Toffeeweb - Talking Points

Expectations

In many of the threads on ToffeeWeb, there are references to how David Moyes's time here has raised our expectations causing many to be unrealistic in their assessment of our current predicament.

David Moyes has not raised my expectations from those I have held for more than 50 years of supporting Everton, who will always be, in good times or bad, the only club I will ever support.

Whilst my support for Everton Football Club is undying – my support for the transient group who represent it, on and off the pitch, can and should be variable.

My expectations are simple (and I suspect similar to most others):

I expect the Manager to:

Pick players on the basis of current form not favouritism
Know when players are not performing and leave them out
Regularly give emerging players chances to play more than a few minutes
Pick players willing to die on the pitch rather than give in
Have the courage and ability to change things during games when that is not happening
Have a range of tactical plans for various occasions
Have the courage to take risks and attack ANY and ALL opposition
Know the best form of defence is attack (especially at home)
Treat both cups as an opportunity for success (Millwall may be going to their SECOND cup final in 9 nine years)
Leave me feeling at the end of every game, win or lose, that he and the team he put on the pitch, could not have done any more than they did

If he can do that consistently who knows what he could achieve

If he can do that he can give me hope

If he can do that he can expect my support.

It is precisely because I am losing hope that he is losing my support.

Tom Fazal, Ottawa, Canada Posted 15/03/2013 at 16:15:46

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Reader Comments

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Andy Crooks
661 Posted 16/03/2013 at 01:03:25

Tom, I would agree. Well, with all but your fourth point. Last week I'd have settled for Fellaini being prepared to break a finger nail on the pitch. What you say seems entirely sensible and I doubt that few will disagree.

James Lee
669 Posted 16/03/2013 at 01:56:29

Just thinking what's in Moyes head as it seems the fans been repeating the same thing every year and it never gets in.

Perhaps his expectation is...

I pick what I know is good for the match. If you are so good – you would have been a manager and earn 4M a year.

James Flynn
673 Posted 16/03/2013 at 02:10:59

Same expectations of supporters of all clubs, every sport.

Mick MacManus
687 Posted 16/03/2013 at 04:09:58

"Pick players willing to die on the pitch rather than give in" ie Phil Neville. "Pick players on the basis of current form not favouritism", hmmm Phil Neville...

Sam Hoare
692 Posted 16/03/2013 at 04:44:03

Do you think ANY fan feels like this about their manager? No. Certainly not over any decent length of time, let alone a decade.

Barry Rathbone
717 Posted 16/03/2013 at 08:54:19

Expectation is the crux of the great divide after Big Joe won the FA cup in the 90s it just felt Like the first step on getting back to normality. Sure we weren't a great team but this is Everton - knocking over the much vaunted Spurs in the semi and bursting the bubble of a growing Utd is what we do - or used to.

It's not entirely generational this divide I know younger Evertonians who feel the same way they are as immersed in our history as I was about Dixie, Mercer, Sagar et al.

To imagine evertonians putting up with a Moyes and all his limitations for over a decade would have been ludicrous at any other time in our history.

As the OP says it's the loss of hope that needs sorting a more enthused manager would be the obvious place to start. It's fine bringing in players not quite good enough for the monied crew there's loads to choose from but creating a winning team as Laudrup has is beyond Moyes.

Only if you lack the ambition of old would you advocate keeping Moyes.

Bill Griffiths
779 Posted 16/03/2013 at 12:30:52

Tom, until fairly recently I have always been a supporter and apologist for Moyes. even though I fear for what will happen when he does leave the last few weeks games and certainly last weeks have lead me to believe that maybe it is time for a change. While I will always have respect for what he has achieved here at Everton (others may well probably disagree) I think his dithering over the contract issue has had a severe impact on the club despite what others may say and find it hard to forgive him for this.

Jimmy Sørheim
194 Posted 17/03/2013 at 14:04:03

Amen to that, Tom. You list the same reasons I do. Moyes needs to adapt himself to those demands or simply go. Like his habit of only playing the best team in league games and not in cups.

The League is Moyes's bread and butter, and he probably gets a bonus for finishing higher in the league. Every time Moyes has had the chance to win the cup, he blows it with his team selections, and he reverts to being ultra defensive.

Kevin Tully
611 Posted 19/03/2013 at 13:00:23

The average tenure of a Premier League manager is just over 3 years, but these figures are somewhat skewed, when you take into account the longevity of Ferguson & Wenger.

Now Moyes has completed 11 full years at our club, is this stability and lack of pressure to win trophies equivalent to the millions other managers may have to spend?

We know we pay good wages, and Moyes has had some money, but even Sunderland have had tens of millions more to spend in the transfer market.

Does our good pay structure, and lack of pressure from a docile Board give Moyes more of a chance than most get in this League?

Alternatively, would he prefer £50m and three years for success or you're sacked? Is 11 years worth millions?

Ross Edwards
613 Posted 19/03/2013 at 13:05:27

Do you know what I think would get Moyes more interested? — Reduce his pay from £4 million to around £2.5 million.

He wouldn't die of hunger, let's face it, because he's amassed a fortune from managing us. He gets £4 million a year but so far, I haven't seen a return in trophies yet.

Brendan McLaughlin
617 Posted 19/03/2013 at 13:26:42

Kevin #611
I think Moyes would be delighted to sign up to £50m & 3 years to deliver.

Kevin Tully
619 Posted 19/03/2013 at 13:36:15

Let's say he was at Swansea then Brendan, and he signed Fellaini, Baines and Jelavic for £50m - and he finished 7/8th.

He then got the bullet for blowing stacks of cash, without delivering silverware, would he be a failure in their fans eyes?

Brendan McLaughlin
624 Posted 19/03/2013 at 13:45:56

Kevin #619
Errr...not really sure where this is going but I'll play. No...I don't reckon he'd be classed as a failure by Swansea fans in those circumstances. Am I warm or cold?

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