Everton U18s secure fantastic extra time win to progress in FA Youth Cup

Anyway Pita put Everton 1-0 up after a great run and pass from Graham but poor defending, surely not at Everton, let Ipswich equalise immediately.

If Moyes doesn’t put Graham on the bench at least with no real strikers doing the business he wants a good talking to off people in the club who must realise we’ve got a special player being wasted here.

Meanwhile, dithering dour dismal Moyes plays his fiddle with Everton scratching around for goals, but other clubs and fans are looking at this kid with envy —- get him in that squad for the Man Utd game or we can add dopey to the ‘D’s ’ after your name — get bleedin’ managing the team.

His finishing is well beyond anything our current strikers have.

We would mate, Moyes won't.

Maybe 5 minutes late sub at best for Braiden

Nobody could have argued had Ipswich run out winners in the 90 minutes imo.

Well done to the young Blues for sticking at it.

Personally I thought Graham was quite quiet up until his fantastic strike for the equaliser in stoppage time at the end of 90.

He was much brighter in extra time.

I think there’s a player there, definitely a composed finisher, and it’s good that’s he's been training with the first team.

Ready for a PL start? Not in my opinion. Needs further development.

Maybe a cameo or two off the bench to introduce him at some point.

It would be nice to actually see how they perform given a first-team chance before sending them out on loan.

It didn't matter who you played against, because every kid wants to win the FA Cup, and this is the junior equivalent, so I'd love to hear your overall opinions about the game mate.

Which team had the better system? Which team looked like it had been coached better? Which team looked more comfortable on the ball?

I played against Everton in this competition (three games, two replays) and I learned a few more little things about football during those games because Everton played with an impressive system that condensed the midfield and made it hard to play against.

I'd love to hear some views about the current set-up because I don't think we have been getting anywhere near enough quality coming through for a few years now.

Oh, hang on...

Both teams have some good individuals. With Everton 3rd in the Northern section of the U18s and Ipswich bottom of the Southern section, I was expecting this to be a bit more one-sided; it wasn't.

I'd love to know the respective ages of the two teams; Everton looked younger, and there are size differences at this age level. Ipswich had two giants at centre-back and centre-forward who caused Everton a few problems.
That said neither team played many long balls, both played it on the ground.

Everton started 4-3-3 and Ipswich were similar but there were lots of substitutions and systems changed to suit. I thought Everton's squad ran a little deeper and that may have made the difference in the end.

There was plenty of skill on show, lots of endeavour, and also plenty of mistakes. You don't see too many own goals where a goalkeeper heads it against the back of a defender's head (that made it 4-2 to Everton in extra time).

Credit it to them, both teams are coached to play football. You have to remind yourself sometimes that these are youngsters many I think 16 and 17.

Graham started wide left, and interchanges with our big centre-forward Loney to go through the middle sometimes (something Everton might try with Ndiaye and Barry).

He looks comfortable on the ball, not surprising as he is a regular at U21 level. He has an eye for goal, a striker's instinct, and you fancy him to score. Playing predominantly wide, he was dependent on others for service and so was sometimes on the periphery of the game.

Whilst coached well and playing to systems, football at this level lacks the robotic nature of Premier League football. I could count the number of passes across the back line. The game is more open, unpredictable, better to watch in many ways.

I get to a few academy games, at U18 and U21 level. I think it's changing a little at Everton but needs to go a little faster.
In recent years, I think Everton have underinvested at academy level, undervalued junior football. It will take a little time but I see signs that the club is taking academy football more seriously.

Sorry, Tony, a bit long-winded!

Not ready for a first-team game... while looking at the efforts of the only two strikers we've got.

Mike (9)

Give him some minutes when there's no longer anything at stake? Every game is important and fans want to be entertained and get someone to believe in — someone who will finish off these missed chances.

Graham can be that boy. Graham who you confessed you'd never heard much about a few months ago, well you've had a chance to learn about and watch and want him played only when there's nothing at stake!

A good post, not long-winded. Everton's team is very young and we had four good players missing with injury.

I never went to the game, find it hard now, especially in the dark nights, my mobility restricts me, but if we get further in the competition, I will make an extra effort to go and watch the lads. I've been watching this competition since the mid-fifties when it started.

Thanks for your post and attendance last night.

I just saw a few clips of last nights game and Graham scored a very good goal and laid on another. I don't see how he can be any worse than the 2 who play up top now. Yes its a massive step up from U21 football to Premier league but give him some minutes and let see what happens.

It was only exceptional circumstances where he planted the kid's arse on the first-team bench for the full 90+, so he could watch the big seasoned professionals 'perform'.

Apologies for missing the game, I got sucked into a home project and was still working on it in the dark at 9:30 pm as we finally had some dry weather!

I see Arsenal getting 15-year-old kids playing for the first team, Bournemouth played two teenagers against us.

Every team you look at seem to use the "if you're good enough, you're old enough" mentality... Except us.

Link

Well, who picked Harrison Armstrong ahead of Alcaraz and Rohl in the last few games?

Michael Kenrick is another who creates this nonsense, mind I can't remember an Everton manager Michael liked.

I don't think so.

Thanks for that little clip, Peter, what a lovely last minute equaliser that was. I was watching it thinking if that was our first team, the final pass would have gone wide instead of into the feet of Graham, who had found a nice little pocket of space to make room and shoot.

Ian reminded me why I always found FA Youth Cup games different though, because they were always more frantic and a lot less robotic than a lot of Central League games I used to play in around that time.

I’m old enough to have watched Wayne Rooney in the youth team, believing he was absolutely ready to step up.

He’s an extreme example and Braiden Graham is not Wayne Rooney.

He is a super finisher, someone who loves scoring goals ( why are forwards so scarce these days, in my day everybody wanted to be centre forward) and is a rarity in that he has that goal scoring instinct. More Jimmy Greaves than Joe Jordan for those of a certain vintage.

He’s very slight ( could do with a few of the bags of chips Wayne used to smuggle) and gives the ball away easily, often in wrong places.

He has talent, for me his step up needs to be gradual, managed, rather than throwing him in at deep end. Just my opinion.

How many were inside the stadium, Ian!?

Is it only Everton who are reluctant to start young men?

Brian @20 says it's a myth, citing the dubious case of Harrison Armstrong for proof, so I'm going to have to go through and delete all the messages like this that are promoting it as perceived truth, and try to get everyone back onside...

Or not.

My apologies for posting a myth.

I must have missed all the teenagers he started in his 12 years at the club.

Well, although I have voiced my doubts, but many on ToffeeWed claim Moyes has the final say. So Tyrique George, 19, played against Bournemouth; Armstrong, 19, came on. In the summer, he signed Aznou, Rohl and Dibling.

You are telling me he is that much of a secret that the rest of football haven't heard of him or prepared to take him to fire promotion, playoff or relegation scrap.

Not one League 1, 2 or Championship side wants him, but Moyes is denying him minutes. I think you guys are fucking tapped.

In the summer, he signed Aznou, Rohl and Dibling.

Given them plenty of playing time, hasn't he? Err... Not!

I'd say it was in the high hundreds rather than the thousands. It was a pretty cold and wet evening. Be good to see a few more there if we get another home draw in quarter finals.

And my gut feel is that he will get some game time next pre season with us then go out on loan, as Harrison Armstrong did.

Who told you no clubs had enquired about him?

Not a murmur of interest, and Everton supposedly prefering to keep him in youth football, rather than league experience.

If you believe that, then good luck to you. I don't.

It tells me, he isn't ready. Not my view, but that of the professional system.

"Take a lad ready for a European push" Ian.

What European push would that be?

Maybe the coaches think it's better development stepping up into the u21s this season?

I think we can all acknowledge our current strikers aren't very good. The u21s strikers are out on loan so Graham looks to be the next taxi in the rank.

Having seen him a couple of times I know that he is already a better finisher than both Beto and Barry. He is also a better footballer.

If we played a different system there is no reason why he couldn't get minutes for the first team. Vardy, sterling, Salah aren't the tallest or strongest but know where the net is. If we played 433 he could fit in. Pickford and Tarkowski could still twat the ball forward as we would have small nippy strikers chasing down the channels.

Maybe I am tapped or just fed up of seeing 2 night club bouncers amble after the ball week after week.

We’ve had a raw deal this year. In this last week the Fulham game hair pull went unpunished, not even a foul ( Keane, same, straight red, 3 game ban); we conceded a goal to Bournemouth when a player offside is deemed not to interfere whilst going for the ball ( Armstrong deemed offside versus Villa).

Moyes punished for stepping on pitch, no punishment for Arsenal, all running onto the pitch.

What conclusions can you draw?

Referees don’t know the rules?

Referees know the rules but decide, led by VAR to interpret them differently?

Everton far too frequently get a bum deal from refs and VAR?

No more mr nice guy, we need to start applying the pressure to PGMOL, others definitely would.

Sorry for going off piste, got to rant somewhere.

The ability vampires will do his best to knock any natural talent out of him,

I actually can’t recall any striker he has bought that was a success or he improved,

Apart from the yak maybe ?

I absolutely think that Braiden is getting a raw deal off Moyes, Graham is training with the first team so Moyes is not ignorant of his ability so I don't know why he hasn't been given one chance to prove his ability.

Mind you, Alcaraz has shown his and gets little game time or gets played wide, Rohl hasn't proved himself but in his last appearance he showed plenty of ability but hasn't been used since and now only has 12 games plus cup matches — oh cup matches, sorry about that, to show us how good he will be for us.

We have got him whether he is good, bad or indifferent going by the terms we signed him on which Moyes must have been a party to.

Can you post a link please

Can you send the specific link to teenagers please.

Save me a bit of time.

Thanks

Does this mean that you haven’t actually seen the lad play?

Genuinely interested to see it,i would have lost money on them stats tbh.

I too attended, indeed my first game at BM.

Who could fail to be impressed; even on a dreadful evening weather wise it was still magical in the gloom & certainly could be a bear pit if we get a side worthy of that level of commitment.

The young Blues, although generally a tad physically lightweight are full of confidence, skill & unity.

Plus, and this is a crucial ingredient, pace; loads of it throughout the side with a willingness to take players on; please note, seniors!

Strengths can be weaknesses in the inexperienced & the players who delight in trickery are inclined to 'chew it' as we called it in my playing days; that was so last night.

Turning precocious talent into judicious choices is the coaches job.

Unlike Ian I noticed that passing around at the back was prevalent; Its value is debatable at any level.

IO hope that adds a little as you clearly are very keen on this team & its progress in a competition dear to you.

Hopefully the kids get another home draw, because I’d definitely like to watch them play in the next round.

Link

Gives a bit more context to the praise, so helps judge a bit

Graham very involved in the first goal. I've not had the pleasure of seeing him live but only have concerns about his size; his ability is very obvious.

Bernardo Silva is about 3 foot six.

I think Bernard Silva is 3 foot 6.5ins.

Graham has 12 months yet...

He never looked out of place, a truly great player. Football is a far far softer sport

But we want him scoring goals, not living with glass ankles because they've pitched him to a level he isn't ready for.

And I know what rob means. Dewesbury Hall on the counter on Tuesday, and Barry didnt have a clue where to run, where as beto didnt bother.

Graham reminds me of jeffers quite a bit, perhaps has a bit more of a rounded game outside the box - less of a goal hanger. But can find space, and finishes with little backlift.

There you go, I've talked him up, and I was determined not to.

Some courage him mate.Read the book.

What a mate he had in Kevin.

I went to a rugby league game, got chatting to a lad on same table.

Told him I watched football.

Quick as a flash.. Whats the difference between a footballer and a rugby player"?

Dont know.

" One spends 90 minutes pretending he's hurt.

One spends 80 minutes pretending he's not hurt"

Akpan 18
Anichebe 17
Barkley 18
Baxter 16
Bidwell 16
Chadwick 19
Craig 19
Duffy 19
Fellaini 20
Forshaw 18
Gosling 19
Gueye 20
Hughes 20
McAleney 19
McFadden 20
Mustafi 17
Rodwell 16
Rooney 16
Ruddy 19
Vaughan 16
Vellios 18
Vidarsson 19

Not counting young untried talent like Coleman and Yobo, both 21 when they signed, and Osman 22 when he made the first team shirt his own.

Tony Hibbert made his debut under Walter playing a handfull of games over 2 seasons but became a regular under Moyes at the age of 21.

Some of your list are not teenagers?

I added some 20-year-olds in as well as they're still young lads (U21s) who Moyes recruited and were coming to the Premier League as fresh blood.

Start with Moyesie, why do we even try and constantly play out with these full-backs, especially when O'Brien keeps checking back?

Look at how deep we are dropping, look at the space in the middle of the park. We are supposed to move up and down as a team, so why does it sometimes look like a Mexican standoff?

Don't get me started on movement, or why the centre-forward is so often isolated. Other than that, we are doing fine... for a club that is absolutely desperate for stability.

Would you now agree that it wouldn't hurt Moyes, us and Everton if he was given some minutes in the first team now — like next Monday if we are struggling, desperate for a goal?

He needs to be training with the first team (and seeing how he looks -- perhaps he will have the same Rooney thought that these are shite) playing in behind the doors friendlies, probably cup minutes, and then a good loan either in the Championship or perhaps Dutch or Belgian League.

There needs to be a plan for not a debut or a couple of games, but how you can have a player that will go on and make 10, 20, 50, 100 appearances. They may well decide he can be fast tracked missing steps, but I don't believe that assessment can be made now.

I personally think U18s to Premier League is too big a jump. Hardly any do it, and there's a big reason -- the gap is enormous.

I look at how the club have got Branthwaite and Armstrong right. And look back to Coleman, Osman & Stones. These lads were given time, pressure off, and the benefits played out. Confidence rising.

He's a prospect for sure, there's a case for some minutes of introduction, carefully managed. He definitely needs to improve his physicality, he was regularly out-muscled by Ipswich's young defenders.

It was pleasing to hear that Leighton Baines was in attendance the other evening. I heard a few times that Dyche and entourage never attended any academy games.

Plus there are others under consideration; I'm sure we have a few with potential who might step up in due course but when goal scoring is a first team issue, and you have a youngster who's netted 16 times so far this season, then it's inevitable his name is top of list.

I doubt I'd be asking if the strikers we have were doing a decent job but they are not and most fans are up to here with the football being thrown at them.

The lad just might add a bit of control and score a couple of the chances that are being wasted now, a change is as good as a rest and most fans could do with a break -- same as some players.

I know the academy is there to provide players, but it has be as right for the player as well as the club.

I know it is meant in the right way, and I get the enthusiasm, but the coaches and scouts make grown decisions not populist sound bites.

Look at the injuries Rohl picked up. He is a lot further ahead in his development, and his body couldn't cope in the Premier League at the beginning. I'd imagine that the Bundesliga is a nearer to the Premier League than U18s. You don't want years of injuries down the track -- Owen, Dyer, etc.

It has also got me thinking about managers in general because I'm not sure if John Stones would have developed the same way under Moyes like he did under Martinez...

Mad really when you consider that one manager was a centre-back during his own football career and the other was a central-midfield player who never really concentrated on defending anywhere near enough.

No wonder I often say that 'contradiction' is the biggest word in the dictionary!

Yes, fair enough, you are looking at this debate with players' interest at heart and that's fine but scouts and coaches making grown up decisions make an awful lot of mistakes as well as good ones.

I wouldn't mind betting you've said to yourself — Why did we sign so-and-so? Why is the manager picking him?? Why isn't so-and-so getting a game... or not getting a game???

I believe certain players have a special talent and can't be wrapped in cotton wool all the time, no matter what age they are. We were lucky that Rooney was well able physically as well as supremely talented — that's why he forced Moyes to play him even though he was reluctant to do so far too often.

I know Braiden is not another Wayne — I doubt we'll see one of them anytime soon, but I believe he can be a great player for us — now — when we are crying out for some goals off anyone. I think he will provide them now to cheer us all up now and again —- is that too much to ask?

Maybe it is if asking Moyes!

Bringing him on slowly, training with the first team squad, and preparing him for next season will be better for him than throwing him in today with high expectations.

Would you take him?

I think he's the best English footballing central defender I've ever watched, and yes, I'd be intrigued to see John Stones play for Everton again.