Below-par Blues drop more vital points

But again we continue to play very good football and didn't miss Fellaini at all..

Positives.. Oviedo is a very cultured player. Technical and can play and read a through ball.. cracking potential.

Moyes needs to sort this before it becomes another season of 'what if' — and the really big games are still to come.

The injuries really bite when the squad is like a communion wafer...

Frustration once again.

Refereeeeeeee... absolute shock bollocks. How many points is that? We should be 8 for the better.

Liverpool, Reading etc etc. The list goes on.

Howard and the defenders need a few lessons after school, starting with a good fucking caning

BUT

I hope Moyes doesn't sacrifice attacking play too much

Horrible afternoon but we are still fighting

We dominate the first half, but lack of goals for our chances means it's still too close going into half-time. The opposing team comes back into it and their physicality prevails over our diminutive midfield. Can no longer play our passing game and revert to longer, predictable balls. It's broken up easily and they score to level/win.

Midfield was bullied again in the second half and was practically non-existent much like last week and countless times before. Either need to go 2-0 up when we have the chances with these more creative small midfielder, or get some more presence in the middle.

That side today was no better than mid-table. But I still hold loftier ambitions with the big players coming back. Gibson, Mirallas and Fellaini are quality and can lift us immensely, I just hope it isn't too late...

Norwich invited us into a scrapheap battle, we accepted and looked worse for it.

Pienaar and Jelavic not good at all. Pienaar with some mazy runs, but his passing is awful atm. Jelavic just not mobile enough.

Naismith not a class player by any means, but just this time I´ll let him off. Not our worst player on the day and really tried. Long term though, he´ll have to improve A LOT.

MotM? Baines overall I´d say, Jags and Ossie close.

We need Mirallas, Fellaini and Gibson back... our reserves are simply not good enough. All our great early season work is going up in smoke at the moment, and now we are entering the toughest run of fixtures this season... we must start winning instead of drawing games.

I also don't understand why we have brought Barkley back from his loan... I don't personally think he is ready for regular Prem football yet, but the only point in bringing him back, is to play him. Given that we have several midfielders to come back in, I think he will be condemned to the bench again, when he could be playing regular football and improving in the Championship.

Really disappointed... if we want fourth, we must take 4 points from Arsenal and Spurs at home. On the plus side, our best two players this season, Mirallas and Fellaini, will hopefully be back for Arsenal. Hopefully Hibbert won't be too far away either.

He doesn't!!

3 centre halves on the field and we concede with a header inside the 6 yard box AGAIN.

As for our cultured Dutch centre half. What a load of bollocks. He hit more long balls than Jags. Bag of shit.

Looked better than both Coleman, Neville and Hibbert at right back. Then again, he´s clearly needed in the middle as the Distin/Heitinga pairing never really looks too confident.

What reserves out there today simply weren't good enough?

With our best 11 on, in form we are a proper first class outfit. Our backup players however are not Premier League class, at least not top half class.

Moyes clearly fancies none of the players we had on the bench today, otherwise he would have made substitutions when we were losing our grip on the game throughout the second half. I think it´s as simple as that.

Class team on our day (with a fit squad). Threadbare and overly fragile as soon as injuries come.

We may blame Howard, Hibbert, Osman, Fellaini, Jelavic and all the others but we lack depth to replace those players once they hit slumps.

We look terrible at defending and as someone above said, most of our coaches are defenders... Wtf are they doing?

I can only recall the derby game this season where we've had a major break with refereeing decisions, so I don't suppose today's finale should have surprised me.

We can't seem to play OK and win, let alone badly and win, and this may easily cost us a top four spot this season.

Let's not forget we've played very well so far this season, but not got our just desserts in several games. We've been severely punished for individual errors, and missed hatfuls of chances in every game. It happened again today.

#963 Phil you were right earlier mate, realistically speaking top 6-8 is what we should be aiming at.

In my defence: my earlier post about being optimistic about today`s game was as a result of including Gibbo and Mirallas in my prediction. When I saw the actual team sheet, it is safe to say I was less enthused.

Why he didn't bring on Barkley for Naismith or even Osman who disappeared the last 30+ minutes is just baffling.

We got exactly what we deserved. We got what Moyes allowed to happen.

I like Moyes, but today was shades of Moyes at his frustratingly worst. No changes, the game taken to us instead of us affecting the game. That, IMO, is down to Moyes.

It seems to me that Howard and Neville, if fit, are the first names on the team sheet. It was a poor result but we continue to try to play. This time last year we were getting poor results with dross.

Jelavic is okay but the talk of him being the best striker in 25 years was cretinous. He is not a great striker in a bad spell but an average striker in a bad spell. He is worth what we paid for him and sadly he has no-one to put him under pressure.

At the back, Howard continues to give all the jitters, he steadily refuses to come out and claim any crosses, Heitinga lost his man (Bassong) for the goal, but what chance has he got against a 6 ft 4 in giant and to all extent it was Howard's ball to go and at least flick away for a corner.

The new lads did alright but for me Hitzlsperger isn't quite at the level we need but Oviedo looked the part on occasions. At this rate, we'll be saying bye bye to Fellaini and Baines as I can't see us getting back into the Top 6 never mind Top 4 after this weekend. We have too many problems at the back and not enough options up front.

I concede that Howard is a good shot-stopper, but frankly, which top level goalkeeper isn't ? I would be happier with a big brute of a keeper who can dominate his area, or an acrobatic one like Grobelaar back in the day, and who can radiate confidence in his defenders that he will do this.

In our last three matches, where we've picked up only four points, and conceded four goals overall, the opposition only had four shots on target in each game. This will go some way to solving our defensive issues, get us back to the clean sheets, and pushing us back up the table.

Howard - needs replacing and fast
Distin & Heitinga - both had me on edge all game and both were bullied with ease
Osman - did nothing wrong but went missing for 70 mins and has the weakest shot in world football
Pienaar - wouldn't get a game at Barnet the way he is playing
Naismith - might have scored again but looks a piss poor player
Jelavic - crap but yet again had no support or service

The only plus points for me were Baines who played well, Oviedo looks good and Hitz besides a couple of basic errors and tiring in the second half looks like he can do a good job for us.

Was there anyone in the ground who didn't think there needed to be changes soon into the second half except for Moyes. He was back to his old self today, sits there and does nothing, waiting for the other team to score. If there was ever a clear sign that Moyes does not rate Barkley it was today, if he couldn't even get 20 mins when there was any number of players who deserved to be dragged off then he will never be given a chance.

Anyone else a bit worried about Baines's demeanour? I've never seen him as much as open his mouth on the pitch but today he looked pissed right off with the other players and let a couple of them know.

So we don't miss Cahill? Yes we do, at set pieces; no-one is meeting the cross like Cahill used to.

Message to Moyes: use your subs!!! It was a hard game and Jelavic was knackered at 80 mins, Vellios was known as a super sub last year so why not throw him on???

I also agree with you about Oviedo. He looks a useful player and Pienaar should be dropped as soon as Marillas is fit. He's playing his worst football in any of his spells at the club in my opinion.

I don't know if I agree with the subs though. I definitely think something needed to be done, but what?

Moyes must have looked a the bench and thought, fuck me, I've got nothing. I'm of the opinion that Barkley should only play when we're looking comfortable by the way.

Thank God the Ricky Hatton fight is on cos I'm off footy right now... and everything else.

Bollocks to everything.

In an ideal world, Barkley would be brought on when we're 3 - 0 up so he can play without any pressure but could he really have done any worse than Pienaar or Naismith??? We might not have much on the bench but we didn't have much on the pitch either.

Against a combative Norwich today it was like many games over the years, we need someone who is prepared to stand up to the Grant Holt types; I felt today that he ran the game how he wanted and no one stopped him including a poor ref.

CB is an issue that needs sorting, Distin is excellent but will sooner than later succumb to age; Heitinga, something has gone wrong... a readily realisable asset in my opinion and that saddens me as I have oft jumped to his support on here. Jagielka is a last ditch fully committed defender but l think he is limited to that.

Hitzlsperger looked good to me, Oviedo looked even better, quick around the pitch. Pienaar is struggling, but one thing is sure; he does not hide and work rate is a given with him, so no worries, form is ... Class is ...

Jelly, now this has gone wrong, and unlike SP above I do worry about what he does, again a readily realisable and probably inflated asset.

To counter the worries and even negativity as I warm up, I realise that today we had our best player missing, and Fellaini, and Gibson also, it reminds me how solid if unspectacular we are with TH at right back.

We have had a good start to a long season and in the weeks up to New Year we are going to find out a lot about the team and squad. By then the Manager is going to have to manage his assets at his disposal and in order to recruit a few more I feel we may have to dispose of a few while we can.

Bring on Wednesday

Howard - Great shot stopper. Distribution - terrible. Claiming crosses - woeful.
Spitsbergen - Jeeeesus! I've seen Sunday league players gather themselves faster. The guy is so slow on the ball.

Moyes is the man to blame for this one. We were atrocious the entire second half and he stood there with his hands in his pockets. Why can't we attack when we're 1 - 0 up? He was petrified to change it. He's a great scout... but his tactical ability is the square root of zero.

I have to say that this result was our own doing... but that's the worst reffing I've seen in a long time. Baines's free-kick on the edge of the box. He counted their wall back NINE yards, they wouldn't budge any further so he got Baines to move the ball back! WHAT!?!?

No matter how bad our results go, silly to say we should rule out Top 4 as the supposed favorites for these positions are also dropping the points.

Good news:
1. Arsenal also drew with a less than mediocre Villa team. West Brom will surely go through a rough patch and Chelsea now have The Waiter in charge.
2. We do have some very good players. Oviedo looked very promising in patches.
3. We're well up on the last couple of seasons with plenty of games to go.

Bad news:
1. Squad Depth! Been said before but whilst our first 11 is okay, we fall away sharply after that.
2. A good start has become average and could become even worse unless we have a good December.
3. Rivals such as Spurs, Liverpool and Arsenal will have sizeable warchests in January. We may get a loan or two.

All-in-all, the world has not ended but the early season optimism may have. Let's renew it with a top performance and win against a beatable Arsenal.

West Brom will fizz out, but the problem is, we already have.

When Gibson got injured, he was clearly missed. When Mirallas is not playing, we look far more impotent, especially given Pienaar's form issues. And obviously Fellaini is going to be missed when he is out.

We have to invest in January, and hope top four is within touching distance by the time we add players.

I'm so gutted. What a really great first 20/30 minutes - flowing football, and Oviedo, well I've been longing for a start for him and he was thrilling. But what a shit second half. The ref was deplorable (agree, Phil Sammon, that 9 paces count was disgusting and summed up his performance) and gave us nowt against a niggly, physical side.

Howard I think to blame for our goal. Pienaar really has some terrible moments of late. Naismith fails to impress. Heitinga shouldn't have been marking Holt as much as he was. Baines was solid and deserved a goal for one marvelous run. Jelly has been running into a lot of space of late but today he just seemed uninterested. Osman was good early then found their midfield surrounding ours.

I wonder, though, how Moyes could really have changed it just through subs. Vellios for Jelavic – maybe, but the second half problem was in midfield. So Maggie May - please spare us (but couldn't have been worse than Pienaar). Barkley – not a defensive midfielder. Hibbo to RB maybe, with Jags back in the middle of defence to tighten up there, and Heitinga off. etc etc – in other words, not much for Moyes to choose from on the bench.

I do think this game is a watershed for us. I'm no longer thinking 4th as a possibility (I never thought it a probability). Let's just enjoy 5th, 6th-ish and see Oviedo blossom and excite.

We've had a relatively easy start to the season and needed to take full advantage while the players we have got are fit and available.

I think most on here actually know why we've dropped valuable points so far.

Our real test starts on Wednesday and the run of games coming up is where the lack of "squad depth" will now hit us hard.

To compound this problem, a manager who actually does not know when to mix things up, make positive substitutions and create the right competitive spirit amongst the players we do have, surely means we can look forward to a rocky run up to Christmas.

The joys of supporting Everton continue...

I'm afraid the truth of this season so far is that we have failed to outclass any of our opponents and yes that includes Villa and Swansea away. A top side that takes the lead early on (which is the start that everybody craves) goes on from there and wins in a ruthless manner. We were doing that from February to May in the league with notable exceptions, but this season it just hasn't happened.

We're not a bad side but we're not a very good side either. As soon as the media started to put us under the microscope, we cracked, either because opposing teams tried harder against us, or as I see it because we don't have the mental capacity to cope with great expectations. There is no natural leader in the side (Neville does that job... but he shouldn't be anywhere near a side hoping to get top 4) and there is a lack of a talisman (Fellaini is near to that, but he is not loved by all of the supporters).

Then we come to the manager: in an interview fairly recently, he was talking about the Semi with the other lot and how he considered playing Felli up top but changed his mind. The following week against United at Old Trafford he did play Felli further forward and we scored 4 times.

That to me sums up his lack of self-belief and belief in his own players. He will always err on the safe side and his players do the same thing; nobody tries anything different, they all wait for his instructions from the sideline. I don't know how the players put up with his constant 'play it down the line' calls and 'turn it inside' Ossie or whoever.

These players are full internationals – they don't need advice from the touchline like schoolboy players, they need a tactical plan and high level training.

As I said on another thread, we may as well write this season off and get a new manager in for the New Year. Cash in on those with a high value and let someone else have a go with a bit of money to get the ball rolling.

Another five years of wasting good opportunities is not conducive to a happy life and there will never be another season like this one for finishing in the top 3 or 4, unfortunately Everton under Moyes nearly make it but never quite get over the line.

As for a replacement, Peter Reid and Duncan Ferguson there would be no hiding place for players with them on the touchline.

Missed hold up play of Fellaini.
Set pieces are a disaster area.
Howard comes for nothing.
Lack of subs/poor bench.
Heitinga is rubbish. I retract my comment in the Newcastle game, he would have made shit all difference in injury time.
Seeing out games, I hate that phrase Moyes, it seemingly never works.
Failure to get efforts on target, or anything than pass backs.

It told me we need a new keeper, centre half, centre midfield and another striker. Pity we only have bill. Nothing will change.

Moysie's career at Everton will probably conjour up words like 'reliable', 'stable', 'efficient' and 'organised' but never, 'creative' or 'artistic'. He has tried to play a more open and expansive style this season but in doing so has made it easier for other teams to score against us. Our last three opponents are less than mediocre yet we have laboured against them and I cannot see us ever reaching a higher level of performance than what we have already seen.

Firstly, Jagielka has been our best centre half this season. So why shunt him to right back? Surely Heitinga could have gone there.

The form pf Pienaar is a major concern. Although he never hid, there was too many fancy flicks when the simple ball was the better option.

Jelavic was way off the pace again but did he get any service?

Plus points were I thought Oviedo started well and got better as did Naismith.

That ref was a total joke and was terrible for both sides. The free kick that led to their goal didn't look like one to me from my seat in the lower Street End.

Abysmal day all round.

Momentum is everything and we lost ours almost as soon as we got it. My point on Moyes is if he wants to leave , then leave now and give somebody else a chance to bed in and get ready for next season.

Even when we were leading 1-0 today in the first half, Goodison was virtually silent , that tells me that I'm not alone in thinking that we have failed to fulfil our potential.

Can't believe Moyes didn't make a change second half. Velios could have been on much, much earlier. Back what others are saying about Peanuts, a worry as he now has a long, comfy contract. Jelavic to me looks like he doesn't fancy carrying the burden of scoring goals when others like Felli are not playing.

The only positives I can take from today is that I'm staying up for the next few days for the Arsenal game so I won't have to be up quite so early Wednesday. Also at least Felli will be back so hopefully he'll put a shift in and please, please let Kev be fit. Please Santa. Right, lets get that next bottle open and just forget today.

Hopefully Gibson, Fellaini, Hibbert, Mirallas all return.

Think a substitution or two should have been made 60-70 mins just to freshen things up.

Pienaaar defintely out of sorts.

Missed Fellaini (and others).

Etc etc.

But the fact is, as bad as we were, if Howard comes out (instead of doing the hokey fucking cokey) and collects or punches, we've won 1-0.

By the way, I have no idea what's being said at half-time but it appears to be..

"We're in total control, they're shite and we're a goal up - noo all I need yuz to dae is look fuckin' baffled, panic and generally arse aboot like a bunch o' hopeless fuckwits. Oh and make sure yer final baw is shite"

61% possession and 21 shots on goal vs Villa.

60% possession and 30 shots on goal vs Swansea.

What's your definition of outclass Patrick?

And Patrick... the result has filled me with pessimism, but some of your comments are bizarre. We have failed to outclass anyone this season? What games have you been watching exactly? We did outclass both Villa and Swansea in the games you mentioned, and we outclassed Newcastle, Man Utd, and most obviously of all, Fulham. I doubt anyone will play as well as we did away to Fulham all season.

Get a grip please... there is no reason to give up on this season because of a couple of bad results, it is a pathetic attitude to have. Arsenal came third last season, despite losing to Wigan at home and Blackburn and QPR away...whilst they also dropped points against Wolves, Norwich and Bolton. Spurs also consistently dropped points against sides they were expected to beat, and managed fourth.

At the moment we sit above both Arsenal and Spurs, who I consider to be the realistic contenders for fourth (I think WBA are playing fantastically... but they will fall away after xmas imo).

I fully expect us to drop quicker than a west london football team' manager's contract and for us to lose Felli, Moyes and Baines in the next year and for dreams of a CL place to feel like a distant memory come Christmas 2013.

Bastards.

COYB

Everyone one of them from Moyes down to the tea-lady needs to get a fucking grip. That was fucking shameful, fucking shameful.

The depressing nature of today's and recent results is an unwelcome reminder of too many false dawns. Despite having a better squad of players than in past seasons, we are no nearer being a trophy-winning side.

David Moyes wants Everton to be successful as much as the fans do but it's not working. He has done his best in a difficult job and can leave with his head held high. He has an advantage over us, though; he can walk away.

I know that a lot of blues will say "Who would we get?" Some will feel that we're better with the devil we know. But not being able to accept mediocrity and believing that we are above the mentality of mid-table existence is the overriding belief amongst Evertonians.

The saying "a change is as good as a rest" best sums up where I feel Everton are at the moment. We could maybe stand still for another few seasons which wouldn't be a disaster. Or we could make a change of manager, take a risk and maybe benefit from the energy that the right appointment could bring to the club.

Just throwing it out there.

Even Southampton at home where I considered us to be playing our most effective football of the season saw us revert to a modest second-half performance. Yes we should have had at least 6 more points in the bag this season and that is down to our failings not the ability of the opposition nor the crazy refereeing.

If we had have been in the top 3 what's wrong with that, I'm not saying that's what I expect but I would take it.

The 2005 side lacked abiltiy but had heart and character , today's team has bags of ability but lacks bottle.

I am not a Moyes lover but neither do I dislike him, I was trying to point out that he is the manager and if he is as good as everybody thinks he is why hasn't he got the results especially this season, to prove his ability.

If Moyes stays fine we'll take that and move on if he decides to leave then the sooner he does so the better. But the uncertainty of the situation is not helping in the slightest.

As regards to who replaces him, that is a decision for Mr Kenwright to make.

Don't worry, lads – you'll soon have absolutely nothing to play for and you can go back to obscurity!

Still, er, hard to argue with most it. But overall think we may be getting just a tiny wee bit OTT. Few outside the current top three can start without three or four of their best eleven and not feel it. We have a paper thin squad which had looked a little more robust at the start of the season but suddenly seems much, much, less solid. Yelavic the hero is now a hate figure for some despite the fact that its clear he simply isn't getting anything like the service he was last season, and that with us apparently playing much better. "We didn't miss Fellani....." What ? Are you mad ? He drives me crazy with the way he's hot and cold, some games unstoppable, some totally disinterested. But he's head and shoulders a standout class act when you see a performance like this and we missed him, how we missed him, as we did his countryman Mirallas.

I suspect, well pray, that Fellani, Mirallas, Gibson and Hibbo, will all start against Arsenal. We will be better. But we are playing a better team and there's a series of tough games to come. Howard made several very good saves today then lost us two points. Moyes reverted to type and lost the plot in the second half when he failed miserably to spot the need to take of JH and bring on either Duffy or Hibbo to get the height and challenge back into the centre of defence. Velios for 25 minutes could have made the difference as we won so little in the air up front.

We are in a very poor spell but its nothing like as grim as that aweful football up until mid Jan last season. Not sure you can tell that from this set of very depressed commentaries but it really is tough bring a blue....particularly when the bastards tease you and pretend to be fourth place challengers then play utter shit just to smack you right back down again. How dare you dream !

Again today against probably a bottom 6 side it was disjointed and confidence was low. Similar to Reading, Everton started the 2nd half like all they could do was to hang onto a slender lead. Everton's hit and hope football will always encourage the confidence of inferior sides and they'll up their work rate.

Everton have now dropped so many points so far this season when they shouldn't have done and I think they are getting more disheartened as the season plays out. They haven't got the inner strength to win at all costs and maintain a good standard of play throughout the game. We also try to hang onto slender leads which is also shows mental weakness.

My most disappointing match of the season so far was the derby match. I was hoping for a big reaction from the nervous shambles of a defeat against Liverpool in the FA semi but from the start of the match they dominated us and quickly went 2-0 up. We are still mentally frightened of them. Big psychological issues!

I think Everton have the football ability to be 4th but mentally they are one of the weakest teams in the Premier League. I think this reflects on Moyes ability as a manager. He can spot a good player but I don't think he can make individuals winners or the team tactically winners.

Are people really that surprised that a midfield containing Osman and Hitzlsperger (who was a free agent until about a month ago) struggled to keep going in the second half?

Our squad is thin so some are playing who are obviously not yet up to full fitness or properly settled (it is still too early, IMO, to say whether Naismith will make it or not) and Pienaar and Jelavic not being in form would be a problem even with a fully fit squad.

Individual errors and the manager's reluctance to roll the dice with some audacious substitutions are annoying, but the reality is we could (and should) have got something from the majority of the games we have ended up drawing or losing (in particular, Sunderland did not deserve to beat us no matter how we contrived to keep them in a game they should have been obliterated in).

On the subject of Tim Howard; yes he has weaknesses but can anyone name a potentially available keeper who is either faultless or consistently better?

He's picked up some great buys in the last year (eg: Mirallas, Jelavic, Gibson) and many before that (eg: Fellaini, Baines) and has got the team playing in an attractive usually effective style. Effective as in the players are creating chance after chance after chance... They just can't seem to convert them though and that is down to the players on the pitch, not Moyes's tactics or a sub here or there that did or didn't come in. I shudder to think of the day he leaves us as I believe no other manager that we could realistically get could improve us working in the confines of our financial circumstances.

On that form alone, we should be on 33 points, but have thrown away 12 points to various issues. This game, as much as I'd love to blame Moyes is down to that "pass/shot/cross/whatever-the-fuck" from Naismith to Jelavic. If he'd passed that to his team mate we'd have been 2 - 0 up and possibly gone on to get 3 or 4.

I thought Jags was good —and anyone thinking Heitinga and Distin would pick up where they left off six months ago is kidding themselves — keep that defensive four for the next two games.

Oviedo is a star and controls the hoofball quite well. Him and Mirallas with Jelavic and Fellaini will be a handful for Arsenal or anyone they play against.

Finally, Andy Walker, us in the (for now quiet) MOB mostly refrain form naming potential Moyes replacements because whatever name we've put forward has been ignorantly passed off — we had people claiming the hypothetical arrival of SAF wouldn't be good enough as he only does well with money, naysayers telling us Mourinho wouldn't cope, Villas-Boas was unproven, etc etc. What I'm saying is, we realise that whatever manager we suggest, the Apologists are going to have something negative to say about it.

Not Moyes's best day today and I agree that it seemed obvious we could do with some more energy and physical presence on the park. I reckon if we had Duffy and Barkley on we might just have stopped that equaliser.

(1) Sponds play in goal for us today?
(2) Sponds play #14 for us today?
(3) Sponds not make a sub until the Canaries scored?
(4) Sponds magically decide that a team our starting 11 ought to have murdered will get a draw

No. No. No. No.

Today, the sponds train of thought gets us absolutely nowhere when explaining that – acknowledgment to Mr Barry – dire, drab, dross, deficient, disgusting, disgraceful, distressing, depressing, dreary, Delia-pleasing (2nd half) display.

We were a shadow of ourselves 2nd half and lame and lazy sponds explanations will get us nowhere to explain it. Mind you, that jammy bastard Billy Sponds is knocking them in these days for the Fenland boys, ain't he!

I'm going to say it again. Bastards.

COYB

The bench didn't look all that bad on paper. I know Moyes sees them at training, but he also must see them on the field. I have been coming around on Osman, but my God he cannot shoot.

My point about not missing Fellaini was a nod to our first half performance... In which we played some of the best football we've played all season. On that basis we didn't miss him. Especially the way he played last week.

We are quite clearly capable if playing our new brand of clever football without him. I stand by my earlier statement.

At one point during the second half we had Distin in a wall with all the Norwich big men lined up at the back post. At the last second, Distin withdrew from the wall and went to the back stick to help out, which suggests that at least he was using a brain.

It was probably with threadbare bench, but Moyes should have changed things round or at least realised that Norwich changed their gameplan by pressing higher up the field and exploited the space behind the defence.

But the more you look at Norwich's goal, the more you ask what the fuck was Howard doing??? The ball was in the air a long time for defenders and goalie to adjust. A Hail Mary ball that you'd be pissed off if the school Under-11 team conceded from it.

I just wanted to say again how good I thought Oviedo was. I know a few on here have commented positively on his performance but I just thought he really was good and has lots of potential.

Saw him first briefly in was it the Tony Hibbert testimonial and was impressed. And then at Leeds – a shit performance by those around him but he showed well at times. And then yesterday. He's eager for the ball, fast, can control and pass, runs back to cover, and those quick feet. Quick feet like that just thrill me (reminds me of Drenthe but let's not go there!).

So the one positive from yesterday is looking forward to the Life of Bryan. We cannot afford to drop Pienaar, in poor form, with a realistic alternative.

A 40-yard ball into the 6-yard box, FFS! Schoolboy goalkeeping. I also believe because he is a Yank and hasn't been brought up on the game, he doesn't get the finer points of being a goalie. This is one of many poor, poor decisions he has made in the past, far too reluctant to command his box, or come off his line — a distinctly average player.

Not fucking good enough for this side.

I very seldom remember him making great saves. Good saves, yes he's a decent shot stopper but compared to some of the other keepers in the Premier League I'm not sure he does enough and this is supported by the amount of games this season where we have had twice as many shots on target as the opposition but still drawn or lost.

We need Mirallas and Gibson back to give us guile, directness and steel. I thought Oviedo was a real spark – as was, of course, Bainesy. Pienaar is a little off colour at present as, of course, is Jelly. I agree that Howard needs some stiff competition, and I'd still like to see JH and SD in the middle (although Jags is a good blocker and tackler, his positional play and passing eave a lot to be desired).

It's time for Moyes to shake things up a bit.

ps: We should not let Bainesy go to Man Utd – even for £20M, let alone £8M!

TH has gone from a good goalie that was prone to errors, to an error strewn goalie that makes a decent save. Top priority in January.

He's not going to learn anything new at his age. At 33, we need to address that position anyway.

Despite selling a lot of players, we are still left with too many players who lack quality. We depend too much on Jelavic; if he is out of form then we struggle up front.

Moyes has a big job to do, our central defence is looking very poor this season. The question is should Moyes buy Forren and just go for a loan player in midfield? I do not envy the task Moyes has, there are holes in the squad that can not be filled by players like Anichebe and Gueye. I think a clear-out is needed, Gueye and Anichebe have had enough time, they really should not be here.

Moyes should start using Duffy and Barkley... perhaps even Junior. Problem is Moyes loves oldies goldies like Neville and Distin. Bringing in Hitz was desperate, it gives Barkley and Junior more time to develop, but how are our young players ever going to make it just playing for the U-21 side?????

Moyes is overrated with regards to getting youngsters ready for PL football. Just last season, Moyes was forced into bringing Duffy back, and Duffy did very well but was dropped. This time, Barkley should be playing ahead of Hitz, as Barkley has played for two months, while Hitz has been out for a long time and is just back from injury.

Logic tells me that Barkley is an automatic pick given he has fitness and sharpness while Hitz is a long way from being fit and ready to play consecutive games.

Moyes makes some strange calls, like bringing back Barkley from a loan, but not playing him.

However, I think he has reverted to type again. The man is clearly a good talent spotter and has made some very astute signings through the years; Cahill, Gravesen, Mirallas, Jelavic, Baines to name just a few.

However, I'm beginning to think that this all he might be good for. He clearly is tactically inept and reads the game very poorly. Game in, game out, he makes the same poor decisions which cost us points. If we sit back and invite pressure, chances are we WILL concede. You would never ever see Ferguson, Mourinho, Wenger and now even Steve Clarke who does understand the game employ these tactics.

I for one hope that this is indeed Moyes last season and he doesn't sign another contract. He's done well for us on occasions and kept us up and put us in great positions. But he doesn't seem to be able to learn and plays negative tactics with favourites who under perform. Why do you think the other clubs as big as us, Spurs, Newcastle, Chelsea, Man City etc have not even interviewed him for their positions???

Anish, I too hope this is Moyes's last season with us, but acknowledge that wherever he goes, he will take with him an ability to find good cheap players, which will leave us with perhaps a better manager but less targets within our reach.

The best outcome for Everton would be to have Moyes as a scout/squad list manager, with an actual football brain managing the playing side of things.

Mourinho, especially during inter Milan's Champions League run, was renowned for scoring and then sitting back and being very organised and compact at the back and difficult to break down.

Of course these are some of the best teams in the world but any team can look nervous with a one- or even two-goal lead and I have seen all the managers you mention have teams that fall back for the last 10 or 20 minutes on occasion in tight games.

He also has to sideline some of his favourites, most notably Osman whose ability to give the opposition the initiative in midfield (especially when we are on top), while performing the odd (metaphorical) pirouette, is now legendary. He shouldn't even be in the squad.

And Baines must not be sold AT ANY COST – and certainly not to the ugly, ungracious shambles of a football club that is Manchester Utd. We have to try to hold on to Fellaini and Baines at any cost.

Inter were also playing against the best teams in the world and were probably the weaker team in a few of their ties. We were at home to Norwich.

You are right but it does seem that Everton deploy this tactic a lot earlier than they should. The writing was on the wall for me when I seen Howard taking his time over goal kicks before there was 70 mins on the clock. I think it shows the fear and lack of confidence the players carry around when we have a slender lead.

Saying that, it seems that everyone else is choking as well (perhaps we're not the embarrassment to football that some people seem to like to make us out to be). Everyone has seen the sort of football we're capable of this season, we know it's there and that we potentially have the ability to win every match.

That has not been the case in previous seasons, I remember the infamous 'football lottery' paradigm that was aired on here at the start of last season, we were so bad that we never really had control of any games and the result was often purely down to chance on where the ball dropped.

Now we know we have the ability to score and control possession. Gibson could return, along with Hibbert; Jelavic and Pienaar could find their from and we could quite easily go on a great run regardless of the opposition we're playing. We're not in good form just now but we've scraped by and due to the weakness of others (yes we're not the only team in the league who cock up) we're still within striking distance of the top 4.

This team was never going to go from the depths of the start of last season to a comfortable top 4 team this year just because of the acquisition of Mirallas and Naismith. There was always going to be a wobble, every team has them, throw in some ill-timed injuries and suspensions and they are made all the worse.

The sign of what sort of team you are is how you react to these set backs. If we get all our players back and keep losing points and finish mid-table then that is unfortunately our level. I think though we'll get them back and kick back into good form, some of our football has been too good not to be rewarded in the long run.

Its a marathon not a sprint, every game is equal, we're going to unexpectedly beat top teams and we're going to inevitably lose to bottom ones, that's football. Sensing a return to winning ways against Arsenal though.

Norwich might have beat Arsenal and Utd but I don't think they had to play well against us to get a result. I also think too much has been made of the players we have missing, how many players of the teams we've played recently would get into our side even with some of our players missing? What we had out on the pitch on Saturday should have been enough to beat Norwich. We do have a lot of players out of form but who's fault is that for leaving them on the pitch for 90 mins?

I walked away disappointed, but credit to Norwich who worked their socks off and were worthy of the point. I was very impressed with their No 14 Hoolihan who was very lively, unlike a few of our stars.

A lot of the frustration comes from raised expectations, which for me have been tempered in recent weeks.

Loss of form and injuries to key players have highlighted our lack of depth, but as you say it's a marathon not a sprint, so here's hoping we can stay in the mix and BK gives Moyes a few bob in January to freshen things up, for what could still be a very good season. Roll on Wednesday.

• Martin O'Neil
• Alex Mcleish
• Di Matteo
• Steve McClaren

All available and on your basis better than Moyes as they've won something, or if I'm wrong tell me who would fit your criteria to replace Moyes?

I wont hold my breath mate.

What really gets me about your post though, Andy is how, out of all the managers that are out of a job and who have won things (couple of massive ones you missed), you pick four that have been recently sacked and that you obviously think aren't any good.

Say what you want about the former Chelsea manager, but that nationally ambiguous little fella is one of only a few dozen men to have managed a team to European glory - something Moyes will never do.

My question is, how many managers have worked at a club for 11 years and won nowt?

I've tried seeing Moyes differently this year, but even at the start of the season when we were playing well I knew in the back of my mind he was still the same dithering poser.

Might sound like a kid throwing his toys out, but I'm bored by his constant pragmatism. Managed answers and "honest top 8 finishes" are not the way to grow as a club.

Yeah Middlesborough won the League Cup I think. But even so that's only four teams out of 160 if you think of it as 16 clubs over ten years (strange logic but sort of makes sense to me). So fair to say it's very rare indeed.

In terms of how many managers have not won trophies over 10 years its a fair point but then there are probably only about 3 managers who have had 10 years in the Premier League and two of them were at Man Utd and Arsenal, so I'm not sure it's a totally fair comparison.

I'm interested in your 160 club logic. I think I know what you're getting at. Is it the 16 clubs who spend less than the other four?

A different way of looking at it would be that out of 50 titles available to English clubs in 10 years, at least 10 different clubs have gotten in on it, and we're not one of them.

Either way, Arse game about to kick off so let's forget the Norwich game and focus on getting something out of this run of three games.