of 30 is Tom Davies and Barkley's form since Davies inclusion.

So I still stick by saying we could do worse than play 2 strikers, leaving Lukaku as the trump card if needed.

Out of your own mouth – "No-one knows how Valencia and Lookman would play up front, or even Calvert-Lewin."

Tom or Ross? Either way, how has one of them scored the goals to deliver 23 points out of 30?

Amazing how many can say we would be fighting relegation or struggling without Rom's goals, yet just over a month ago comments of lazy bone idle, sell him were filling the comments boards.

Now it's everyone singing from a different hymnsheet and suddenly Everton are screwed if we use him as a sub or he gets a suspension or injury.

All my post was saying was try something different, try two of Calvert-Lewin, Lookman or Valencia to try and get behind them, have Lukaku there raring to go off the bench if needed, but don't put too much onus on Lukaku being the only one who can deliver a win and the wheel will fall off dare we not start with the guy.

In those 23 points out of 30 who was playing up front? Here's a clue: it was the chap who scored 11 goals in 10 games.

You can't have it both ways; using your logic, Tom Davies has contributed zero points based on goals scored or even assists for that matter.

Does that mean I think Tom Davies is not important. Hell no, I think he is brilliant.

Ridiculous logic. Laughable. Correlation is not causation.

I desperately want us to win this game and I think starting with Lukaku gives us an edge over them.

Gueye and Davies are made of the right stuff for this game, as are Williams and, if he plays, Schneiderlin.

In my opinion (market value 3s/6d) the two players we need to perform to their full potential in this game are Mirallas and Barkley. If they do, we will win.

Indeed, we have 15 different goalscorers in the team this season with Lukaku's goals alone securing 2 wins and rescuing 2 draws for a total gain of 8 points.

All I am saying is use two of them, have Lukaku as backup to come on, like for like, swap for one of the two strikers, it just might pay off.

I do not even know why I am having this debate because I am pretty sure Ronnie will play a lone striker and pack the midfield.

See how many "he's lazy, bone idle" posters come on if it goes tits up. As for me, nothing would give me more pleasure than eating humble pie and a great Everton win.

"Just read what is written and stop making such ridiculous assumptions."

Okay, let's start with you. Lets start with the "significant flaws" in your argument, let's read what you say. Firstly,I think you'll find it was you who used the word "mob".

So I got to thinking why? Then I looked at the rhetoric you were using. I wonder if you realise you actually warned another poster to stop posting his opinion, telling him if he didn't take your "expert" advice, He would remain the current "whipping boy"? - mob mentality?

I wonder where you have been if you don't believe there are large sections of people who ARE panicking at the prospect of Lukaku leaving. Have you missed all those thousands of posts? Take this thread for instance, look at the reaction.

Look what Chris Gould has to say. Chris is normally a calm logical guy, but he seems to lose all sense of proportion where Lukaku is concerned, he believes that NO plan can work if it doesn't involve Lukaku – Abandon all hope, those who take to the field without our saviour.

Brent Stephens agrees with him – no surprises there.

"Mocky" (try typing that without laughing) would get himself into such a state when people criticised his hero, he decided to exile himself from Lukaku related threads. Mind you, he made no mention of non-related threads where Lukaku's name is mentioned. Take this one for example. He's turned into a Dia Wolf. Not because somebody attacked Lukaku, he has returned a dozen times to the thread to express his rage at the very suggestion Lukaku be used in another capacity.

You really believe Mocky isn't panicking at the thought of Lukaku leaving? Trust me, He's sweating like a glass blowers arse.

Like many Evertonians, I've seen Lukaku come on from the bench to devastating effect. I remember seeing him turn the game on its fucking head at Upton Park. If you people really think its the craziest idea you guys have ever heard? You must have lead sheltered lives.

I once drove like a fucking maniac from Edinburgh to London (another match at Upton Park). I made it by the skin of my teeth The players were already on the pitch ready to kick off when I got in. The guy next to me said "You'll never guess what's happened. That Ginger twat has dropped ALL of his strikers". THAT my friends is what you call a crazy idea.

I'll rephrase: of course there is always a chance we could win without Lukaku. Hell, on their day, if everything went their way, the U23s could beat them. Burnley should have beaten them, and they don't have a player anywhere near Rom's quality.

However, we, without doubt, have a better chance of beating them with Rom in the side. Something which you acknowledge.

So, with that in mind, we shouldn't be concerning ourselves with life without Lukaku. We should embrace our greatest goalscoring threat, and hopefully watch him smash into them.

I believe he will score a brace on Saturday, but whether that will be enough may depend on what we have left after these wretched injuries.

I hope he stays, but I don't blame anyone for seeking a better offer as long as they do the business. And he's currently doing it.

They are at home and the idea of giving them another psychological advantage a half-hour before kick off is crazy in my opinion. Your best players start matches – not come on as impact subs.

How many people have previously commented about Lukaku scoring in the latter end of matches, how many times have posters posted "Same old Everton always start slow, why can't we start a game like we finish one?"

It's well known we have been slow starters in a few of our games, on that basis I merely suggested why not try to change this? Use Lookman and Valencia or Calvert-Lewin to see if it reaps any rewards; both are pacy players and will certainly get behind the Liverpool backs.

Let's make one thing clear: I am not shooting Lukaku down. Yes, he is one hell of a player. I am not saying drop the guy because he is shite; I am saying let's try something different. If it goes tits up early on, then we have the big guy to come on.

Bringing a fresh Lukaku on will only strengthen our hands for the Lukaku backers.

It all sounds a bit Ruud Gullit when he left Alan Shearer out of the Newcastle team. We know how that turned out.

I have no doubt Lukaku could be a match winner. For me though, he struggles against the big teams... we struggle when we go to Anfield, more so when we play a lone striker. So, unless I am missing something and Lukaku is going to bag a couple early on, then I take my hat off for the majority of Mystic Megs amongst you.

Trying two different strikers early doors just might be the difference to past results.

I say 'might' and not 'will' before I get pulled up again and corrected.

But against the RS I do not think you can blame him completely.

3-3 draw: he changed the game in our favour

0-4: injured by Gerrard; draws at Goodison and Anfield – Martinez sent the team out to defend and he really had no support.

1-1 when Rogers was sacked: got us an equaliser and I thought he played well.

0-4 when Funes Mori kissed his badge: whole team stopped playing, although Rom was generally poor in the matches after the Chelsea quarterfinal win, almost dining out on his reputation.

0-1 earlier this season: he was poor... no excuses, granted.

This time, there should be no excuses for Rom or indeed Koeman. Koeman has to set the team up to use our strengths. He has a confident front 3 in Rom, Kev and Ross. What is crucial however is how well our back line does.

Dropping Rom will not solve the fact that Baines has been exposed on the left a number of times and the RS have done us from set pieces over the years. Robles had brain farts against Spurs. Williams and Jags have looked shaky. Get the back line right and our front players have a chance.

I'm (seriously) seeing a monthly story here..

The Semantics Antics of Bri n' Daz ("We always get the last word!")

Characters drawn like the 'casketeers' from the Real Ale Twats in Viz.

Daz: "This is ridiculous, SURELY it was obvious that when we said he was a fat, lazy, idle, hopeless fucker who should be dropped immediately, this was in fact a compliment."

Bri: "Absolutely! Nice to see someone gets it! Anyway of course if we win 7-0 with Lukaku as lone striker, I will of course hold my hands up and say I got it wrong...(pause)...ANY other result however and I will be claiming victory."

"His goals more often than not come in the latter end of matches."

Could this have anything to do with bringing on Valencia or Lookman late on, which gives Lukaku the support he needs? It's been mentioned on here many times (but not recently for obvious reasons) that Lukaku looked better with Kone along side of him.

Opinions change on which Lukaku turns up; this season, since Christmas, he has mostly been on the ball regards to scoring.

I hope he keeps it up tomorrow and he at least lets Liverpool know he is on the field by using his weight and harassing and bullying them. He can do it; it's up to you, Rom.

Nobody, in response to Brian, appears to be panicking about Lukaku leaving. They are highlighting a ridiculous tactical suggestion. That's what I have done and I stand by that 100%.

Finally Brian goes as far as to say "Thank the Lord for Darren Hind". Positively evangelical, isn't it. I'll leave the two of you to continue to debate between yourselves other inspirational and perhaps even "God sent" tactical suggestions.

I getting more of this vibe

Link

Brilliant.

I also think this "all his goals at the end of a game when it doesn't matter" may well be a statistical quirk, and if we look at previous and future seasons we might see a different pattern.

That's fine I have my opinion, I am not asking anyone to agree with it, just to read my post, air alternate views if needed – that's every posters right, to voice their opinions.

By all means feel free to get a cartoon strip, but just because you think your opinion is right, does not mean "Shut up, Brian, your idea is wrong. Now kindly leave the forum, Brian, your suggestion is a joke."

Listen to what I had to say.

Come on, Ronnie... set them up to get at them at the back – their weak point.

Will meet you halfway, Seamus, if we play 2 strikers; anything but a lone striker and a packed midfield like the Spurs game.

A A draw is no good; we need maximum points in the next two games. We may as well give it a good go and bang 2 strikers on.

Darren Hind – I want Lukaku to play, he represents our best chance of goals.

Eugene Ruane - "Ha ha ha ha I've got them . . .not since Genghis Khan and Leon Trotsky have there been two more like minded people. Two peas in a fucking pod".

Mocky, John Davies and Brent Stephens – "Baaaaahhh, I don't care if Eugene has got it arse about face.... Baaaaaahhhhh"

Eugene, stick to your links, fella. So what if you come across as a one-trick pony, at least they keeps the easily led happy and they masks an awful lot.

I thought it was worth a go trying two speedy strikers. Everyone thinks it's better to start with Lukaku; on that basis, try Valencia alongside him from the start.

Last thing we need is to pack the midfield and play a lone striker.

Link

Why on EARTH would you tell me a thing like that?

I mean with that information, if I fancied, I could just make you dance about on TW for my own amusement

All I'd have to do is post "How do you arrive at that bollocks?" two or three times a day and you'd be guaranteed to come-a-runnin'.

Remember, loose lips sink ships.

Darren, see the feller complaining about the feller drawing 'penises.' Link?

That's you that is.

If Eugene gets his wish and a comic strip artist surfaces, It could mean the death of the side-splitting link. Eugene would be goosed. How would he communicate? Mime?

I could just imagine him tearing his curly blonde syrup to shreds and squeezing the fucking life out of his hooter in a desperate attempt to recycle another Paul Daniels rib tickler.

Not sure if I can still get in my flairs but if it adds entertainment to the site, will have a dabble at the Macarena. I draw the line to the ketchup song though, the boogies are okay but doubt my buggy buggy wuggy would would hold out.

Right, wrong subject, but first of my two part sports fix for the weekend coming up, here's hoping my two teams, Everton and Wigan Warriors, make it the perfect weekend for me.

He reckons it might be a result of the incredibly loud cheer Rom got at the Hull game.

(he told me he was at the game, sitting next to some feller who had cotton wool in his ears and who was sitting next to an embarrassed looking grandson).

Link

A 2-1 win to us with Davies popping up with the winner.