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1 Posted 14/02/2020 at 06:40:28
2 Posted 14/02/2020 at 07:05:26
And yes, lets hope that this connection to Everton continues to thrive. Its always interesting to read articles like this and the views of the likes of Jay in Brazil and Steve Ferns on our growing Portuguese and Brazilian contingents.
3 Posted 14/02/2020 at 08:45:58
Someone told me this in a boozer on Rice Lane so I'm sure it is. (Ahem!)
4 Posted 14/02/2020 at 09:08:51
That was some team the Portuguese put together back then starting with John o' Guant as the sweeper, Henry the Navigator and Ferdinand Magellan in midfield with Anibal Milhais up top. I see Milhais was a gunner I guess this was before Wenger. I also see from the picture that even back then 4-3-3 was the preferred option.
5 Posted 14/02/2020 at 10:18:51
6 Posted 14/02/2020 at 10:55:38
With regards the precious metal graffiti commentary, maybe if there was more context like ''SILVER OUT!'' , ''PALLADIUM IN!'' we may be able to say for certain.
7 Posted 14/02/2020 at 11:36:52
You've excelled yourself one again, Mr Jones.
As someone who has lived and worked in both Portugal and Brazil, there is so much for me personally to enjoy in your piece, Pete. Including stuff I never knew.
For example, I wasn't aware that Henry the Navigator has a statue in Sefton Park!
I like how you portray the long-standing and historical tension that exists between the two Iberian countries, Portugal and Spain.
It's very much akin to how England and France circle around each other with suspicion, even today.
Did you come across the following popular phrase the Portuguese still use with regard to Spain in your research Pete? It always makes me smile:
'Only ill-winds and bad marriages come from Spain.'
Nice to hear you continue to research why Everton (and all its variations) is such a popular name in Brazil.
Push it to the top of your 47 articles to write, Pete! I can't wait to read that one.
Well done again on a superb contribution. Thanks.
PS - Dave Williams @ 5.
Curiously enough, there is little known Portuguese sea shanty that goes:
Henrique o Navegador
é mágico...é mágico...é mágico'
Who would've thought it!
8 Posted 14/02/2020 at 11:42:32
9 Posted 14/02/2020 at 12:18:42
10 Posted 14/02/2020 at 13:29:02
11 Posted 14/02/2020 at 14:07:15
And I note you have earned a plaudit from Dr France, which is the TW equivalent of the Nobel Prize.
12 Posted 14/02/2020 at 14:28:57
13 Posted 14/02/2020 at 14:52:14
You missed Nuno out of the introduction, a very efficient under rated left-back.
I love the Algarve, the people, culture, food and golf.
Funny that as a kid I was only ever interested in history around wars and explorers, I didn't see the fascination with royalty. 35 years later, I am still only interested in War and explorers! The only Royle I have ever respected is Joe.
14 Posted 14/02/2020 at 15:26:25
15 Posted 14/02/2020 at 17:19:55
However the comment could relate to the great battle of 2013 and for European Championship Qualification with similarities of David and Goliath where two armies were largely anonymous except for two men, Ronaldo and Zlatan.
16 Posted 14/02/2020 at 21:45:43
So many thanks for both entertaining me and educating me in equal measure when there is another break in football matters. Please keep them coming, although I do appreciate the amount of research that must have been involved in its production.
ps: There was also an Abel Xavier who played for us, and defected to Mordor afterwards.
17 Posted 14/02/2020 at 22:00:55
18 Posted 15/02/2020 at 00:31:52
19 Posted 15/02/2020 at 09:00:17
20 Posted 15/02/2020 at 12:38:41
Just to respond to some of the interesting points made - the Portuguese WW1 cemetery is at Neuve Chapelle very close to the magnificent Indian Memorial which can be found on the CWGC website. All military cemeteries have a sadness but the Portuguese one is particularly so for me. I did think about mentioning the Auld Alliance between France and Scotland, an excellent expression of the dictum 'my enemy's enemy is my friend'. Thanks also for reminding me of Nuno Valente, Joao Nunes and Abel Xavier, I can remember an Echo article about Nunes from around 1984 explaining why Kendall didn't sign him. I wonder what became of that Gray bloke?
And yes, Duncan McKenzie and Henry the Navigator - could the possibly be related? I searched the electrical interweb for a recent pic of Duncan and I can see what you mean.
21 Posted 15/02/2020 at 23:11:33
22 Posted 16/02/2020 at 01:53:34
He set up a school of Navigation at Sagres [there's even a beer named after it] which is apparently the most westerly point in Europe. We were there this summer, and there is a really atmospheric feel, as you stand on the cliffs staring out at the Atlantic; it's easy to understand how all those explorers set sail.
As to the treaty, the Portuguese take the 'our oldest ally' thing, very seriously. The treaty says, that each country shall be friend to the other's friends and enemy to the other's enemies .... so I guess that must mean, that for the last 700 years, the Portuguese have been obliged to hate the French!
23 Posted 16/02/2020 at 16:57:16
I'd clearly forgotten more than I remembered.
24 Posted 16/02/2020 at 23:44:53
I briefly explained the history and origins of the name, it's association with the city of Liverpool, our maritime trading history with Brazil and the curiosity as to why Everton and its derivatives is a popular name in Brazil.
I've got one reply so far, but it is a laughably bad one and doesn't encourage me to think the study of genealogy is a particularly sophisticated or developed here in Brazil.
"Unfortunately I don't know anything about the reason. I believe it could be because the name Everton is a beautiful word in the ears of Brazilians."
A very studious analysis!
25 Posted 17/02/2020 at 13:40:29
Nicholas Ryan (#22) - I have visited the Algarve on many occasions and like you, was in Sagres and Cape St Vincent last year – I know exactly what you mean about the atmospheric feel about the place. I just love Portugal and it's people!
26 Posted 17/02/2020 at 21:21:22
Your local knowledge is priceless. I did spot something about scouse sailors and the Brazillian navy during the independence struggle of the 1820s but I've yet to follow it up. If Lyndon is agreeable, we can use these comments to swap info.
27 Posted 17/02/2020 at 21:27:39
In the meantime, I'll fire off some more emails and hope I strike gold.
28 Posted 17/02/2020 at 21:35:17
29 Posted 17/02/2020 at 21:41:36
The name Everton is a beautiful sound to the ears in any language. There's a PR / soundbite opportunity somewhere in that phrase, I'm sure.
30 Posted 17/02/2020 at 22:10:30
I too liked the sentiment of the reply I got. But it really wasn't very scientific or helpful on learning more!
Steve @ 28.
Highly unlikely, methinks. They only called in at some Brazilian seaports en route to games against Argentinian and Uruguayan opposition. We played no games on Brazilian soil, or faced any Brazilian teams on that tour.
I think it was only in the 1960s we played a couple of Brazilian clubs at Goodison who were touring Europe.
31 Posted 17/02/2020 at 22:29:12
I recall Murray Walker, the F1 commentator, talking about Ayrton Senna's name. He said he had been ignorant and called him Ayrton as the British would being a British name, but Ayrton and the Brazilians pronounced it differently. Apparently, and I'm going off an old memory here so I may be mistaken, but his parents got the name from Britain and liked how it read and then pronounced it how a Brazilian would. Giving their child an individual name.
Could Everton not just be an example of this? A somewhat unusual and unique name. Before globalisation, Everton FC would barely register with Brazilians. Would you have been able to watch the Premier League on TV in 1996 (when Soares was born) as this was when Juninho was playing for Boro and I recall there being limited coverage available in Brazil.
Is this on the right lines, Jay?
32 Posted 17/02/2020 at 22:52:03
As you also say the spelling and pronunciation of such names warp into something unique, almost unrecognizable from the original it was based on.
In this piece from the Guardian a few years back, it suggests as previously speculated that the name arrived with migrants from Liverpool.
To quote the relevant part:
"a large number of German immigrants headed to the southern states of Brazil in the 19th and early 20th centuries. But there was also a large influx of Anglo-Saxons (remember that Brazilian-born Charles Miller, who was educated in England, is believed to have brought the game to Brazil in the first place), along with Americans fleeing from the civil war. As a result, the name 'Ewerthon' is common, derived from the Merseysiders who immigrated to Brazil, while 'Washington' comes from their American counterparts."
The quoted spelling of Everton as 'Ewerthon' is one I've not personally encountered.
It still doesn't explain the wide distribution of the name, from north to south, east to west, in an extremely large country.
33 Posted 18/02/2020 at 11:05:57
My Dad had been a merchant navy officer, and was on a ship that docked in Rio during the 1950 World Cup. The visitor told me that, when she said she was Brazilian, and from Rio, my Dad said he was there in 1950, and went on to describe walking up from the dockside to the Maracana Stadium. He said they stopped for a drink at a cafe opposite a small park. He told her the match was Brazil v Sweden, and he had never seen so may people, as the crowd was 150,000!
The visitor was almost in tears, as she told me, that the cafe and the little park are still there. We looked up the 1950 World Cup, and guess what. ... Brazil played Sweden at the Maracana, and the crowd is recorded at 139,000.
So my Dad, who didn't know what day it was, and couldn't recognise me, had a perfect recollection of a football match 60-odd years ago, and 5,000 miles away!
34 Posted 18/02/2020 at 11:16:25
'Everton' also exists as a name in the West Indies, with the likes of Sir Everton Weekes, and others. A bit closer to Brazil geographically I suppose, so maybe related?
35 Posted 18/02/2020 at 11:22:45
36 Posted 18/02/2020 at 13:26:34
Like your own father, at the end my dad could barely recall anyone from his family, was confused as to why his wife of 60 years wasn't with him (she died 10 years earlier), couldn't recall that he'd just had his breakfast-dinner-tea five minutes earlier, etc.
And yet, get him on the subject of football, horse racing and cricket and memorable events of 50-60 years ago and his recall could at times be astonishing.
A dear friend of mine who lost his own mother to dementia summed up the affliction perfectly when he said 'we lose them twice'.
First, when the person, the personality, the memories slowly fade until their bodies and mind are occupied by an unrecognizable alien. Then, when they breathe their last breath.
How uplifting for you and your family that he had such vivid recall of that day in Rio. Your real father gaining ascendency over the alien who was trying to lay claim to his mind and body as his own.
Thanks for sharing such an intimate moment.
37 Posted 18/02/2020 at 13:37:17
38 Posted 20/02/2020 at 15:21:15
On a related note I don't know if anyone saw the video that the club posted about Andre Gomes giving a lift to the match to three supporters; it was brilliant. He is a real hero off the pitch as well as on.
39 Posted 20/02/2020 at 16:56:01
There are a lot of wild boar settlements in south america, including Brazil. I'm not aware of any significant migration of the saxons to south america at any point but as a surname is it feasible that people from such settlements would bear the name through some tenuous connection ?
As far as the UK is concerned there is an Everton in Lincolnshire, a county well known for its pig industry and an Everton in the New Forest, Hampshire.
I can only imagine that something was going on in Everton, Liverpool a wee while ago that involved pig breeding or something related to the pig trade in general. Perhaps more learned Blues than me might be able to shed further clarity on the subject.
40 Posted 22/02/2020 at 17:17:50
41 Posted 03/03/2020 at 20:07:42
As far as Eofor tun is concerned it is the most plausible origin of the name, and is the one that the dictionary of English place names goes for, but there are other theories. The tun suffix probably meant a farmstead in the Anglo Saxon era. If the Everton you mention is the one I'm thinking of it is just over the Trent in Nottinghamshire, and it is thought to have the same name origin. The one in Hampshire is interesting in that it doesn't appear to be derived from the presence of wild boar, it is a bit of a mystery. I've seen a suggestion that it might have started out sounding like Yeovilton in Somerset.
I believe that the wild boar disappeared from Merseyside around 200 years before what is now Brazil was sighted by the Portuguese, and while words like pig, swine, hog, boar and sow are Germanic in origin and tend to refer to the domesticated animal as well as its wild close relative. I wonder if eofor as a description may have disappeared with the animals it referred to.
And Dave, I'd completely forgotten the Piggeries, ironic or what?
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