Allardyce defends his record as Blues beat Newcastle

Monday, 23 April, 2018 114comments  |  Jump to most recent

Sam Allardyce was satisfied with a hard-won victory over Newcastle this evening as Theo Walcott's solitary goal allowed Everton to edge the Magpies at Goodison Park.

The Blues had the bulk of the possession but lacked quality going forward until Walcott seized on a rebound off a defender, took a touch and then thumped the ball home early in the second half.

Allardyce, who had named an unchanged side from that which drew at Swansea last weekend, paid tribute to the January signing from Arsenal and his side for seeing out a nervy last few minutes.

“Newcastle had won their last four and, apart from the last 10 minutes in fairness, we've dominated the game so for me there was only going to be one winner,” Allardyce said afterwards.

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“What we didn't do is get the second goal and they put us under a bit of pressure last five minutes but we defended really well and I think it's a well-deserved win and another three important points at home, again.”

“So, moving forward here and with the fans, the support we get and the players delivering results week in and week out, that's our big bonus since I arrived here.

“It's won three, drawn two and lost won in the last six now and we've moved up the league one place again so we're on the right track and moving in the right direction.”

A banner unfurled in the Gwladys Street End before kick-off suggesting Allardyce should “get out of our club” was displayed prominently by the television cameras, leading to the manager being asked whether he thought he was starting to win over some of the Everton fans.

“Well, if I lose next week they weren't be there, will they?” he smiled. “We'll all be rubbish if we lose next week but if we win we'll be OK,” Allardyce replied. “So, let's keep winning, eh, so there don't get the criticism.

“But when does every fan like the manager? I'm working with a squad of players I've inherited and I think 8th in the League compared to fifth from bottom tells you we're getting better.”

Asked if he thought he could deliver results with the style that Evertonians expect he retorted: “What was wrong with our style today? We've completely dominated the game and out-passed the opposition.

“We found them very difficult to break down because of the very negative tactic of dropping everyone back so you have to be patient and we got the winner so you couldn't knock our football.

“You can knock some of our passing that goes astray but, in all fairness, you can't really blame me for that, can you? I don't pass the ball out there, the lads do.”


Reader Comments (114)

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John Boswell
1 Posted 23/04/2018 at 22:57:07
I have been following the blues for 60 years and watched tonight's game on TV. This gave me a different perspective to Sam who was at pitch level. All I can say is that I saw a very different performance to the one he described.

A poor performance from a group of people who are for the most part better players than we are seeing. I will not name the players who disappointed me tonight because the coach was again the biggest problem.

It's almost time to go, 3 more games then cheerio.

Roy O Donovan
2 Posted 23/04/2018 at 23:04:48
Sam does my head in. Most of the game we were dreadful. The football is so poor to watch with him in charge. If he left to continue he will do a lot of damage, young players will get less time on the pitch, and he will bring in seasoned pros who will do nothing for the future of the club.

He is arrogant will do nothing for the future of the club. He is arrogant and all he cares about is himself; he needs to go.

Roy O Donovan
3 Posted 23/04/2018 at 23:16:11
Just get Allardyce out – he is only interested in himself.
Kase Chow
4 Posted 23/04/2018 at 23:31:38
Big Sam has done his job and for that we should be far more grateful than we are

However his style of play is awful

Saying that, some of the players are awful: Rooney, Bolasie for example. Terrible

Club is in an absolute state

Bill Watson
5 Posted 23/04/2018 at 23:47:06
The irony was that Schneiderlin was probably playing his best game of the season and went off injured!

Davies came on and spent the next 40 mins passing to the opposition. I noticed Bolasie was wearing TWO sweatbands... lol.

Chad Schofield
6 Posted 23/04/2018 at 23:49:38
I agree Bill, Schneiderlin looked good and so did Keane until the bump on the nose.

Terrible game that we apparently controlled throughout according to World Cup winner and war hero, Sam.

Andrew Presly
7 Posted 24/04/2018 at 00:09:25
Go Sam. Now.
Jason Wilkinson
8 Posted 24/04/2018 at 00:26:35
Sam: "I don't pass the ball, the players on the pitch do that."

Me: "We have never played in black and white striped shirts."

Sam: "What's wrong with the style of play tonight?"

Me: "It would make a glass eye weep."

Please take your pay off, be glad EFC is on your CV and become a Baggies legend next season.

Brian Porter
9 Posted 24/04/2018 at 00:33:37
We were not 5th from bottom when he took over, we were 13th so he can't even get that simple fact straight.

So 'exciting' was tonight's game that I spent most of the second half watching it on my phone out of one eye, with the sound turned off, while watching a DVD on the telly instead. It was incredibly, phenomenally, wonderfully boring to the n-th degree. Even though we won, it still felt almost like a defeat to me.

Allardyce has basically sucked all the romance out of the game, romance? Yes, that fantastic feeling of pride you normally feel as you watch your team emerge from the tunnel, the surge of excitement you feel as your team surges forward in attack after attack against the poorer sides especially and the incredible roar that escapes from your lungs when your team scores a great goal, better still, two or three.

Goodison was so quiet tonight, even the goal didn't seem to galvanise the crowd, or the team, and I couldn't be bothered to raise an arm or cheer as I once would have done when that 'romance' surrounding our team existed.

For God's sake, Mr Moshiri, help to bring back the romance. Get rid of this terrible man who thinks this was an excellent performance and give us a manager worthy of the name, and worthy of our team.

Over the last few months it's felt like watching a great old relative slowly bleeding to death, when radical surgery if swiftly performed could quite possibly put new life into the tired and terminally ill body. It's time for that surgery now, Mr Moshiri. If Allardyce is still in charge for another year the terminal decline will continue and the atmosphere at Goodison will grow ever more toxic as the sepsis invading the body of our club grows worse and worse and every defeat or bore draw will lead to gangrene infecting the entire organism with the fans turning not only against the manager but against the decision facto owner as well as they decide he couldn't run the proverbial you know what in a brewery.

Goodnight all.

Alan Smith
10 Posted 24/04/2018 at 00:48:40
You could also accuse Benitez of similar things. I would praise Benitez though for sound organisation and a well drilled two banks of four.
Lawrence Green
11 Posted 24/04/2018 at 01:00:27
Olly Hawkins on the Talk of the Toon website examines Big Sam's claims in his press conference.

“we dominated the game and for me there was only ever going to be one winner” –
We had more clear cut openings, more shots, more shots on target (only fractionally, but still), more corners and, with 57% of the ball to our 43%, it’s not like they completely dominated the possession stats.

“Negative tactics of dropping ten players in their own half” –
Basically exactly what Big Sam did at St James’ Park for the full 90. Also, it’s not like Allardyce’s Everton played with attacking intent. His approach probably defines the term ‘negative tactics’ and that’ll be why so many on Merseyside want him out. They may have won, but the home fans inside Goodison will have been far from impressed. Criticising Rafa for negative tactics when this is Big Sam’s trademark is pretty priceless.

What an awful game of football and a classless post-match interview to match. To be arrogant in victory after a game like that is quite laughable really – but that’s the gravy guzzler for you!

Martin Clark
12 Posted 24/04/2018 at 01:17:21
All hail big head Sam! Our saviour, if it wasn't for him Everton would be no more!

I've always disliked players who thought they were bigger than the club but this guy eats all the biscuits!

Hardly dominant if you can only create one chance on target and that being a goal that was gifted to us by poor defending.

I can't be bothered with another season of Sams self-praise and dull football where we're meant to be happy just pipping a one-nil with negative football tactics and no creativity.

Heard tripe about having stability with Sam but seriously! Fine take stability over ambition and we'll eventually head lower and lower by going nowhere!

I've loved Everton all my life and remember years where avoiding relegation and not getting beat by Liverpool was almost our season goal. I've developed low interest in watching Everton which feels so unusual and but just can't stand the guy. He only has one way of playing, to be fair great for avoiding relegation but dreadful to watch.

Please leave Sam!

Rick Tarleton
13 Posted 24/04/2018 at 06:18:23
Thanks, Sam. You really are a work in progress. Yes, you have organised the back four, but I've been watching Everton since 53-4, albeit mainly on tv nowadays, and no Everton team, not in the awful fifties, the drifting seventies, the dour and even dire nineties, has played with so little ambition and so dully.

If you really think this is football, "the glory game" as Blanchflower once tellingly called it, you are mistaken. The problem is you have a contract for one more year and if you continue, I can see you emptying Goodison Park. If I was a boy watching this Everton team, who'd be my hero, my Dave Hickson, my Bobby Collins, my Alex Young?

This team you claim to have inherited is soulless. You train them, you organise them, you set out the tactics, you motivate them and they lack a vision.

Go back to playing golf on the Iberian Peninsula and let Everton find a manager who can help the players and club to flourish and to give us a hope of "glory", not necessarily by winning a trophy, but by giving us skill and heroes for youngsters to admire.

Jim Harrison
14 Posted 24/04/2018 at 06:46:49
How hard can it be for him to simply say “We won the game, which is what counts, but we are not at the level we should be in terms of quality. I appreciate the fans want some more entertainment, it will come once we rebuild confidence”?

I suspect if his tone was more along this line than spouting his self-defence bollocks a few would be less pissed off. I can understand pragmatism, and if we finish 8th a shite season will result in us being one place worse off than last so to a degree yes, he has limited the damage. But his us v them speakers, provoking the fans, who are the lifeblood of the club is sheer stupidity!!

As for bitching about the squad he inherited, the finished 7th by a mile last season. One major player has left, and the other significant departure had been injured most of the current season and was patchy last year. It's unbalanced and needs improvement but still has plenty of quality if motivated and drilled correctly. It's an easy excuse to use. Koeman improved Bobby's team's performance with mainly the same players in his first season

He has to go. Not so much based on his performance, which at least he has achieved the minimum required, but because of his relationship with the fans, just as at West Ham, is causing negativity

Paul Ward
15 Posted 24/04/2018 at 07:30:14
It seems Allardice is determined to make these silly statements because he knows he will be sacked at seasons end.

He may also feel he has done the job he was hired to do even if his style of play is abhorrent to Evertonians.

He may even have read ToffeeWeb, where many regular posters can't help but deride or blame the manager for every thing that goes wrong with the club. I don't just mean this manager I mean the last four.

I just wonder how long it will take for the manager haters on here to abuse the next manager.

Dermot Byrne
16 Posted 24/04/2018 at 08:10:35
Paul Ward #15: 10 mins!

Last night, to me Allardyce sounded like a man who knows he is leaving. I may be wrong but surely after a win and getting to a more respectable 8th and you still had a chance of staying, you would be talking with some hope or enthusiasm about the future. If for no other reason to convince the Board. Now I know Sam is no cheerleader but even for him what I heard sounded like "dead man walking."

His exposé after he leaves will be great fun to read, unless it is in his contract he cannot do that. Then we will hear nothing as he will not say anything that may jeopardise his pay off.

James Hill
17 Posted 24/04/2018 at 09:12:09
John Boswell I've been watching Everton for slightly longer and completly disagree with your view of the game. I hope Sam stays as I have never seen Evertonians so utterly classless and clueless in all my time supporting the club.

I remember when we had a club that oozed class with supporters who had a high footballing IQ that allowed them to be objective and fair.

Now I see fans that are completely subjective and emotional. Sam has not had a fair crack of the whip. These players have failed 3 managers now. For me Sam is better than people think and given time will improve us.

We are so quick to critisies our own now in favour of foreign managers who are only successful because of money. If everyone plays Peps way city will win it every year.

One way for Everton if Sam goes and that's down like Newcastle, Aston Villa, Bolton, West Ham, Sunderland. Anyone who says we weren't in danger of relegation before he came is dreaming or a fool.

I bet one statistic Pep teams would win hands down is passing it back to the keeper. The league, in my opinion, is at it poorest standard in years. Games are starting to look like training games like they do in Spain and Germany. For those who never seen good football that means no one tackles. Frankly it is shite.

So slag Sam all you like but be careful want you wish for. Just my opinion though. Long live Sam!

Pete Clarke
18 Posted 24/04/2018 at 09:46:44
Well if it meant having Sam as our manager then we may as well be in the second division or even non-league. Better still, let's just fold and we can all go and watch a game or two for free in the Park every weekend.

To accept him is like finding out your missus is seeing another fella and you let them use your bed. (And he happens to be a season ticket holding red shite!)

Steve Brown
19 Posted 24/04/2018 at 09:55:42
Can someone show Lardiola the league table after the West Ham game? 13th was our position when he took over.

He's gone and he knows it. Let's all recognise his interviews until the end of the season as audition tape for West Brom poor bastards.

Carl Taylor
20 Posted 24/04/2018 at 10:11:05
Getting sick of hearing "Big Sams" mates on the radio saying he is hard done to and what do Everton want, they're 8th. It's not about style over results, it's about football philosophy and adaptability.

I tried to get on a national radio show this morning but wasn't put on air. I wanted to make an analogy about why managers like Allardyce, Pulis, Pardew, Mark Hughes and Dean Saunders are serial failures. It goes like this;

I am a golfer, I have just been given my first official handicap and it is 18. I now have my benchmark, so do I want to improve and get my handicap lower, or keep doing what I have always done and at best stay an 18 handicap golfer? Most people would say they want to improve and lower their handicap. To do this you look to improve or change certain parts of your game, e.g. a different putting stroke, practice your short game, maybe get a few lessons. Your game evolves, you improve, you get better results and your handicap drops because you have pushed yourself to achieve more.

The managers listed above DO NOT practice this approach. They stick with what they have always done, stay 18 handicappers and watch those around them with more drive and adaptability move ahead of them. You can, to a lesser degree, apply this analogy to most managers, e.g. Guardiola never changes, so that is why he generally gets beat by Klopp, who knows how to combat his philosophy. Klopp generally losses in big games (cup finals) because he won't adapt, Mourinho won't change or adapt, Wenger, Martinez, Moyes, etc.

The only manager who stood the test of time was Ferguson and that was because he adapted to the changes going on around him.

So Big Sam will NOT change his style/philosophy next season, he will still claim a point at Swansea is an achievement and we will still be negative. However, can we find an adaptable manager, who can entertain and set up a team to beat the opposition in various systems? Well that isn't my job, but I know it isn't Sam Allardyce.

Noleen Daya
21 Posted 24/04/2018 at 10:11:05
James 17, please tell me you are joking.

Yes, we must be careful what we wish for, but one of the reasons Sam must go is because if he stays, we will NEVER have a chance of qualifying for Champions League. It's a dream right now for our club - but dream and strive we must.

We need a manager who can rebuild a team, revive the few good players we have, establish a style of play and buy the players who fit that style, build a good relationship with players and fans.

He's done what he was brought in for but I am also sick and tired of fans and pundits referring to how he has saved us as if we have to fall at his feet and remain there. It shows utter lack of ambition to keep him on. Never mind his style of play, but his character and manners leave a stink so far up my nose my brain will rot if he does not go.

Steve Ferns
22 Posted 24/04/2018 at 10:48:58
It does not matter where Everton finish this season, 7th? 8th? 9th? 10th? or even down to 11th or 12th. The fact of the matter is, we spent heavily since Koeman was appointed. That first season we returned us to 7th and best of the rest. Phase 1 complete, then a load more cash was spent and he set about trying to close on and overtake 6th. We all know the start we had, the games we had, and how badly Koeman handled the situation.

Sure, Allardyce came in during November, and his job was to sort out the mess and recover the side to a midtable position. but let's be realistic. The side have spluttered all season long, and every now and again we show a few signs of life and that we have better players than our immediate rivals. had we any consistency, then we could have reclaimed 7th. Here we are 3 games to go and the gap is just 8 points. We were terrible in both Burnley games, Had we beat them at home and drawn away, we'd be above them right now. I believe that if we played them on Saturday, at Goodison, even with big Sam in charge, that we would beat them. Burnley are limping home, and next season they will find out how much of a killer EL football is, and I would not be surprised if they go down. Dyche has done a good job this season with a side of very average players.

Leicester were easily beaten by us in the Seamus Coleman comeback game. Newcastle showed last night they aren't a match for us. Go on down the list and we're capable of beating them all easily, particularly at home, well maybe only at home.

So why, when after only 3 games we found ourselves in 9th, did our focus not change and everything be geared towards reclaiming 7th? Why did the board not foresee how easy it was for us to be removed from that relegation dog fight? It was pure desperation born out of panicking after pressure from the press.

Any half decent manager could have done what he did, and many would have surpassed it. We have a big squad of 38 players. We know because he regularly reminds us of that fact. A big squad means lots of choice, and he could easily have found a side from within that. Unsworth handed him a winning formula that he stuck to for the first few games and that got us out of trouble.

All we've heard since is self promotion and self serving comments, and nothing about promoting the club. Allardyce is doing a lot of damage.

James Hill
23 Posted 24/04/2018 at 10:51:05
Joleen exactly, emotional. Please try and be objective. Why you think this way is beyond me.

Style of play is dictated by the resources you have available. We have an aging squad combined with youth that is not consistently good or at the required level yet.

Here's what is emotional crap from Evertonians: Sam plays the same team and same tactics, criticised, plays different tactics criticised.

Best two players have been Walcott and Tosun. Nothing to do with Sam. God I could go on &or ever about how irrational Evertonians are its frightening.

Evertonians Moyes crap, Martinez Crap, Kidman crap, Allardyce crap. Who's next Silva, well we know he's crap. Fonseca Mickey mouse league manager.

So Joleen, sorry but I'm not joking and serious I'm becoming embarrassed to be an Evertonian after all these years. We have a fan base but not all are real supporters. Only an opinion. Long live Sam

Steve Ferns
24 Posted 24/04/2018 at 10:56:38
James Hill, style of play is not dictated by resources.

Eddie Howe has less resources than anyone in the league. Yet his style of play is up there with the best of them. He coaches his players well and they play a good style of football. Whether or not their style of play is effective is dictated by resources. But consider that yet again Bournemouth are comfortably safe and yet again Howe achieved that the hard way.

He's not the only one to do this. Martinez with Wigan, Swansea under various managers, Norwich always played good stuff despite limited resources, and I'm sure others can keep this list going.

Brian Harrison
25 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:06:09

I to heard Dean Saunders ( yet another ex red pundit talking about Everton) he was asking a fellow Evertonian what did he want. He said you had Martinez playing a passing game and the same under Koeman, he went on to say but maybe the players they had were not equipped to play that passing game. He suggested maybe Allardyce recognised this and changed the style to get results.

Amazing I didnt hear any of these ex reds defend Rodgers or Hodgson when the fans turned against them. But just to correct his idea of how Everton played under Martinez and Koeman. Martinez took over a very well drilled back 4 from David Moyes, 3 of that back 4 are still first choice now. this allowed him to play a more expansive game than Moyes had, and in his first season it worked. But when he started to change things to his way of playing we became a team obsessed with possession without any penetration. We played more passes in our own half than in the opponents half, it became boring and predictable.

Then Koeman took over and we thought we would get a more pragmatic approach, which we did but sadly the football didnt improve under Koeman, he sold Lukaku and Barry and made it abundantly clear that he wasnt a fan of Barkley. He then proceeded along with Walsh our new DOF to purchase some very average players, some still havent played 10 games for the club a tough start saw him replaced. I don't think Koeman ever warmed to the fans or them to him which doesnt help.

Then we turned Goodison into the Pit of Misery by hiring Allardyce, and even though our home record is very good thank God because our away form is awful. But despite our good home record the football has been dire, and most fans who sit around me our convinced he will be sacked at the end of the season, I wish I could be as sure as they are. Because if he is still here for next season, I truly worry what direction our new owner has for us.

Lawrence Green
26 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:10:53
Football without passion is meaningless, logic is for Chess enthusiasts. What is a true supporter? Somebody who sits on the sidelines applauding everything and everyone connected with the club they follow, one who tries to find the best in every employee of the club no matter how often they fail, one who tries to like a person who is not prone to displaying courtesy or humility in return.

I'm sure I'm not alone in finding some of the posters - who spout lack of class towards their fellow supporters and infer that anyone who doesn't measure up to their high standards as being inferior or lacking intelligence or worst of all not an Evertonian - a little insulting and tiresome.

We are not an homogenous group, we are as diverse a breed as any other group of supporters and therefore we have to accept that there are many differing opinions. expressed in many different forms. Please defend your point of view by all means but use a good argument to do so and refrain from emotive language that pours scorn on your fellow Blues.

James Hill
27 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:12:12
Sorry, Steve, it is the resources you have available. Steve,. Howe has picked the players to play the style he wants, not a luxury Sam has had yet.

Remind me where are Norwich and Wigan are... and where Swansea are likely to be next year.

Really, exactly my point: emotional.

Keep your list going mate. I don't want Everton to go the way of Wigan or Norwich have or Aston Villa, Newcastle (did), Bolton etc.

Oh, let's not forget West Bromwich not happy with style of football look where they are. What nonsense, it's a sport winning 1st nice football 2nd. God I despair at Evertonians like you.

Brian Harrison
28 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:13:10
James 23

Although I have been going to Goodison since 1956 I cant remember the Kidman era, pity it wasnt Nicole Kidman mind she probably knows more than Allardyce about attacking football. You really think Tosun is one of our better players, then we really are in trouble.

Danny Baily
29 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:19:18
I'd be willing to give Sam another year but for the fear that he will sign a bunch of players on the wrong side of 28 and leave us with an ageing squad.

Let's get a young manager in, and with him some hope. Failing that I'd go after Benitez! The guy is a serial winner.

We've been shite since Martinez's second season (was it QPR at home when we all realised we were going nowhere?). Five years of shite breeds apathy. We need to halt that, at the very least.

James Hill
30 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:20:10
Lawrence Green very liberal progressive of you. But supporting a team and having an opinion are great. But simply seeing no good regardless of how the team play is not a true supporter.

Nice try mate. Yes there many different opinions and I have expressed mine and stated it only my opinion. Diverse, that's a nice liberal view of the world. We are a tribe mate and stick together.

I find fans like tiresome and insulting.

Michael Lynch
31 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:21:01
Before anyone calls me a "Sam apologist" or a closet RS, let me put on record that I would like a change of manager please. Followed by a complete overhaul of the squad.

Having said that, Allardyce, and this squad, are actually out-performing most of the PL. If you look at the results since he took over, starting with the victory over Huddersfield, we're actually the 6th best team in the league. I am happy for statisticians out there to tell me I'm wrong, but looking at the table after the WHU game and the table after last night, we've taken more points since then than everyone except the two Manc clubs, the Shite, Chelsea and Spurs. We've taken more points than Arsenal and Burnley.

I hate the atmosphere around this club, and I think we're dreadful to watch, but Allardyce has done a decent job in terms of points won and our position in the league.

Like I say, I'm happy for someone to tell me I've got my sums wrong, but if we do sack Sam - and I hope we do, just to lance the boil - he can honestly say that he's left the club in a much better position than when he took over.

James Hill
32 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:22:46
Sorry lads Didn't mean to upset the apple cart on here. Just an alternative opinion. Isn't that point of sites like this. Love the continuing negativity.
Jerome Shields
33 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:30:42
It can get worse. . . Allardyce may be here next season.
James Hill
34 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:33:20
Brian Harrison sorry mate spell check, Koeman keeps changing Kidman. 1956, You must be older than my Dad. Mind you he is still a season ticket holder. Couldn't agree more about Tosun but he is still one of our better players. Shows how bad our squad is which is exactly my point. It's not Sam's squad.
Peter Anthony
35 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:34:28
We dominated the supposed managerial genius Rafa's team for 70 minutes but ended up lucky not to conceded the equaliser.

Does that mean Sam is better than Rafa, especially as his team beat them at St.James' too?

I don't think it does, but I am fearful of the calamity that unfolded at WBA this season following the departure of Pulis.

Having the RS marauding as they are is falling but I do wonder if we would be quite so anti Sam if they were doing worse than we are.

I am very proud of our record of top flight football and losing it could scupper then stadium plans maybe.

Tosun and Walcott seem good buys, if Sam can add further quality in the summer while shifting out the dross, could he improve us next season. I suspect he could, and would have no excuses if he did not. A safer choice than risking on a newbie to the prem too.

I really don't know what his the best thing to do, hopefully the Mosh gets divine inspiration.

Brian Williams
36 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:40:50
Just been listening to Talkshite (I shouldn't have) and according to the sage that is Jim White; we should be grateful for where we are and basically know and accept our place, which is mid-table.

If I could have dragged them through the radio I'd have strangled the lot of them.

James Hill
37 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:43:18
Michael Lynch, I get what your saying. I'm not a great lover of Sam but I believe he deserves at least a chance. I do think he is better than people think. I would hate us to look back and regret getting rid of him by going down for the sake of one season extra.

I love my club and want it to stay in the top division and win trophies. I believe this possible if we keep our heads and don't panic like we did with Koeman. (Probably Moshiri listen to the fans). We live in a nihilistic and impatient world unfortunately so I think we will go down the wrong road with this one.

Johan Elmgren
38 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:45:05
Michael #31, you might be right that during Allardyce we've assembled the sixth best pointstally, however you must take into conisderation that before he took over we had met 5 of the 6 best teams from last season, plus a Burnley-side high on confidence and Leicester. That's seven of the top eight currently. You can sort of say that Sam has had the kindest fixturelist compared to everyone else during this period.

Another point to be made is that we were plain lucky in many of those games under Allardyce. The shite away, Newcastle away on top of my head were games we easily could have lost.

It's simple, really. If we want midtable and play boring football, keep Allardyce. If we want to be higher we must get a new manager. I know what I want.

Allardyce out now!!

Brian Williams
39 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:52:42
I do think he is better than people think."

Hmmm and what's he done to make you think that then?

Please elaborate.,"I do think he is better than people think."
Hmmm and what's he done to make you think that then?
Please elaborate.,, ,1,11:46:01,,,ok,856,04/24/2018 11:46:01,Brizey,reader,, 912585,36550,toffeeweb,24/04/2018,Michael Lynch,,"Johan - under Sam we've played the Red Shite twice, Chelsea, Man U, Man C, Spurs and Arsenal. Naturally, most of them have spanked us, but we've still accumulated more points than all but five clubs in the league under Allardyce.

Johan Elmgren
40 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:54:51
Michael, yes but while many of our opponents have met most of them twice during this period, we have only met the shite twice during Allardyce... And that's where the comparison lies, from when he took over.
Pete Clarke
41 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:56:32
Very true about opinions, so let it flow.

In my opinion, if Sam stays we will lose thousands of fans as we are unlikely to play decent football and the results will be very mid-table for as long as he is with us.

Tosun and Walcott are very expensive acquisitions and not top quality. (I like Walcott but my Arsenal mate has warned me ) so what top players will come and play for him??

Sam has already divided the support and that's with half decent results. The future with him will divide us more.

He will blame players for bad results but take all the credit for good results. He is a multi-millionaire mercenary who does not care about the clubs who employ him. He has no respect and hence what happened with England.

Eddie Howe has virtually the same team that he brought up 2 divisions so his players respond to his orders and what he has done for that tiny club is amazing. I personally think he deserves a crack at the big time.

If Sam stays then it will prove Moshiri to be Another false dawn for this club. Worst person to ever manage this club of ours.

Michael Lynch
42 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:57:43
Johan - I haven't got the time or inclination to look at everyone's fixtures since the end of November, but what makes you think other clubs have played the top clubs any more times than we have in that period of time?
James Hill
43 Posted 24/04/2018 at 11:58:10
Brian Williams he had a good footballing side when he had Bolton. Like many good British managers he has had to pull clubs who had foreign managers out of the shit.
Johan Elmgren
44 Posted 24/04/2018 at 12:04:15
Well, I haven't got time either to do that, but it's logically impossible for everyone to have played Man U, Man C, Arsenal, Chelsea, Spurs, Burnley & Leicester within the 12 first rounds. Only a few might have done that, but I would guess only we did it.
Lawrence Green
45 Posted 24/04/2018 at 12:06:08
James #30

I've supported the club for nearly fifty years and sacrificed plenty in doing so, I was also present in most of the lowest crowds seen at Goodison prior to the glory days of the 1980s. I'm sorry that you find fans like me tiresome and insulting. If your definition of Evertonians as a tribe is correct, perhaps you can explain why those who attended the Burnley and Swansea matches displayed their displeasure towards Sam, or was that not truly representative of the tribe?

I only ever want what is best for Everton and therefore Evertonians and whilst you think that Sam may be able to offer some hope of progress, should he be kept on beyond this season, I can't see how he will change his methods to suit the majority of the fans, in fact if he does stay, I can see many Blues staying at home, preferring to watch paint dry, regardless of how many points he amasses.

We've had nigh on sixteen years of safety first, unadventurous football, with the odd glimpse of exciting play, nihilistic we may be but impatient never.

Don Alexander
46 Posted 24/04/2018 at 12:11:17
I'm in the same camp as Michael Lynch (#31) with regard to Allardyce's pedigree and performance throughout his history as a manager BUT when we signed him I pointed out that we were his last chance to ever prove to the football world that he had always had the potential to actually win a trophy if only he'd ever had a club with resources and a reasonable squad instead of the busted flushes he's been saddled with ever since he left Bolton.

Then he arrives at Finch Farm to tackle a mediocre squad with glaring deficiencies in various positions, all deliberately "organised" by the club itself, and an overload of no.10's, and not much left in the kitty for him to splash out on his own choices come January. Factor in that the board with its 18-month contract made it as plain as could be that he was short-term at best/worst, with six months quite likely to be all he was gonna get.

"Go try and inspire the lads with that, Sam lad, and good luck" might have been Kenwright's lame attempt at spelling out Allardyce's mandate and, if so, the only part that seems to have happened is the "good luck" bit, in that we've somehow scrambled points from games where we were so undeserving.

The owner/board need to now, repeat "now", provide a manager with a three or four year contract in order to make it clear to one and all in football that we are, to coin a phrase, a professionally run football club and then support him with a root and branch transformation of the coaching staff and squad in order to have a hope of prising our way into the top echelon.

James Hill
47 Posted 24/04/2018 at 12:22:10
Lawrence, I was there too in the 70s never missed a match home or away for 5 years. My real point is, despite the fact we haven't played the pretty football of Watford, Swansea etc, Sam has not had the chance to show what he can do.

If you're that old you will remember the Bolton team that broke into Europe. That's what I think Sam can do given the chance.

If you think they were a poor footballing then you don't know football. He had a limited budget but still brought in me great players with skill. Go and check them out Jay Jay Okocha for one. What a player.

Paul Cherrington
48 Posted 24/04/2018 at 12:22:33
I think that James Hill is right. Sam Allardyce is a good manager who has done well since he has been here. The club and the some fans behaviour towards him has been nothing short of disgraceful.

Look at the facts of the situation, not what the media tells you to think. Under Allardyce, we have gone up the table and picked up points. We are in a better position than before he arrived and he saved us from a relegation battle. If people are now saying that is not true, you obviously missed the first half of the season until he came in.

We now are hard to play against and hard to beat with some team spirit. This was not the case before he accepted the job. But no, let's ignore all that just so we can make childish jokes about the size of his head or his weight.

The last thing we need now is another managerial change. We need stability and Allardyce has earnt the right to build on this season for the next few years. We will gain nothing from getting rid of him now and undoing all the good work that has happened under him.

Seeing the unwarranted personal abuse dished out constantly to the man, whether he wins or not, is embarrassing. I know it's not everyone but those who are doing it should be ashamed of themselves. We won last night for god's sake but still, all some can do is moan. I think some would prefer to lose every game as long as we played 'nice' football.

James is right – with the players we have, Allardyce has done the sensible thing in finding a way to play that gives them a chance in games. Even Guardiola himself would lose with this group of players if he tried playing like Man City here. It is about winning and getting points – not about how pretty you look while you're doing it

What is even funnier is that all the whingers have shot themselves in the foot anyway. Do you really think any manager of note would come to Everton now after seeing the way the club and some supporters have treated Allardyce?

Not a chance! Why would they come and manage a club where a lot of apparent fans will hurl daily abuse at them, whatever they do? The next time we're in trouble and need help, why would anyone come near us when most fans can't even say thank you for that?

Johan Elmgren
49 Posted 24/04/2018 at 12:28:29
James, maybe his Bolton was a joy to watch and they were very good, but that was 20 years ago. Since then mega riches has washed over the Premier League and the top teams have bought quality on every position.

The Premier League has changed massively since Allardyce found success, the playing styles of the top teams have changed massively, but Allardyce is still managing in the same way he did back then. He will never be any higher than midtable, because he simply is not good enough these days...

Ray Jacques
50 Posted 24/04/2018 at 12:49:31
I now live and work outside of Liverpool and am the only blue about. My colleagues are a mixture of Man Utd, Man City, Liverpool, Bolton, Wigan etc with no affinity or dislike of Everton. In fact we don't even register with most United fans so I tend to receive an impartial opinion of our beloved team.(even from some RSs)

The general consensus of people with no axe to grind is that Allardyce has pulled us out of the shit.

They don't endure having to watch us every week, but nonetheless their opinion is worth a mention whilst the majority of blues express a near-pathological hatred of our present manager.

For me he has done exactly what it says on the tin and should now be replaced by A N Other, but who that is, god only knows and he/she is going to take on an enormous task to make this lot of unbalanced, lethargic players perform to our expectations/aspirations..

Brian Williams
51 Posted 24/04/2018 at 12:54:32
James Hill. He had a win ratio of 41% with Bolton a ratio which has deteriorated with every subsequent club (Sunderland was 29%).

What that says to me, and you can't argue with figures, is that he has deteriorated over time.

So he did something good a long time ago, so did I but I couldn't do what I did now, and neither can he.

Brian Harrison
52 Posted 24/04/2018 at 13:05:44
Guys I can assure you that Bolton were never good to watch even when they had JJ Achocha and Djorkaef sorry if the spelling isn't right. By the way these 2 were brilliant footballers but they had to try and fit into Allardyces long ball football. Nolan and Kevin Davies were Allardyces mainstays in the team with Alan Stubbs at the back. Yes they were effective but never nice to watch.

He hasn't changed his style since he first became a manager and anybody who thought the 63 year old would change his spots was clutching at straws. So it wouldnt matter how much money he his given to spend in transfers the style wont change, because he cant change. Just like Guardiola his teams always play brilliant high tempo football which is a joy to watch, and whatever team he manages in the future his teams will play the same way as thats what he believes in.

Andrew Ellams
53 Posted 24/04/2018 at 13:08:45
My cynical side is starting to think he got an 18 month contract just in case we did go down. That way we would have some sort of continuity to come straight back. Now we're not he can go and we can bring in somebody who will hopefully move us forwards.
Phil Walling
54 Posted 24/04/2018 at 13:19:27
Allardyce seems to be becoming more acceptable with each non defeat. I see him becoming a fixture by default.

I'm fortunate in that I don't have to watch what he passes off as football but no doubt things will improve as he gets more of ' his own' players in for next season.

From far away Cyprus you all have my sympathy !

Tony Everan
55 Posted 24/04/2018 at 13:21:13

I think it’s more to with guaranteed bonus payment 6m when he inevitably gets a thank you for your services and sacked in 3 weeks time.

Steve Ferns
56 Posted 24/04/2018 at 13:33:33
It's nice to see some of Allardyce's supporters on here sticking up for him. I hope it remains respectful. Can we refrain from questioning other people's level of support for daring to question the manager?

Would a better fan totally support his team as it freefalls down the Divisions like Portsmouth? Or would a better fan be vocally criticising the club and trying to do something about it? When is it ok to criticise the club and still be a good fan?

For me, Allardyce is harming this club. I made it clear from before he came, I don't like the man, and I don't rate his abilities. He's been worse than I expected. My biggest fear was that he would come in, play a load of games in the way he did last night and easily reclaim 7th off Burnley. Then we'd have a full season of him doing that again, and coasting to 7th again. But not challenging the top 6, not doing well in the cups, and not going far in the knockouts in Europe. All the while signing dodgy Africans in questionable deals and selling off our best youth prospects and damaging the long term future of the club.

Allardyce has fallen far short of what I expected. He's not even got the defence sorted. Not his squad people say. The squad is crap people say. Well it cost £250m. It's a far better squad than anyone outside of the top 6, far better than Allardyce has ever had. I would expect a top manager to come in and get this squad back to 7th without a signing. Not all of the players will be to everyone's taste or standards, but there's enough quality there to build a side to win that best of the rest competition easily.

Allardyce has never won more games than he's lost in the Premier League. Not even with Bolton. And his Bolton side were dreadful to watch and played terrible football. So what if they had all those has-beens, did you actually watch them play? It was not champagne football. It was a war of attrition. Allardyce took Campo, a cultured centre half and made him into a defensive midfielder. So he went from a cultured footballer, to a clogger. Stelios was a decent winger on the highlights reels but he spent a lot of his time scrapping and kicking people. Okocha was frustratingly inconsistent and struggled to get into games. Djorkaeff was 34 when he joined and well past his best. he scored a handful of goals each season and it was hardly the French international we all loved watching in the 90s.

Last night was as good as you get from Allardyce. Hardworking, hardfought win. Solid at the back. Little going forwards, but got the job done. If that's enough for you, fair play to you.

I want to see Everton build to being the very best. I want to see us develop players, and play good football. Everton has always been a good footballing side. We aren't quite Spurs and their level of style over substance, but there's been quite a few times in our history when we've lost out to a worse team than us, and if we'd been more pragmatic we would have won a bit more. Surely then, you can forgive Evertonians for being Evertonians and wanting to hold the current lot to the standards we've always set?

Mark Murphy
57 Posted 24/04/2018 at 13:37:41
Thank you Brian Harrison
I was worried I’d developed altzeimers there trying to remember Bolton playing attractive footy!
Fucking yard dogs mostly!
Steve Ferns
58 Posted 24/04/2018 at 13:47:41
2001-02 Season

If you think people on here are rewriting history to make their own points, then why not go back, read the match reports from the Allardyce glory years. The match previews tell you what Michael and Lyndon think of Bolton. They don't know Allardyce will be our manager. They have no axe to grind, no agenda in what they write.

Even the year Bolton have Allardyce's best season, they are still viewed as a relegation fighting side having an excellent season, but still ultimately a side with negative tactics and unable to play good football. But sure, let's dismiss that and rose tint it all and watch a few skills and highlights and pretend Sam Allardyce really was the '90s Guardiola.

Johan Elmgren
59 Posted 24/04/2018 at 13:56:05
Steve #57 You echo my sentiments from first letter to last.

I didn't want Allardyce in the first place, when we appointed him I didn't believe he would be good enough for us, but I was willing to give him a chance. He has now shown what I knew all along, he is a shite manager with dated tactics, not by a million miles good enough for us.

He needs to get out of our club, every day he stays is declining the club. He should absolutely have NO say in any transferdealings in or out of our club. Him even talking about potential moves out (Garbutt, Lookman etc) of the club is harming us.

Allardyce out now!!

Steve Ferns
60 Posted 24/04/2018 at 14:06:56
Sam Allardyce Premier League Record:

Team =======P W D L F A Win%
Bolton -----------226 80 66 80 275 301 35.4%
Newcastle -----21 7 5 9 27 33 33.3%
Blackburn ------76 26 21 29 86 108 34.2%
West Ham ------114 35 28 51 129 151 30.7%
Sunderland ----30 9 9 12 40 44 30%
Crystal Palace--20 8 1 11 21 30 40%
Everton ----------21 8 6 7 23 26 38%
TOTAL ---------508 173 136 199 601 693 34%

Note Allardyce is one game away from being the first manager to lose 200 Premier League games. He's also lost the most games in the Premier League and conceded the most goals.

You can see that Everton is now actually doing much better than most of his other clubs, so this really is vintage Allardyce!

Ian Burns
61 Posted 24/04/2018 at 14:23:41
Steve Ferns - 57 - Good post, agree with every word.

Like many, I have been calling for Allardyce's dismissal and it just can't come quickly enough for me. If Newcastle had any sort of finish last night we could well have come away with nothing. What stands out for me - apart from the dross - is the players appear to have no motivation whatsoever. One could pick out 3 or 4 with some self pride in their game but as a team there wasn't any collective pride whatsoever. That's down to one man.

Tony Abrahams
62 Posted 24/04/2018 at 14:40:48
I can understand James, and Michael, to a certain degree, but I think Peter is correct, and Allardyce, will drive away a lot of Evertonians, if he's allowed to stay.

He knows how to get a team to defend, but I'm not sure Sam, knows how to get a team to attack though? He said himself it's down to the players, and the 60 yard diagonal ball, we kept hitting last night, definitely came from the Koeman style of anti football. (Pass, pass, pass? And these people get paid to offer us opinions?)

My own view, is that the league is poor. The top five have had it easy this season, because more and more teams, are starting to learn off our manager, and most are targeting certain games?

More money = less entertainment, and how many people could seriously take another season of not even being entertained for 15 minutes a game?

Steve Ferns
63 Posted 24/04/2018 at 14:47:14
Tony, could not agree more.

This is a very poor Premier League. Best League in the world my arse. Many people who panicked in October did so for good reason. We were shockingly poor.

I just don't think people realised just how bad everyone in the bottom half is. It was obvious to everyone else that Everton would find 3 wins in a row from somewhere and jump out of the relegation fight into midtable. Just ask the bookies, we were never worse than 11th favourites for relegation.

So if they didn't think we were going down, and their businesses relied on this being right (imagine if they lost that bet at the odds they were offering?) so surely this was accurate. Of course the bookies were right and we've been 11th worst for most of the season since, in other words sat in 9th.

Tony Abrahams
64 Posted 24/04/2018 at 14:59:20
Good point Steve, even if I was starting to get worried myself, because I actually agree with Allardyce, and think Unsworth, had found a difficult situation, starting to swamp him.

Not everyone would agree with that, but I remember reading that we had conceded the most goals, and this usually means, you are one of the worst teams!

Just watched Benitez, getting in his little dig at Allardyce, but if I was the Everton manager, I would actually take it as a compliment, because Rafa, said that you usually get a chance in a game, but it's difficult against this type of opposition. Contradictions? Life, like football, is absolutely full of them!

Paul Cherrington
65 Posted 24/04/2018 at 15:04:48
I don't really think relying on bookmakers to decide our future strategy is wise to be honest. They get things wrong plenty of times so it's not like they are the gospel when it comes to predicting future events. It would not be much comfort if we had done nothing and then gone down, only to say "Well the bookies said we wouldn't!''

I think lots of fans are re-writing history so they can continue to have a go at our manager. We were terrible until he arrived, we were getting sucked into a relegation battle we probably would have lost and he has saved us from that. To be where we are now from where we were when he arrived is a miracle in all honesty. Let's not forget, however bad the other teams were then, we were widely seen as the worst. and that was even by many of our own fans!

I think why fans like me are so disappointed in what is happening is not to question other Evertonian's support. It's simply disgust at the manner in which it is being done and with no real basis in fact.

I could understand it if we had lost every game since he took over and we had already been relegated, but guess what – we haven't. so for people to continue to make out he's a terrible manager is just plain wrong. the table doesn't lie and it shows he isn't the worst manager in the Premier League.

Interestingly, enough everyone's favourite plucky loser Eddie Howe sits below us with his Bournemouth team. strange that when he is apparently so much better than our manager. if he was that good he would be above us.

Let's get behind the team and manager for once and stop moaning about everything.

Mark my words – if all the people who want Allardyce out get their way, they will regret it. We will be in for another season of freefall next year playing too open and too easy. only this time we won't have someone like Allardyce to come and save us. but hey at least we might pass it 50 times inside our own box in nice patterns.

Steve Brown
66 Posted 24/04/2018 at 15:07:00
James Hill, your definition of a true supporter appears to be someone who should stoically accept mediocrity and not criticise truly terrible performances despite paying a lot of money to watch it. The standards you aspire to with Allardyce are to emulate Bolton and challenge for 6th. That says it all.

Supporters who criticise Allardyce have expectaions of Everton that far exceed yours. That's fine, but it's not right to criticise them for having standards.

Michael Lynch
67 Posted 24/04/2018 at 15:32:53
Steve Ferns et al - I'm not interested in Allardyce's stats at previous clubs. They're history, and they were different clubs in different situations. It's meaningless. Of course stats can be used to prove anything you want - for example, Allardyce has improved the points per game ratio at every club he has joined. For example, his record here, as I mentioned above, puts us in the Top Six since he took over.

The point that I am, and others are, trying to make, is that Allardyce has not failed in his mission here. Sure, any other manager might have achieved the same results, but we will never know that. You can only go by the games he has taken charge of while he's been here. And his record beats the likes of Burnley, Leicester and, yes, Arsenal in that time period. In fact it beats everyone except the Shite, the two Manchester clubs, Chelsea and Spurs.

Did I want him as our manager? No. Do I want him as our manager next year? No. But I do find the over-the-top attacks on him slightly embarrassing. Especially when people use his win record in 1959 or something to back up their own prejudices.

He's a bit of a twat, but he's done what he was asked to do in difficult circumstances. The poor fucker must look at where we are in the table and shake his head at the abuse he's getting. It's no wonder he's taking the piss out of us. The way he's been treated by the fans has set down a clear marker to other managers who may otherwise have been tempted to come here. We're going to have offer a huge amount of cash to get a decent manager after the way we've hounded out Allardyce.

Ray Robinson
68 Posted 24/04/2018 at 15:36:18
Steve Ferns, you're very good with your view of tactical setups and with the use of statistics but I can't help feeling you select your stats to suit the point you are making. I'm not one for trawling back through posts normally but on this thread alone you have claimed:

1. that Bolton played dreadful football. I agree up to a point - having Nolan standing on the goalkeeper's toes while Jaaskelainen launched balls into the penalty box was indeed neanderthal but I do seem to remember Bolton playing some quite attractive football the season that they finished sixth.

2. It was obvious to everyone that we would put three wins in a row from somewhere - not to me it wasn't. In 57 years of watching Everton, I thought we were clearly heading for the drop and couldn't see where the next win was coming from let alone three. Bookies usually get things right but not always. Besides the bookies were probably basing their odds on Everton changing their manager!

3. Had we beaten Burnley at home and drawn away we'd have finished above them. True but we didn't. If Newcastle had drawn twice against Everton, they'd be above us - what's your point?

4. Burnley did indeed have a dodgy spell before they beat us but they then won four league games on the trot, so they're hardly limping home

5. We easily beat Leicester at home - no we didn't, we were hanging on after Vardy's penalty, if I remember correctly.

My view on Allardyce, for what it's worth, is that irrespective of his reputation and what one thinks of him, he was brought in to do a job – which he has done successfully. So now we should thank him, part company and move on. No recriminations, just move on.

John Daley
69 Posted 24/04/2018 at 15:39:47
"I'm not sure Sam, knows how to get a team to attack though?"

Tony, at the risk of crushing whatever tiny kernel of doubt remains, I saw this earlier today:

Since Allardyce took over, we rank:

19th in the league for total shots

19th in the league for shots on target

19th in the league for chances created

19th in the league for number of dribbles

No wonder the crowd has less life in them than those arl fuckers at the beginning of Cocoon.

Kevin Moorcroft
70 Posted 24/04/2018 at 15:49:10
We were relegation material and, let's face it, who would have taken the reigns?

Sam has kept us in the top flight, guaranteed us £100million... so stop knocking him! You might not like him but, for God's sake, get a life, all you knockers. I'm sure the Hierarchy are relieved

Chris Gould
71 Posted 24/04/2018 at 15:51:25
Sam is correct when saying that he inherited a squad 5th from bottom. He signed on as manager before the WHU game. He may not have presided over that match, but he was employed as manager when we were 5th from bottom and 2 points above relegation.

No need to attack absolutely everything he says. The guy is constantly on the defensive and has been from the start. He has been treated unfairly. It's as if some fans are angry at him for having the audacity to take the job in the first place. The frustration should really be directed at those who employed him. He's simply doing the best he can in an impossible situation. He is what he is. What did everyone expect?

Martinez and Koeman were all slaughtered by some for their press conferences and post match comments. Now Allardyce is getting the same treatment but worse. These guys are ex-footballers not politicians.

He did his job to the best of his (fairly limited) ability and can leave now. No need for such personal abuse.

Johan Elmgren
72 Posted 24/04/2018 at 16:00:22
But Michael Lynch, according to Allardyce that mission isn't over. He wants to be here next season. That's what scares me. It's all well that "he kept us up", but my fear is that, if we're not making our voices heard, he will still be here next season. And that would truely spell bad news for our club longterm... That's why we (or at least I) agitate towards him.
David Barks
73 Posted 24/04/2018 at 16:02:10
Chris Gould,

Sorry, not true, as the Echo has pointed out.

“David Unsworth was the Everton caretaker-manager on the November night The Hammers were hammered at Goodison Park, while Sam Allardyce sat in the Main Stand, a day before being formally appointed Blues boss.

Unsworth selected the side. Unsworth delivered the tactics. And Unsworth coached the team from the touchline, proudly taking the plaudits from the Gwladys Street End.”

He had not become manager yet, he was not managing the team, it is not a win in for him in the record books. He inherited a team 13th in the table.

Michael Lynch
74 Posted 24/04/2018 at 16:16:49
Johan - yes, I understand that. The problem for us is always, do we stay classy and run the risk of not being heard, or do we march from the pub to the chippy like the red shite moaning about how hard done by we are. Sure, we have to agitate to get our voices heard, but I think we need to keep some sense of proportion. Allardyce is not the devil. He has performed adequately with a mediocre squad. Or you could say the squad has performed adequately with a mediocre manager, whichever way you want to look at it.

And, yes, he does want to stay so he can have a go at a season with his own squad. Or so he says. And I get that too. From his perspective he's kept his part of the bargain - we're sixth in the table on form - so he should be allowed a crack at a full season.

It's a problem for Moshiri. Allardyce has clearly lost the fans, but he's probably hit any targets that might have been agreed before he took over. Probably surpassed them. Still, if Arsenal can sack Wenger, I'm sure Moshiri can thank and sack Allardyce. But, like I say, Allardyce can confidently state that he's kept his part of the deal.

Ray Robinson
75 Posted 24/04/2018 at 16:26:18
Michael - nice to hear a voice of reason and proportion!
David Barks
76 Posted 24/04/2018 at 16:33:15
“do we march from the pub to the chippy like the red shite moaning about how hard done by we are.“

Let me think about that one. Do I want to have Allardyce here another season and continue the 20+ years without a single trophy and 30+ years without a league title, and allowing Kenwright to stay Chairman despite his decades of failure.

Or do I want to demand things of my club, see us win multiple trophies and compete for many others, preparing for a Champions League semifinal. Do I want to demand Rodgers is sacked after what was deemed a disappointment of a draw in the derby away from home and get Klopp in, to put in place an exciting brand of attacking football?

Nah, we don’t want any of that. We need to be nice, plucky little Everton. No banners and no mean words. Just thank everyone for their fine work and understand that we at Everton must know our place. Definitely.

John Davies
77 Posted 24/04/2018 at 16:39:53
Job done Mr Allardyce. You were bought in for one thing only - so let's hope you are asked to do nothing more. Goodbye and hopefully good riddance to the appalling football we have had to watch - but which you see nothing wrong with.
Liam Reilly
78 Posted 24/04/2018 at 16:40:57
1 shot on target and he's saying we dominated the game.

Worst football I've seen from Everton in living memory.

Brian Williams
79 Posted 24/04/2018 at 16:41:27
If, in a parallel world, with three games to go we were in the position we're in now BUT we had been set up and played to try and win against lowly opposition away from home, and played to try to win against teams higher up the league at home, and played SOME entertaining football along the way then Allardyce could rightly be due credit where credit's due.

The football has, however, for us season ticket holders and more so for those who I admire that travel away all over the country, been mind numbingly boring, unadventurous, and basically shite.

So while he may deserve some respect Allardyce also deserves to be moved on with the minimum of fuss after the final game against West Ham. Tell him now if that'll make him feel better, but just make sure you tell him Mr Moshiri ffs!

John McGimpsey
80 Posted 24/04/2018 at 16:48:49
Can anyone at ToffeeWeb tell us if Blue Bill and Co have secret accounts, as it seems they have?

Anyone giving Lardiola anything and suggesting he should stay on is either Bill and his gang or deluded.

Dave Abrahams
81 Posted 24/04/2018 at 16:51:18
Michael (75), re your second paragraph, do you really think Sam wants to stay on and work through his contract when he knows he will get the same money if he leaves at the end of this season, £9M for six months work versus £9M for eighteen months work.

Sam will take the first option, in my opinion, and laugh, dance and sing all the way to the bank, being honest he'd be a fool not to, being further more honest, Sam is not interested in plaudits he just can't get enough money, even at his age,

Michael Lynch
82 Posted 24/04/2018 at 17:05:32
Good question Dave @82, and one that I have wondered about. Not necessarily because of the cash on offer for him to walk away though. I genuinely believe that, all things being equal, Allardyce would want to remain manager, for the challenge and for his ego. The question is does he want to suffer another season of abuse from the fans, whatever he achieves? Because he must know, and we all must know, that if he stayed on and we were top of the table in October, a majority of the fans would be still be giving him shit, and moaning about non-existant hoofball.

Don't get me wrong, I'd like him to leave, but I just don't think he's been the worst manager we've ever had. The football has been no worse than it was under Unsworth or Koeman, and we've picked up more points. This season could have been an unmitigated disaster, instead it's just been a depressing shambles.

James Hughes
83 Posted 24/04/2018 at 17:27:52
John #70 I disagree with the last stat, 19th in the league for dribbles. have you seen the state of Sam's coat?
Michael Kenrick
Editorial Team
84 Posted 24/04/2018 at 17:42:26
John (#81),

We don't verify account owners but I have to wonder about your thinking on that score. When we did our survey, 93% wanted Allardyce gone. that means 7% were happy to see him stay for next season.

Do the maths... that was out of 12,094 votes, so 845 or thereabouts would be okay seeing Sam stay.

If you read posts on these threads, there are probably around 7% that are actually in support of Allardyce. Why would that mean they come from "Bill and Co" or are deluded???

In fact, how deluded do you have to be to believe that everyone actually thinks like you do on this score? Are people really so one-eyed that they cannot see there will be others taking a different view from them – no matter what the topic at hand?

Dave Abrahams
85 Posted 24/04/2018 at 17:45:41
Michael (83), I wanted Allardyce to come here, mainly because of his reputation for saving clubs in trouble, with the rider once he had gotten us to safety he could try and prove his oft saying that he was a very good manager who had never been given the chance to prove it.

During the pre Christmas games at Bournemouth and WBA and the home game v WBA I started having grave doubts about his ability to change from the way he had always managed, further games away to Watford and Burnley made me realise he wouldn't / couldn't change.

I honestly believe he will be happy to go now or at the end of the season.

Mark Taylor
86 Posted 24/04/2018 at 17:56:54
I would give Sam an 8/10 for his record to date. Lest we forget, a very large number of us, maybe pessimistically, felt we were nailed on to be relegated, so desperately awful were we and the results as well. Allardyce was brought in to reverse that and at the time, I though he was well suited to the task. And he has delivered. We are 8th.

The issue is and always was will he be the right person to take us forward, if we avoided relegation. Then, as now, I thought not. The reason for that is for the first time in my memory- well since the 80's at any rate- we now have a (part) owner prepared to flash the cash. Granted not in the Russian crook or Arab mafia's league but in a way that is a dramatic contrast to the desperate days under Moyes. And here I will give Gollum his due credit. He had two brass farthings to rub together, maybe one if teary Bill was in a particularly tight mood and still managed to deliver an average position of around 8th including the now near unthinkable of breaching the top 6 no fewer than six times. We even got into the CL.

So if we can manage that under what many think is a mediocre manager on little more than hot air, reasonable expectation is that we should be doing so again, given the cash being spent. But we currently look like having no chance of getting near to closing the gap and I personally find it hard to imagine that changing under Allardyce because there is no evidence of that being possible, however keen he may be to be in charge of a club with some money. His line of business is mid table at best.

That is why we need change, new and different expectations based around this new status. And perhaps we could fully move on by unclasping Kenwright's remaining grip on the club and let him follow big Sam and Walsh out the door.

Who to get in? If we discount Simeone as unrealistic and that the Tuchel bird has flown the nest, either Fonseca, Nagelsman or Jardim who seems to want out of Monaco or maybe even Villas Boas who I think had a bad rap in the PL last time around. If it is to be British, I think Howe deserves a chance.

Michael Lynch
87 Posted 24/04/2018 at 18:01:23
Dave @86, I think Allardyce's response would be to say "give me a chance over a full season, when I have had the chance to shape my own squad".

Clearly, the vast majority of us don't want to give him that chance. But I still think he'd stay if he could, rather than take the money and run.

My guess is that Moshiri will bite the bullet and give him the push, but it will be dependent on the response from managers currently being sounded out. I have nothing to back this up (but that never stops us on ToffeeWeb eh?), but if Wenger or someone of that stature said they'd come, Moshiri would throw Sam overboard. But I don't think he'll sack him if he gets a negative response from the top two or three on his list. I'd be surprised if someone like Eddie Howe were at the helm at the start of next season.

Chris Gould
88 Posted 24/04/2018 at 18:06:17
David #74,
I clearly stated that Sam did not preside over the WHU game. What I said was - that he was formally appointed before the WHU game. Therefore, when he states that he inherited a squad 5th from bottom, he is correct, even though he then sat in the stands for the WHU game.

It was made official the following day, but he was sitting next to the owner and had met all the players. It was already announced before the WHU game.

Anyway, doesn't really matter.

Chris Gould
89 Posted 24/04/2018 at 18:06:17
David #74,
I clearly stated that Sam did not preside over the WHU game. What I said was - that he was formally appointed before the WHU game. Therefore, when he states that he inherited a squad 5th from bottom, he is correct, even though he then sat in the stands for the WHU game.
John G Davies
90 Posted 24/04/2018 at 18:06:27
David, 77

I often disagree with you on here, I sometimes agree with you but I will tell you this.
You are 100% spot fucking on with your post.

Them twats across the park would have rioted a long time ago if they had to put up with the suit we have been served up for 20 years.
Watch them tonight, ignoring the bluff from Merseyside Police "anyone using flares will be arrested"
Same warning v City = no action.

They don't accept it and I can only hope we could show Moshiri and co that we are not having it.
I would advocate a mass walk out on 85 minutes of the last home game.
They can walk around an empty stadium on their "lap of honour"

Steve Ferns
91 Posted 24/04/2018 at 18:51:26
Ray, this is the guy we are giving £6m a year to. He's got the job on the back of quite frankly an atrocious record in the Premier League.

The way some of you go on, it was March and we were in the bottom 3, not October and we were 5th from bottom (and I will agree with Allardyce on his position when he took over – though I will not credit him for getting us to where he was at the start of his first match).

Surely, we could've held Allardyce in reserve, he was not going anywhere, and waited until March until getting into bed with him. We could have strengthen our position. Moyes took a 6-month contract to manage West Ham, why did we have to give Allaryce 18 months, it made no sense to me.

If the board could have given Unsworth until Christmas, or made an announcement that he had the job until the end of the season, then they could have done some behind the scenes wheeling and dealing and tried to get an ideal candidate in.

All the while, Allardyce would have sat on his lounger in Dubai awaiting our call. And don't deny it, he would have answered our call in March, if we were well, and truly desperate and the situation was real.

I wanted Koeman out. I think he was doing a terrible job and was making a complete mess of things. I envisaged a short caretaker period for Unsworth (much shorter than he had) and an appointment of another box office name manager who could right the wrongs done by the Koeman tenure.

Had I known then, what I know now, I would not have called for Koeman to go. I believe we would still be around where we are now. However, we would be playing better football, and maybe, just maybe, he'd have got his plan to start to work and we'd have a team with some of the flops in it and playing reasonably well.

Whoever the new guy is, I'll make sure I learn the lessons:
- don't get too carried away by a great start (Martinez);
- don't get too carried away by spending money (Koeman);
- be careful what you wish for (Allardyce).

John G Davies
92 Posted 24/04/2018 at 18:53:40
Not a chance of anyone being nicked Rob.
They are only being boisterous hahaha.
John G Davies
93 Posted 24/04/2018 at 18:55:21
Blue Bill interviewed just now on BBC.

In Moshiri I have got a wonderful "partner"

Oh ohh

Steve Ferns
94 Posted 24/04/2018 at 18:58:20
Partner in what John? Are they going to elope?
Colin Glassar
95 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:06:19
They can both jump in the Mersey as far as I’m concerned Steve. Tweedledumb and Tweedletwat!
Paul Tran
96 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:06:43
He's got us to 8th, all well and good. I think a more positive mindset would have got us higher.

If he's here next season, I'd have money on us finishing 7th/8th. The questions are, will he improve us, will he make us more attractive/exciting to watch? The evidence screams no to me.

If Moshiri regards this as a project, it can't include Sam.

Vinny Garstrokes
97 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:21:33
I am really not sure how I feel anymore...

If you had told me at the start of the season that we would possibly be finishing in 8th position then I would have been delighted. My opinion was that the Europa League and our initial fixtures really put us in the mire.

It will be interesting to see how Burnley cope given their squad restrictions. To not have to go through that again may sound unambitious but that is how I personally feel about it.

These days managers must have instant success and follow it up with a solid second season.

Can you imagine if TW and social media had been around for the 2003-04 season where we finished 17th on 39 points. Moyes would have not even lasted 2 seasons.

I think Martinez could have taken us on to greater things had he been given the same backing as Moyes and had the benefit of living without Social Media. I for one hope he wins the World Cup!!

Dermot Byrne
98 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:23:19
Vinny but shouldn't we be following Liverpool fans?

Ray Robinson
99 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:23:19
Steve, you're quite right to wonder where we'd have been if we'd stuck with Koeman – it's a thought that crosses my mind regularly. However, it's my opinion, contrary to yours (can't be proved or disproved) that we'd have been struggling big time and not necessarily playing better football. Like you and many others, the charge led by Darren Hind, I wanted Koeman gone.

I believe that we did offer Allardyce a six-month contract, but his being in the driving seat, refused it. I can't blame him for that – he was calling the shots. Would he have still been around in March if we'd have waited until then? I doubt it – some other relegation-haunted team would have snapped him up meanwhile. Besides why potentially wait the last minute to apply urgent treatment? Think of the uproar on here if we'd walked the tightrope until March.

No, I believe appointing Allardyce at the time was probably the correct decision. Now that he's achieved what he was asked to do, it's the right time to move on with another appointment. No histrionics, no recriminations, no insults – just action.

Dermot Byrne
100 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:23:21
Vinny but shouldn't we be following Liverpool fans?

Vinny Garstrokes
101 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:28:29
Dermot - Sorry to appear daft but not sure what you mean
Colin Glassar
102 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:29:57
Are Klopp’s teeth real or false?
Paul Tran
103 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:36:49
Ray, I think Koeman was imploding. Whether he felt let down by 'the recruitment team', whether he felt undermined by others at the club, whether he was and/or felt out of his depth, he had to go.

Whoever we get next has to have a positive mindset, has to do is on us winning rather than stopping the other team. That's what we've been lacking the past three years.

Kristian Boyce
104 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:37:48
Colin, he had them done at the start of the season. You can see the difference here:

He probably did it as he got quite a bit of stick in his first season due to his yellow chompers.

Dave Abrahams
105 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:41:17
Michael (#88), fair enough. Personally, I hope he is gone very soon. If he is kept on, I, along with a large majority of Everton fans, will not be looking forward to next season. In fact, I would be inquiring if I could have my money back on the season ticket I have bought.

It would be hard to do after a lifetime following The Blues, but I honestly don't think I could watch another season like this one and I'm absolutely sure that's what will be in store for us if Allardyce is still here.

Colin Glassar
106 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:42:04
They're bloody huge, Kristian!
Michael Lynch
107 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:50:49
Dave @111, agreed, though it's not just Allardyce that's ruining the match-day experience for me, it's the poor squad and the incompetent running of the club. And the state of the ground.

We deserve better.

Joe McMahon
108 Posted 24/04/2018 at 19:52:48
Paul (109) you say "Whoever we get next has to have a positive mindset, has to do is on us winning rather than stopping the other team. That's what we've been lacking the past three years".

Not three years, try three decades (apart from a short spell with Big Joe when we had Limpar and Kanchelskis, and we actually won a trophy).

Jamie Tulacz
109 Posted 24/04/2018 at 20:19:37
John G Davies (97) something more serious has happened though, which will probably gain more attention:

Jack Convery
110 Posted 24/04/2018 at 20:54:20
When is 13th five from the bottom - In Allardyce World. A bit like Pound World but with a lot more money but just as much crap.
Ian Fisher
111 Posted 25/04/2018 at 00:24:57
Since Allardyce came in, have we;

1) Played better football?

2) Looked like a team who play for one another?

3) Achieved a result beyond reasonable achievability? (I will concede a point at the other lot was a surprise...)

4) Trained and motivated players with his extensive backroom staff?

5) Seen a large improvement in any player already at the club when he arrived?

Well, for a reported £6M a year, we could have got any number of Managers in who have never won anything and probably paid them a lot less.

There is not even a glimmer of hope if the Allardyce reign does not end pretty soon.

Ron Marr
112 Posted 25/04/2018 at 00:30:53
He's won a few games but it was 'winning ugly'. Football is supposed to be entertainment but there's not much on show.

Seb Niemand
113 Posted 25/04/2018 at 05:47:19
Every word this man-thing speaks makes me feel shame. Shame in what the has made our club a party to and emblematic of, shame in his use of something good and decent like our club as a platform for his own invidious pocket-stuffing and shame that there is someone in the universe who has the power to make me feel this way about my club.

I'll tell you this, we can very well cut this cancer out of our belly quickly, but the illness it has brought and the wreckage it has wrought will take a miracle to cure and may kill us yet.

Geoffrey Williams
116 Posted 26/04/2018 at 08:11:35
People say he's organised our defence but it was a total shambles until Coleman, Baines and Jags returned. Has any player improved under his leadership? Of course not but a few have gone backwards. I always thought that he was a much maligned manager but I now realise that the man is all gas and no substance.

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