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Everton News, Season 2011-12

Blues edged out in extra time

26/10/2011 |  97 Comments: First  |  Last

Everton hauled themselves back into this Carling Cup Fourth Round tie against 10-man Chelsea with a Louis Saha goal in the 82nd minute, could have won it when Denis Straqualursi somehow missed from six yards and then lost it in extra time when Jan Mucha could only parry into the path of Daniel Sturridge. The striker made no mistake in converting the rebound six minutes from the end and the Blues were sent out of the competition.

Ultimately, it was a game that turned with the dismissal for a second yellow card of Royston Drenthe in the first period of extra time. Everton had the momentum with an extra man but they couldn't find a second goal before the Dutchman went in with a second clumsy challenge of the night and referee Lee Mason had little option but to bring the teams level in terms of personnel with a red card.

David Moyes named a fairly strong side with Diniyar Bilyaletdinov, Louis Saha, Tim Cahill, John Heitinga and Jan Mucha coming into the side as changes from the team that started at Fulham.

The home side started well, with Saha in particular looking in the mood in the first 10 minutes, the Frenchman forcing a terrific save from Ross Turnbull before testing the Chelsea 'keeper from 30 yards with another well-struck effort.

But that good opening looked to have been ruined when John Heitinga dived in with an ill-advised tackle in Nicolas Anelka, sending the striker tumbling to the turf and prompting referee Lee Mason to award a penalty.

Anelka himself stepped up to take the spot kick and sent a wave of relief around Goodison Park when he chipped wide of Mucha's goal.

Barely two minutes later, the away fans were baying for another penalty when Sylvain Distin tripped Anelka right on the edge of the box but the referee waved play on.

Heitinga then drilled a free kick narrowly wide before Malouda put Lukaku past Heitinga and Mucha helped his shot across goal behind for a corner.

Bilyaletdinov shot straight at Turnbull from Drenthe's centre but just as the Blues were looking to get back on top, a terrible error by Mucha gifted the visitors the lead when he allowed Salomon Kalou's soft chip to run through his hands.

Distin headed inches wide from a corner in first-half stoppage time sending the Blues into the break a goal down.

It was increasingly lively stuff in the second half with Hibbert replacing Neville, until it culminated in Chelsea keeper Turnbull getting a red card for bringing down Saha. Baines waited for Cech to replace him, and fired it straight down the middle, enabling Cech to save but the rebound came back to Baines and he smashed teh rebound straight at Cech again.

Everton piled on the pressure, a great Bilyaletdinov header requiring another superb save to keep Everton at bay. Drenthe was another force pushing Everton forward.

It seemed, though that Everton's surge after Chelsea were down to 10 men ran out of ideas until Moyes finally gave up on Bily and put Coleman into the fray. And it wasn't long until a perfect cross from Coleman was met with a deft header by Saha, who loves scoring against Chelsea, 1-1 with 7 mins to go extra time...

Coleman was the catalyst who fired Everton forward again and again, searching for a winner that would avoid the extra time non-one wanted. It was end-to-end frenetic stuff in a breathless last few minutes. But Everton could not get past Cech again and the tie went into extra time, where Drenthe was ejected for a second yellow card.

David Moyes named a fairly strong side with Diniyar Bilyaletdinov, Louis Saha, Tim Cahill, John Heitinga and Jan Mucha coming into the side as changes from the team that started at Fulham.

The home side started well, with Saha in particular looking in the mood in the first 10 minutes, the Frenchman forcing a terrific save from Ross Turnbull before testing the Chelsea 'keeper from 30 yards with another well-struck effort.

But that good opening looked to have been ruined when John Heitinga dived in with an ill-advised tackle in Nicolas Anelka, sending the striker tumbling to the turf and prompting referee Lee Mason to award a penalty.

Anelka himself stepped up to take the spot kick and sent a wave of relief around Goodison Park when he chipped wide of Mucha's goal.

Barely two minutes later, the away fans were baying for another penalty when Sylvain Distin tripped Anelka right on the edge of the box but the referee waved play on.

Heitinga then drilled a free kick narrowly wide before Malouda put Lukaku past Heitinga and Mucha helped his shot across goal behind for a corner.

Bilyaletdinov shot straight at Turnbull from Drenthe's centre but just as the Blues were looking to get back on top, a terrible error by Mucha gifted the visitors the lead when he allowed Salomon Kalou's soft chip to run through his hands.

Distin headed inches wide from a corner in first-half stoppage time sending the Blues into the break a goal down.

It was increasingly lively stuff in the second half with Hibbert replacing Neville, until it culminated in Chelsea keeper Turnbull getting a red card for bringing down Saha. Baines waited for Cech to replace him, and fired it straight down the middle, enabling Cech to save but the rebound came back to Baines and he smashed teh rebound straight at Cech again.

Everton piled on the pressure, a great Bilyaletdinov header requiring another superb save to keep Everton at bay. Drenthe was another force pushing Everton forward.

It seemed, though that Everton's surge after Chelsea were down to 10 men ran out of ideas until Moyes finally gave up on Bily and put Coleman into the fray. And it wasn't long until a perfect cross from Coleman was met with a deft header by Saha, who loves scoring against Chelsea, 1-1 with 7 mins to go extra time...

Coleman was the catalyst who fired Everton forward again and again, searching for a winner that would avoid the extra time non-one wanted. It was end-to-end frenetic stuff in a breathless last few minutes. But Everton could not get past Cech again and the tie went into extra time, where Drenthe was ejected for a second yellow card.

With four minutes left until penalties, Sturridge followed up on a Malouda shot Mucha had saved to tuck it into the corner and seal the tie for the Londoners, ending Everton's futile quest for this trophy once again.

Original Source: ToffeeWeb

Comments

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Richard Harris
1   Posted 26/10/2011 at 22:52:28

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How much longer do we have to put up with Moyes and Kenwright? We have no money and are dull and predictable. I keep hoping that it will get better but it just gets worse....
Joe McMahon
2   Posted 26/10/2011 at 22:53:42

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Don't blame Drenthe for getting sent off guys, we lost because Moyes didn't make the changes earlier when they went down to 10 men.
Ian Edwards
3   Posted 26/10/2011 at 22:55:18

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If it wasnt for Zamora it would be 5 defeats in a row. .....with a 6th to come on Saturday.

What did Moyes say to the team when Drenthe got sent off?. Did he forget they were down to 10 men. The man is clueless and should be ragged round the boardroom in the morning and then told to fuck off with a P45 in his hand.
Anthony Jones
4   Posted 26/10/2011 at 22:57:57

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Prime opportunity to play Vellios and Barkley for most of the game. Chelsea side was second string. Yet again we see the axis of boredom in Fellaini, Rodwell and Cahill. Coleman and Drenthe in the starting line up would have been exciting to see also. It's so sad to see these players wasted. Will they ever get a chance to all play together in an attacking line-up? Will they fuck. Moyes Out!
Steve Smith
5   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:01:52

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Don't blame Drenthe? But it was his sending off that evened the game up and gave them the initiative. Stop using everything and anything to slag Moyes and Kenwright off, it gets really tiresome. Was it moyes fault that Bily and Strachey missed sitters?
Steve Guy
6   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:06:20

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Bag of shite
Ryan Holroyd
7   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:06:36

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"If it wasn't for Zamora it would be 5 defeats in a row. .....with a 6th to come on Saturday"

Already writing off a game before its started.
Anthony Jones
8   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:07:46

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Steve, Drenthe was our most effective player. Damn right dont blame him! Oh, and Bily was signed by Moyes for close to 9 million pounds, though you've got to feel for him given that he is persistently played out of position. Now that's tiresome.
Ian Edwards
9   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:10:05

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Ryan

So you are saying that we are going to win then? With this manager and tactics??

Moyes apologists like you are keeping this man at the club and then we have to put up with defeats like tonight.

Why don't you get back to your train platform and your notebook.
Jamie Carroll
10   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:13:53

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For me the biggest let down was seeing Mucha in goal, yet the rest of the team was considered a first team... Unbelievable! The fans are getting cheated... so if Everton progressed to the last eight, would Moyes recall Howard in goal??? ? you bet he would!
Yusuf Bobat
11   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:18:49

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I think the only person you can blame for today's defeat is Jan Mucha,his errors cost us the two goals, I can see now why Moyes hasn't been playing him.
Ryan Holroyd
12   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:20:30

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Who knows what will happen on Sat Ian. But I'm not writing a game off before its started. In all probability United will win because they have far better players than us.

It's tits like you who hold this club back because idiots like you blame a manager and not the real person who is killing us.
Brian Waring
13   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:21:36

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As soon as Chelsea went down to 10 men, Moyes should have made the changes.

Ryan, if the Mancs turn us over, you will be one of the first on here with the excuses for Moyes.
Peter Mcauliffe
14   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:22:50

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When is that Ginger Twat going to start playing with two forwards at least at home?

He's so fucking negative ? all he thinks about is how to stop the opposition playing. The sooner he fucks off, the better.
Ryan Holroyd
15   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:27:00

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Brian. United have got far better players than us. That's not an excuse but a stone cold fact.

You tell me a manager who you would GUARANTEE would do a better job than Moyes and I would say get rid. I can't see a manager out there who is available and free cos let's be right we can't afford compensation who is better.
Any tit can say "Moyes out" that's easy. Getting someone better and who is free is a different story
Brian Waring
16   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:37:12

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Ryan you can't call someone a twat because their opinion is that the Mancs will turn us over.

John Ford
17   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:38:33

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Agree Ryan. no money, no club leadership, mediocre and ageing squad yet its still all Moyes fault.

Nah, our problems lie elsewhere. Mediocre performances are a direct result.
Brendan McLaughlin
18   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:47:16

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Brian #15
You can't call an Everton fan a "twat" cos he's writing us off against United before a ball is even kicked. Jesus all Davy Moyes has to do is say United have a good team and he's automatically labelled a defeatist!
Anthony Jones
19   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:52:37

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Ryan, you are right any tit can say moyes out, so I will say it again: moyes out!

Your request for a guaranteed better replacement is bollocks. You cant guarantee you wont get hit by a bus tomorrow but you will still go out at some point.
Dave Lynch
20   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:58:47

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Cahill brought absolutely fuck all to the table tonight. Mind, other than the odd headed goal, he brings fuck all most weeks.

They where on the rack tonight and Moyes fucked it up again with his mismanaged substitutions.
Peter Cummings
21   Posted 26/10/2011 at 23:54:35

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Chelsea down to ten men and a game there for the taking yet the old problems take hold: sitters missed and, once again, goals gifted.

I have never been too confident in Howard but, after Moochers performance, even he looked like a world beater. And once Drenthe was off, the writing was on the wall... at least I thought it would go to pens, but it wasn't to be and all we have to look forward to now is winning the REAL cup and a surge up the ladder to take us into Europe, starting on Saturday when we put another six past the Mancs...

Bite the bullet, lads.
Nick Entwistle
22   Posted 27/10/2011 at 00:06:14

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Just saw the highlights. Drenthe shouldn't have been sent off, and Baines' penalty was poor. When you blast it down the middle you got to wait for the dam goalie to move out the way. All too expected.

God knows what we'll do on the weekend but we don't need people preferring us to lose just to be proved right on Moyes, and that's how a lot of people are sounding in their comments.
Lori Fekete
23   Posted 27/10/2011 at 00:14:30

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Fuck sake, if it wasn't for that clown in goal and a shit load of missed chances we would have easily won.
Moyes out blah blah blah
Chris Lawlor
24   Posted 27/10/2011 at 00:13:32

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Depressingly, expected that result and there it is. This current plight is etched on Moyes face in every post match interview, even after the Fulham game he looked morbid. I get the feeling he would jump ship if he could and most of us would help him over the side... but it seems neither side is going to get their wish anytime soon....Now that's depressing!!
Michael Kenrick
25   Posted 27/10/2011 at 00:25:01

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Ryan,

It used to be unconscionable for Evertonians to admit defeat before a ball was kicked. However, our current manager has set a new low standard with his recent defeatist approach in pre-match interviews.

But by all means you keep on supporting him. After all, he hasn't got the players, has he?
James Flynn
26   Posted 27/10/2011 at 00:28:20

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Losing sucked. But I saw us improving in the attack. Mucha? Damn, keeper, the ball hit you in the hands.

Looking forward to saturday. 6 points from 6th place with a game in hand.

COYB
James Flynn
27   Posted 27/10/2011 at 00:37:05

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Yusuf (11) - Dead on. However little game-time a goalie gets, the ball hitting your hands should be a save, not a goal.
Nicholas Randall
28   Posted 27/10/2011 at 00:35:24

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It's over for another year for the League Cup. Very frustrating. Hopefully next year, however I don't think Everton are ever going to win the League Cup.

I watched some of match on the highlights programme on the BBC and Mark Bright was saying that had Jan Mucha not been playing, Everton would have won. I can't really say as I didn't see enough of the match, but if Mucha did play badly then Moyes really should have played Howard.
Chris Lawlor
29   Posted 27/10/2011 at 01:01:58

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Hindsight is truly a wonderful thing Nicholas.. Perhaps if he knew Drenthe would get sent off and Cahill would miss an open goal he wouldn't have started them either!?
Dalziel Kane
30   Posted 27/10/2011 at 00:51:04

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I'm in two minds about tonight.

First off, it's a missed opportunity. I get tired of being beaten by those plastic no-marks in domestic cups every now and again, even if we did have our own moment earlier this year with the shoot-out success. Only two finals to show for it since its inception in 1961 which is a lousy record for a club of this stature, and it would've been nice to have got through to the last eight and take it into subsequent league fixtures.

By the same token, the League Cup represents a rather trivial piece of shit silverware... slight sour grapes on tonight maybe, but you know damn well it's been a third-rate competition for as long as anyone can remember.

Was I slashing at my wrists when the extra time slipped away? Hardly; sure there was disappointment, but I just felt frustration more than anything else. Man City look good for the League this year so Chelsea can go after the League Cup, a plastic competition for plastic clubs, and where were you when you were shit?

Speaking of such, got notice Liverpool got through tonight too... not the best of nights was it? Saw some mistakes by Mucha tonight; we came close to getting that elusive winner before 90 minutes, some nonsense with a laser pen before they did a job on us late on in extra time. I never could stand those plastic charlatans and tonight doesn't offer any assistance.

Frustration and a little sad I was, but I'll be over this soon enough. The FA Cup remains now, and probably a win at Arsenal in Round 3 before Moyes makes a mess of it in a home replay with Havant and Waterlooville after that.

Won't be reading any tabloids tomorrow, I don't need any saturation coverage of tonight's victors or fuck-off red shite heroics at the Brittania Stadium. All said, a disappointing evening.
Russell Buckley
31   Posted 27/10/2011 at 01:45:23

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I'm not super anti Moyes but I just can't understand him at times.

Reading his reaction to the result he claims that Tim Cahill was carrying an injury through the game. He has said Tim is playing with an injury in a number of matches.

I'm an Aussie and a huge fan of Cahill for what he has done for both Everton and the National team. But if he isn't fully fit and not able to play to his usual high standard why keep flogging him. Sit him out for a couple of weeks and let him come back 100%.

I guess the difficulty for Moyes is he would actually have to play Billy in his most suited position or give Barkley a run.
Eric Myles
32   Posted 27/10/2011 at 01:49:09

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"Prime opportunity to play Vellios and Barkley for most of the game"

I think we saw against Filham that Vellios struggles to play half a game, never mind most of it.
Roman Sidey
33   Posted 27/10/2011 at 02:23:12

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Russell, I too am tearing myself in two when regarding Cahill these days. As much as he's been a hero so often, he really isn't as valuable to the team tactics as a lot of our other players.

All the right things have been said on this thread already; Moyes took too long to make subs after Chelsea went a man down, Mucha probably shouldn't have been playing, the list goes on.

My take is quite similar. Moyes apologists keep retorting to criticism over his team selections that the manager sees players every day and, therefore, knows who is right to play and who isn't. Well, that means he sees Mucha every day too. Defend his selection.

Others have pointed out that certain players missed dead cert opportunities to score. Well, had Moyes made his subs (the last two were probably the right subs to be fair, just timed terribly) earlier, they might have had more chances, thus, more of a probability of burying one or two.

Finally, would love to see the pro-Moyes brigade explain Hibbert on for Neville after 45 and 0-1 down...

Moyes out.
Mick Davies
34   Posted 27/10/2011 at 03:07:47

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So Moyes can't be blamed for Mucha? Then who bought him, and who allowed Ruddy to go? That lad is Keeping Norwich in the top half of the table, he's young, agile and brave, and we had him here.

As for tactics, as soon as Drenthe was sent off (and Moyes should have subbed him before it happened) and the numbers were equal, we retreated behind the wagons and allowed the visitors to just walk around our half of the pitch without any opposition. Moyes, Round, Stubbs ? all defenders... get Dunc in the dugout!
Peter O'Connor
35   Posted 27/10/2011 at 07:49:31

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Sadly Tim Cahill has passed his sell by date - time to move on.

Tactics last night were defeatist from the outset - trying to keep the score down even when Chelsea were down to 10 men.
When the nutter Drenthe (he's an accident waiting to happen) got himself sent off Moyes gave up and we sat back to defend for penalties.

Stracqualursi looks like a desparation signing and I don't get why he was brought on rather than someone we know can score - Velios.

Here's something new - the ref had a fairly decent game, although he was taken in by Luiz amateur dramatics!
Ged Simpson
36   Posted 27/10/2011 at 09:09:36

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Moyes In!
Mark Dunford
37   Posted 27/10/2011 at 08:49:31

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We're still in the midst of a horrible run of fixtures with the final two to come. Yes, I accept there is a strong possibility we will lose to Man U and possibly Newcastle who are on a roll. It doesn't mean the team is full of dire no hopers and the manager is a dullard. It is simply a reflection of where Everton are now.

Ian Edwards says "if it wasn't for Zamora it would be five defeats in a row.. with a sixth to come." Well, Zamora missed before we scored twice to win 3-1. What does Ian want?

Last year Moyes was accused of overplaying his hand before the start of the season, but this season he is rightly being more cautious - providing simple comparisons (Man Utd have a stronger squad than Everton) which are more or less impossible to disagree with. Is there anyone who doesn't think Saturday will be a difficult game for Everton?


Moyes' reception at Fulham on Sunday suggests the crowd appreciates his efforts.
The relentless downbeat, miserabilist naivety of some Toffeeweb contributors is increasingly at odds with the reality. Look at the world as you find it and not as you'd like it to be. It is the only way to make things better.

Tony J Williams
38   Posted 27/10/2011 at 09:15:57

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A lot of the usual posters with their fantastic formations and reasons why we lost......after the game is finished.

Everyone screaming for Straqula....he is cack, everyone screaming for Mucha to get a chance....he is cack and cost us the game......but no!!!, Moyes should never have played him etc etc

Someone has already turned on Drenthe, 3 days is a long time in footy eh?

Everton fans, don't you just love em?
Martin Mason
39   Posted 27/10/2011 at 09:30:04

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Good comment Mark.
Sam Morrison
40   Posted 27/10/2011 at 09:39:23

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Mark (37) and Tony (38) very good points both.

TW has a habit of converging into a simplified line of pro and anti-Moyes, maybe because that's what forums encourage, I don't know. Both parties pick the facts that aid their arguments.

I think Moyes is the man to lead us out of this particularly shitty stage - but not the current Moyes, the one who seemed full of fight, defiance, and grit. I wish he'd come back. I miss the guy who fronted up to Fergie on the touchline, who said after we finished 4th that he wanted to finish higher next season. Who bawled out Blomqvist when he threw a hissy fit for being subbed.

I don't mean I want ludicrous naivety and I can understand his reticence to come across that way. But his caution - as a leader away from the pitch - is beginning to seem jaded and lugubrious. And yes, defeatist.
Adam Bennett
41   Posted 27/10/2011 at 10:21:06

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Firstly, on Drenthe?s sending off, the first yellow was for dissent, in which he looked as though he pretended to kick the ball away. In extra time Daniel Sturidge DID kick the ball away and didn?t get booked. Where the hell is the consistency in that?

Anyway, the reason we lost this game, and threw away yet another great opportunity of winning a cup competition, is because David Moyes is a fucking shitbag.

At home. Against 10 men (2nd string 10 men I might add) and it takes him until the seventy second fucking minute before he brings an extra forward on. And to cap it off, when he does, it?s the wrong fucking one!

The moment they went down to 10 men, Moyes should have changed things around, mixed things up, brought an extra forward on straight away. But oh no, our esteemed manager decides instead to stand on the touchline with his hands in his fucking pockets, letting Chelsea?s defence sort themselves out without much pressure being imposed on them.

And could someone explain to me what was the fucking point in the Neville / Hibbert substitution? Seriously, you don?t make a like for like swap like that when your getting beat in a cup tie. The point in changing things is to do just that?. CHANGE THINGS!

We are not going to win the league, we are not going to finish in the top four, so why not go all out in the Carling Cup and try and grab some silverware?

Who remembers teams who finish 5th or 6th or 7th? Teams are remembered for winning things, and last night is yet another example that David Moyes will never win anything.

He?s done a great job over the years, even though he?s done my head in from time to time, but for some reason this season he?s doing my head in nearly every week.

Where has our hungry, fiery, driven, take no shit, manager gone?
Conor Feeney
42   Posted 27/10/2011 at 10:12:43

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37-40 Good sensible comments.
Brian Waring
43   Posted 27/10/2011 at 11:08:16

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We get beat, its down to having no money etc, we win, Moyes is a fucking genius. I'll say it again, the man is untouchable.
Steve Syder
44   Posted 27/10/2011 at 10:58:57

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The reason the crowd seems to be behind Moyes is because those of us who think he should do one asap have stopped going.

Life's too short to watch the negative shite Moyes turns out every week.

It's no wonder they miss sitters - I bet training sessions only use the defensive half of the pitch.
Chris Butler
45   Posted 27/10/2011 at 11:08:58

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I think the fans are generally becoming more and more frustrated. The inablity to beat a second-string Chelsea team with 10 men proves how bad we are.

I believe the fans are becoming sick of this type of defeat. Games are now far too predictable, hence why I rarely attend. I've never ever gone to a derby game before this year expecting to lose.

The same old money arguements will be mentioned, but the simple fact is, like with 95% of our defeats nowadays, we only have ourselves to blame. Numerous missed chances, a penalty miss, a goakeeping howler, and a stupid sending off.

Against Chelsea a few weeks ago, we made 3 stupid defensive errors to let them in. We're the architects of our own downfalll which is why I've given up going anymore. BK is destroying the club by not selling the club, Moyes by not changing his tactics for the last 9 years, and the players for making individual stupid mistakes.
Tom Dodds
46   Posted 27/10/2011 at 11:04:21

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No 41 Has nailed it. This isn't hindsight, but when I heard he was throwing Mucha in goal, I thought (and the fans around me went)... "WHAT THE ?..."

"YES... against the likes of Aldershots & Port Vales etc....,"

"NO, we're playing Chelsea, David!!!"

And you dont blood a newbie against Chelsea either, David. unless he's in the same class as the young lad who screwed Arsenal on a certain day many moons ago...

There's not many if any good managers waiting in the wings, and especially who would live under Kenwright, so...

One wish...Try Alan Irvine as second in command.
Brian Waring
47   Posted 27/10/2011 at 11:39:24

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In regards to Moyes having you scratching your head, he plays Cahill whilst carrying an injury, why?

Its not as if Cahill has been on fire, and it was worth taking the chance.
Tony J Williams
48   Posted 27/10/2011 at 11:28:28

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Brain, he is far from untouchable but neither is he the sole reason for every single negativethat happens in a game.

The oft trotted out "but he picks/buys them" doesn't hold water either because the normally reliable Cahill misses a sitter, how is this Moyes's fault. Mucha, an international goal catches a ball and then throws it into the net and then parries a shot into the path of a forward. How does a manager get the blame for that?

As alwways on here, it's the managers fault no matter what, the players get away with it. Baines, normally so deadly from the spot, pathetic pen and worse follow up....I suppose it's Moyes's fault because he is too defensive....hang on, he is a defender...taking a pen.

I could go on but I won't. The manager has numerous faults but people on here get accused of apologising for him when all they are doing are pointing out the players faults and saying that they are also a massive reason to why we lost, not just Moyes.
Paul Foster
49   Posted 27/10/2011 at 11:53:27

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Spot on, Tony J Williams. Moyes, like every manager and every player, deserves flack. But it's just moronic to criticise him blindly.

Somebody above said "if it wasn't for Zamora we'd have lost 5 on the bounce".

Well by the same token, if it wasn't for Baines / Mucha we'd have won two on the bounce. If not, why not?

Cherry picking incidents to make Moyes look bad is just a bit ridiculous.
Brian Waring
50   Posted 27/10/2011 at 11:52:54

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Yeah Tony, he can't be blamed for sitters and goals conceded. Also, there has been plenty on here wanting Howard replaced by Mucha, so I agree, its a bit rich to then blame Moyes when Mucha fucked - up.

But what about playing Cahill who was carrying an injury?

Taking of Neville and replacing him with another defender?

When they went down to 10, and we had them on the back foot, why not make the attacking changes right away?
Andy Crooks
51   Posted 27/10/2011 at 12:06:05

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Tony J I've criticised Moyes plenty but you make a good point. There is not one of our team about whom one could say"he's having a good season" The lot of them are inconsistent at best ,
Shaun Douthwaite
52   Posted 27/10/2011 at 12:12:46

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I wish that people would refrain from asking 'Where were you when you were shit?' as this implies that the teams are now good. I thank you
Peter Barry
53   Posted 27/10/2011 at 12:42:40

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Both of Chelsea's goals came from schoolboy errors by Mucha so much for giving the guys a chance.
Paul Mackie
54   Posted 27/10/2011 at 12:44:50

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@Sam #40

Spot on. Give us the old Moyes back. The one with more ambition than "don't get beat".
Tony J Williams
55   Posted 27/10/2011 at 12:43:25

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Brian, not too sure why Cahill was playing, possibly because Moyes thinks he is a "big game" player. Big mistake when he is clearly not fit.
Ray Robinson
56   Posted 27/10/2011 at 12:44:17

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After last night's performance by Mucha, I now finally the reasoning behind signing Marcus Hahnemann.
Anthony Doyle
57   Posted 27/10/2011 at 12:54:04

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(33) & (48)

Finally, would love to see the pro-Moyes brigade explain Hibbert on for Neville after 45 and 0-1 down...

Neville pulled/felt his hamstring so had to come off injured.

You can hate Moyes all you want but fucks sake you can't hang the man for replacing an injured right back for a right back.

Re: Haters, Everton have been in top 8 for last 5 years is that right? Think you or any other manager would do much better?

Moyes makes mistakes but regardless of not being perfect, more often than not over a season it balances out and somehow we finish top 8. We can't win anything unless we fluke a cup run like Birmingham last year. Unless that happens or someone buys us nothings going to change. New manager with no money to spend would only see us drop down the table.
Anthony Jones
58   Posted 27/10/2011 at 13:20:33

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Anthony, #55.

I would rather see a manager of Everton FC playing his best players in their strongest positions than what I am seeing at present and have seen consistently for many years now.

The Barkley issue is the final straw for me. He played an injured Cahill ahead of our most natural footballer ("but he's just a kid, blah blah blah").

Moyes out! ;)
Chris Fisher
59   Posted 27/10/2011 at 13:23:24

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We lost because of Mucha. If Howard had of been in goal, we would've won pretty comfortably really. It was his fault for both goals... horrible keeper and I remember a few months back some fans calling for him to be given a start over Howard in the Premier League! Ha!
Jamie Tulacz
60   Posted 27/10/2011 at 13:21:19

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By all accounts we were pretty unlucky last night. Several missed chances and a couple of goalkeeping howlers- not sure how you can blame Moyes for that.By all accounts we were battering Chelsea when they were down to 10 men.

When will people stop this fixation that playing with 1 up front necessarily means a less attacking formation- plenty of the best teams do it already and doesn't stop them. We're just playing to our strengths, which are a relatively better midfield and a pretty weak attack which lacks strength in depth, with only one proven striker, a kid who's scored two goals and played a handful of games, and an unproven Argie
Dave Rice
61   Posted 27/10/2011 at 13:33:29

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Moyes is clearly rubbish.

Even though he's won the Manager of the Year award (three times?) and most other managers rate him extremely highly, even though he's proven himself to be point-per-pound one of the best managers in the leage, even though he's frequently linked with managerial opportunities, he's still rubbish, cause a couple of Evertonians (plumbers or car mechanics or taxi drivers) consider him to be "tactically niaive".

He doesn't make the right substitutions (the right substitutions being the ones advocated in hindsight by the same plumbers or car mechanics or taxi drivers), and he only plays one up front at home (even though Cahill plays as a striker - but he was signed as a midfielder so that's what he is).

The football knowledge of the typical Evertonian on here - incredible.
Ryan Holroyd
62   Posted 27/10/2011 at 13:42:56

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Well said Dave Rice.
Steve Bryant
63   Posted 27/10/2011 at 13:34:58

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There are very fine margins when it comes to winning and losing in football. On another day, we would have scored the penalty and Mucha wouldnt have gifted them a goal.....2-1 to us!!! It just wasn't to be despite our best efforts. And I don't think any of the lads were found wanting in the effort department last night.
Mark Dunford
64   Posted 27/10/2011 at 13:36:25

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It seems clear that Mucha is not good enough and we lost due to two goalkeeping errors. The first one was dreadful and the second little better. If we can get a fee of just about any sort then he is probably worth selling in January, otherwise he'll simply be released at the end of his contract.

Having said this, it wasn't unreasonable for Moyes to give him a chance in a game like the one last night. Unfortunately, Mucha fumbled his opportunity.
Richard Reeves
65   Posted 27/10/2011 at 13:46:10

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When we went into extra time I thought to myself this is going to end up a loss with Moyes saying he is happy with the comitment from the players and a ready excuse for the customary defeat to Man U next weekend of being tired from the extra time.I can't bare to even look at his mug anymore.Fuck off Moyes and take your appologists with you.Yeh but no but yeh but no but.Moyes is shite!
Dave Rice
66   Posted 27/10/2011 at 14:20:52

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Richard, what's your solution?

United will turn up at Goodison and probably beat us. They've got better players. City are in the same position. Chelsea did the same last night, and Liverpool, ... well, Liverpool are prepared to stoop to depths I really don't want to see Everton ever descending to..

On the aggregate level you would expect us to finish behind the teams with better players, and ahead of the teams with worse players. The only vairable is what performance a good manager can get from his resources - sweat the assets. Our position at the end of most of the 10 seasons Moyes has been here for indicates that he gets optimal performance from the assets available to him - that's what being a good manager is all about.

Tony Dove
67   Posted 27/10/2011 at 15:57:41

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I give up with Moyes. If he felt he had to play Bily "won't be a hero" then why double the damage by playing Drenthe on the wrong side?
Jimmy Kelly
68   Posted 27/10/2011 at 16:10:51

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Which side is the wrong side Tony?

The side he was on when man of the match on sunday? Or the side he's spent the majority of his career on?

Or is it just that whichever side Moyes played him on would be wrong?
Lol McNally
69   Posted 27/10/2011 at 16:30:01

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QPR 1 - 0 Chelsea
Everton 0 - 1 QPR
Everton 1 - 2 Chelsea

Who has teh better players?

It's all down to the manager... playing players in the right position, and when fit.

Taxi for Moyes!
Roman Sidey
70   Posted 27/10/2011 at 17:22:22

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Tony J Williams, too right it's Moyes' fault that we have a defender taking penalties. If you have a forward on the field, especially Saha, he should be the one taking the penalty!

So many people accusing us "Moyes Out" mob of blindly criticising the man. Talk about the pot and the black kettle! All you people do is blindly defend him.

Maybe we wouldn't be so negative and criticise him so much if he actually got it right more often. I reckon, honestly, last season he got things right in less than 5 games. 5 games out of 40-odd.
Tony J Williams
71   Posted 27/10/2011 at 17:34:41

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Saha missed the last one he took against Fulham Roman.

I don't blindly defend him at all, I simply suggest that the players should share the blame too, but it's apparantly all Moyes's fault no matter if the overpaid primadonnas screw up.

How many pens has Baines missed?
Guy McEvoy
72   Posted 27/10/2011 at 17:32:26

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Roman: What's wrong with a 'defender' taking penalites? He's a dead ball specialist. A penalty is a dead ball situation. It's nothing, at all, to do with where you play on the field. Would you have had Brett Angel (attacker) or Arteta (midfielder) take a pen? Arteta. Why? Better dead ball player. Ferguson (attacker) or Michael Ball (defender)? Ball - every time. Why? better penalty taker! Weirdest reason to have a pop at Moyes to date.

Perspective, as always is missing from this site. Our very modestly assembled squad went toe to toe with one of the best club teams on planet earth and failed to win by the thin margin of a Peter Chech save or two and a couple of scuffed shots.
Simon Harris
73   Posted 27/10/2011 at 17:24:24

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I maybe in a minority if 1 here, but I thought last night was Bily's best performance in a Everton shirt. A couple of sublime passes and a noticeable increase in his workrate.

He showed glimpses of the player we and Moyes were hoping he would be.

If only he was consistent and had an extra yard of pace.

As for the strac, he was crap. He at least made me lol when he miscued a pass and fell on his arse.

Guy McEvoy
74   Posted 27/10/2011 at 17:40:29

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David Unsworth (heaven help us) or Bob Latchford?

(Unsworth scored 23 from 26 - Latchford score 3 from 6!)
Tony Dove
75   Posted 27/10/2011 at 18:16:41

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Jimmy As he does not like using his right leg I suggest he should play on the left!
David Holroyd
76   Posted 27/10/2011 at 18:13:08

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In the scheme of things, the League Cup might not be the biggest piece of silverware, but it is our only chance of winning anything. If it's such a crap cup, just take a look at the Chelsea bench ? they were trying to win it alright!
Rob Lyons
77   Posted 27/10/2011 at 18:38:39

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After a 400-mile round-trip, I feel justified in writing my view on last night's game. These are the facts as to why we lost last night:

1. Mucha in goal, no game time means errors on the bigger stage, Hahnemann is a much better goalie having seen a lot of him at Reading. Moyes's fault for changing the keeper.

2. We did not hurry them down, only Rodwell really did and their keeper made mistakes; we had no tempo.

3. No-one wanted to attack, when we had the ball and looked up there was only one player in front of it.

4. Bily is sooooo shit on the left, never gave Baines the ball on the overlap and no pace.

5. Baines missing the pen is inexcusable.

6. Moyes is negative: changes too late and put Strac on who was totally shite.

7. Place was like a library... totally silent; when we did something well, noise went up ? as did players confidence... coincidence???

8. We should have done them in the 90 mins; Coleman and Barkley should have been on the pitch and Hibbo is streets ahead of Neville both in defence and crossing.

Pick the bones off that one!
Paul Lally
78   Posted 27/10/2011 at 18:28:33

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Tony72#
Drenthe latest interview states he prefers the right so he can either cut inside and shoot or still go for the by-line.
He was our bright spark last night in atack all match but left Neville then Hibbo exposed badly.
All of Chelsea's attacks were coming down our right until they went down to 10 men .
Someone had to cover i.e Rodwell, but he was pushing forward and at points we were playing 4-3-3.
Billy had a good game especially helping Baines on the left.
Billy was fooked when he went off.
Coleman looked sharper.

Onto Denis - okay, not played much but he looks total shite - not just the shocking miss to win the game in normal time.

I thought the club was taking this cup seriously so Mucha should have been told he was out.
When I got to the game I was shocked Howard was not in.

Fellaini - outstanding - covered every balde of grass.
Baines crossing was poor by his standards
but we all thought he would put the pen away - very poorly taken.
Amazing block on the line though.
At that point, for about 15 seconds, I think we all thought it was going to be our night. Rash from Drenthe - he simply had to check his run and it was our throw in.
Chelsea and their fans could not believe their luck when he got sent off and it lifted them all and we looked deflated.

Despite everything, if Howard hed been in goal we would have won.
Very disappointing.
COYB
Roman Sidey
79   Posted 27/10/2011 at 19:00:33

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Fair enough, but as we all know, Louis is a typical striker when it comes to playing on confidence. He scored at the weekend and has had a pretty decent run in the side, so maybe getting him to take the penalties would have been a good thing for him and the team.

I'm not gonna have a crack at Baines too much as I think he's terrific, but that penalty was horrendous, and seeing him shoot down the middle was akin to watching Osman run around thinking he's Lionel Messi - "You just aren't that good, lad."
Tom Farrington
80   Posted 27/10/2011 at 19:49:30

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MOYES OUT!

Why on earth would you not play our best creative, attcking player Barkley! If Moyes cannot see this he is thick as shite!

MOYES OUT - FERGUSON IN!
Brendan McLaughlin
81   Posted 27/10/2011 at 19:54:16

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Roman #74
Here's the thing...according to some on here, if Osman was coached by an attacking ex-midfielder, was played in his right position, told to start off on the front foot and had TWO forwards in front of him ....he would be Lionel Messi!
Mick Davies
82   Posted 27/10/2011 at 20:06:28

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A lot of you on here are missing the point; it's not about goalkeeping mistakes or Cahill/Strac/Baines missing sitters ? it's about the tactics of our managerial team.

When we were deprived of of our man advantage, the whole team retreated to our penalty area, hoping for penalties. This fear has been permeating the once adventurous players like Coleman, Baines for a while now.

Moyesies biggest attribute was his motivational skills and his ability to get, even mediocre players performing at the top of their game and going for unlikely victories such as our long ago derby wins and games against Man Utd and City. We forgave him the Shrewsburys & Brentfords because he was still learning the game and we expected him to get it right. Sadly, as QPR, Wigan etc. have proved, he cannot motivate the side like he used to and this exposes his lack of tactical nouse and desire to win.

I love what Moyes has done for us and it would be a shame if he just allowed all the past glories to be wiped away by relegation or more stagnation. I suggest he goes to Celtic as soon as they sack Lennon and he will always have the respect of Blues fans for giving us back our dignity and offering hope after the Smith era. A time in our history which is suddenly manifesting itself once again...
Kevin Hudson
83   Posted 27/10/2011 at 20:38:23

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What is it with you people & Barkley?!

The boy has just FIVE EFC career appearances to date, some of which weren't even the full 90 minutes,less than 7 HOURS in a Blue shirt - yet we have people on here acting as though we have the 2nd coming within our midst !

"The most consistent performer. "
"Our best creative, attacking player."

You don't KNOW that. Grow up! Stop craving a quick-fix & pinning all that intensity on a 17 year old child..
Roman Sidey
84   Posted 27/10/2011 at 21:08:00

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Probably the first time in a while I've agreed with you, Kevin. He's special, but he doesn't need to be in every game.

Honestly, I think Moyes will only play him a little bit, and against smaller clubs as he probably doesn't want BK getting offers for him from the big clubs - clubs which we've just spent the last month or so battling.

Brendan McLaughlin, nice one re: Ossie. So true.
Dave Rice
85   Posted 28/10/2011 at 08:01:07

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KenWRONG must be an idiot.

He's paying a man about £65K a week to manage a football team when there are dozens of more tactically astute individuals on here who know so much more about the game than him, and I'm sure they could all be employed for a lot less than Moyes' £65K a week.

The number of errors Moyes continually makes is astounding. He plays the wrong players in the wrong positions with the wrong tactics, he dithers over transfer bids, he makes poor substitutions, he's tactically niave, he struggles to motivate, he has favourites that result in poor team selections, the list goes on and on.

Why his contempories rate him so highly in awarding him three Manager of the Year awards and why he's almost always linked with good opportunities elsewhere is beyond me - it clearly shows that they're all idiots as well. Well, compared to the football brains trust on here anyway.

KenWRONG and Moyes OUT!!!
Thomas Windsor
86   Posted 28/10/2011 at 09:00:15

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Taxi for Moyes, anyone else could come in and do a better job without any money. The list would be endless: Sven, Ian Dowie, Peter Reid, Gary Megson, the Wally with the Brolly...

I want Everton at the top but I also want a new house and car but... erm... I don't have the money. Let him get on with his job and get behind the team the best we can. Maybe we might have a little bit of cash for January and freshen things up. Let's hope so.
Gerard Carroll
87   Posted 28/10/2011 at 11:51:57

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"We have no money" ? If you gave Moyes a treasure chest of money, he wouldn't have a clue!
Roman Sidey
88   Posted 28/10/2011 at 12:50:47

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Dave, glad you've seen the light. Those awards mean nothing if the team doesn't win anything. When was the last time Moyes was linked with a decent job?
Dave Rice
89   Posted 28/10/2011 at 14:08:50

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My understanding is that most recently he was linked with Villa before McLeish went there. There may have been others we may not be aware of.

It amazes me how so many people on here seriously seem to think they actually know more than him. My favourite is the "he's tactcally niave" allegation, simply because he doesn't play the team / formation / strategy that some taxi driver or painter & decorator on here thinks he should.

He played the game at pretty much the highest level, is a highly regarded manager, is in the top three premier league managers for delivering more points per pound spent, has had no net spend for several years, and gets us consistently finishing in the top half of the table each year. Yet still Fred the builder or Harry the accountant telling us that he's tactically niave, simply because he doesn't do the things that they think he does.

It's like a fireman walking on stage at a Sinatra concert and telling him: "Frank, you haven't got a f......g clue, lad - your middle 'C' is half an ocave high and your posture is all to pot. You're melodically niave".

Kenwright must be insane to pay him the money he does when there are apparently several dozen more knowledgable football tacticians on here.
Dave Rice
90   Posted 28/10/2011 at 14:19:00

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And another thing while I'm bleating, these people who complain about him playing one up front ? he generally doesn't. Just 'cause Cahill was signed as a midfielder doesn't mean he is.

Moyes' favourite starting 11 (if all fit) seems to be with Saha and Cahill up front, with Cahill dropping deeper when we don't have possession. Similarly to how United often drop Rooney into the midfield when they lose the ball.

It seems to be the stick to beat him with, but most teams play with an out-and-out striker with one playing off him. It's also contingent on how far up the field the team play / press.

But hey, lets not let the blatantly obvious get in the way of slagging off Moyes.
Tony J Williams
91   Posted 28/10/2011 at 14:48:24

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Don't forget though Dave, Fred the builder or Harry the accountant usually tells us how the game should have been played after the final whistle. Genius, all of them!!!
Richard Reeves
92   Posted 28/10/2011 at 14:59:35

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David, you say that Moyes has played the game at PRETTY MUCH the highest level which means he has not played the game at the highest level ? Celtic, Cambridge United, Bristol City, Shrewsbury Town, Dunfermline Athletic, Hamilton Academical, Preston North End.... Do you not expect at the very least a club the size of Everton should be in the top half of the league every season even with the money made available to Moyes?

And another thing: if Cahill was signed as a midfielder but it does not mean he is one, then what the fuck is he? ? because, and I'm having a guess here, but if his goal ratio is about one in ten when deployed as a striker, then he isn't a striker as well.

If you looked at stats all day, you could argue that, with his net spend, he has over-achieved like Curbishley at Charlton but the most important stat is ? we've won nothing with Moyes and he has a win ratio of 41%. Pretty average to me.

We can do better. MOYES OUT!
Dave Rice
93   Posted 28/10/2011 at 16:03:29

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Richard, I expressly said pretty much the highest level because of the level he played at - it's not exactly the Anfield Junior Soccer League (of which I myself was Senior Star Player 1980/1981 - just thought you should know) but neither did Sir Alex play at a higher level, and lets not start on Mourinho, wenger and Villas Boas.

And the FACT is that he has an excellent points-per-pound ratio - maybe second only to Wenger.

Cahill plays off the striker as a second striker. The point of this is that so many experts on here insist we play one up front - we don't play one up front any more than many other teams - an out-and-out striker and a secondary stiker playing off him. And even with one striker the strategy can be offensive if the supporting midfield is so configured and instructed. Maybe Moyes should just go out and buy Lampard, Gerrard and Silva? That'd be a more offensive midfield.
Thomas Windsor
94   Posted 28/10/2011 at 16:28:32

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It's all good to let a bit of steam off now and again ? but the talk of sacking Moyes for me is way out of order.

It is easy to play manager as Dave Rice says but this is a massaive league now and we are licked before we start if the manager can't spend top money. If Moyes was given the money Benitez spent we would have been in the Champions League a few times and maybe have won something.
Michael Kenrick
95   Posted 28/10/2011 at 20:29:56

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Dave Rice,
And the FACT is that he has an excellent points-per-pound ratio - maybe second only to Wenger.
That infamous article from earlier in the month was shown to be complete garbage ? even the math was all wrong. But it's not unsurprising that you would rely on voodoo stats to reinforce your questionable claims.
Roman Sidey
96   Posted 28/10/2011 at 22:51:40

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Moyes voided the points-per-pound bollocks last season when he claimed to have the best squad he'd had despite spending nothing. That was just before we went backwards both in points and tactics.
Roman Sidey
97   Posted 29/10/2011 at 01:25:53

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Oh, and what a great endorsement for our club that Aston Villa apparently showed interest in our manager.

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