Everton's complacency punished as they toss away routine victory

As for our friend Morgan. Erm.

Full support blues. I fancy Moise to break his duck tonight. Don't ask me why.

Onward Evertonians 💙

I have always thought the Kings Dock failure hit Everton more than anything else.

Our midfielders are much of a muchness in terms of quality, however his half-arsed sauntering around the pitch is treasonous.

Carlo alternates Coleman and Sidibe a lot for a starting position. Tom Davies has been playing with a knock for some weeks and is probably being managed on that basis.

Given the absentees of Siggy and Richie hopefully just short-term and Gomes and Gbamin long-term, there really aren't a lot of alternatives to call on for a starting position.

Hopefully that starting XI, plus whoever comes on from the bench, still have enough to claim three vital points tonight.

Just needs to go get his hat trick now

Happy to have Newcastle come on to us, even if it does give us a couple of nervy moments.

In the main, we have been the better and more threatening team and the lead is well deserved.

Absolutely delighted for Kean. And a good goal it was too, from front to back. A good pick out by Mina to Dom. Excellent flick on to Bernard. Good anticipation and movement by Kean to Bernard's lovely dinked pass. Good finish by the young Italian. Nice control, even though the ball fell behind him. Good adjustment to get his shot away and then sufficient power to score.

I like the way we are drilling crisp passes from midfield to our middle forwards and the movement off them.

I can see more goals for us in the second half.

Fate Personified: “Hold my beer.”

I'm too shocked to be angry. That'll come later. I think the subs were wrong and led to us losing control. We were coasting and Coleman didn't effect things too much but Niasse did. He didn't chase down Delph was trying to do so for him and behind him. Why didn't Gordon come on instead?

I like Tom Davies but he was so poor, it was another unnecessary sub. We don't have a game for ages. Let them run 10 more.

Ancelotti this was on you.

Another baffling substitution from Carlo.. utterly pointless bringing on a forward at 88 minutes when two nil up.. let alone Niasse who then proceeds to concede possession every time he touches the ball..

Carlo must take the blame here. Poor game management.

I don't want to hear any of this "patience " lark, this is on Ancelotti.
DF fucked this Zonal marking off. Ancelotti re-introduces it.

Thats three goals we have conceded through dead ball situations. . whats it gonna take ?

One thing I can say. Can we please never, ever bring Niasse on the pitch again. Just have him play in the reserves and pick up his wages 'till be buggers off in June. It's a slap in the face for hard working decent people to see this guy running around like a donkey yet getting paid £55k/week.

Will try to erase those two minutes from memory to stay sane.

Very happy for Kean and DCL now into double figures for league goals. I'll eat humble pie there. The kids certainly stepped up.

Season is over anyway. Just 10 points to go. All just a bit of a laugh now.

we played well and were in total control but that result is on Carlo I'm afraid for his subs.

The other effect is even we do win and I'm watching, say MOTD, and I know we have won there is still a part of me that expects us to lose.

My first thought on bearing it was 2-1 was that it will end up as 2-2.

Would love to hear from those ToffeeWebbers who know best and criticise loyal fans for daring to say Ancelotti was fortunate with his subs against Brighton.

Ancelotti must take his share of blame tonight. Davies and even more so Niasse just gave ball away. Why take Kean off with around 25 minutes still left?

I don't lay the blame on 2 points lost solely on Ancelotti, Pickford (another who many say he's fine despite v bad statistical evidence otherwise) was just if not more culpable. Flapping at cross as always and then being behind his line for second goal?

That all said the major fault is weak mentality from entire team. Shitting themselves from kick off, no guts from Delph (who was brought in as a leader and has “balls” to criticise a fan on social media) or others in midfield / just lump ball up to nowhere then criminal defending off a free kick from the middle of the pitch.

Depressing

Yes, there were lots of people to blame for this one, but Davies is #1 and nobody else is close. Concede the corner, fail to mark, commit an utterly brainless foul in the middle of the pitch, and then completely miss a header that an 8-year-old could have performed because he was too busy pointing at people.

Nice blonde local kid with an IQ of 65. Enough.

This is what they do to us!!

My son, 5 went to bed thinking we won 2-0 and he was chuffed! I can't tell him !!

He has history doing this. Remember Istanbul? He took of Crespo when they were cruising and collapsed like tonight. Wake up Carlo ffs!!!

If Carlo needed any reminders of who needs ditching it was there for all to see, and that was with bringing on an extra defender.

I do not like Schneiderlin, but he wasn't bad for most of the game, credit where it's due, and I never thought I would ever say that.

Tonight Carlo got the tempo right early, got the all important first goal, we then had an easy night and they looked a poor team.

Then Carlo after getting lucky last week starts making subs for subs sake despite absolutely no need. Adopts fucking Italians tactics from the 1990s and so they have 4 centre backs attacking our defence. Honestly he couldn't have played into their hands anymore had he tried. I actually feel for the players tonight.

Have to disagree with part of your statement "Any other player costing us games with idiotic mistakes this often would be gone already, " I'd say you're spot on if you substituted the word "would" for "should" as we've had a long history of tolerating calamity Jane types well past the point of no return. Even as a kid I remember Neil McDonald given game after game despite an amazing knack to do stupid things.

How Everton is that?

We've totally dominated the game. A 4 or 5-0 scoreline would not flatter us. They have had one shot on goal all night. It's 93 minutes with just a minute of injury time to play.

And we contrive to gift them not one, but two goals.

Absurd!

Yes, they had the best of things in the final 10 minutes, but nothing threatening.

The turning point was Davies and Digne trying to be too cute playing it out tight in our left hand corner. Both had chances to simply whack it down the line for the team to regroup and keep them at arm's length.

Instead, their overplaying it resulted in a corner from which they score.

The second is the defence retreating too deep and allowing Newcastle to put it in the mixed and keep the ball alive.

Neither goal has nothing - absolutely nothing - to do with zonal marking or poor tactics by the manager, but rather poor in-game management and decision making by the players on the pitch.

Unfortunately, their two goals coming so late will dominate the post-match discussion when over the full course of the game there was a lot to enjoy and feel positive about.

Utter nonsense.

I'm not holding Ancelotti 80-90% responsible. He is totally responsible. He fucked up big time. Not only with his substitutions but by re-introducing and persevering with a tactic which has been the death of us for two years.

Every single one of them overpaid wankers on that pitch should be completely ashamed of themselves!

1] Liverpool's kids - enough said

2] Newcastle - for 93 mins they were the feeblest opposition we have faced this season. But our lot conspire to collapse in the last 2 minutes. Another minute or 2 and we'd probably have conceded a 3rd.

Settle in and expect more of the same in the games to come.

Good luck Carlo.

Roll on summer and a break from this.

"Neither goal has nothing - absolutely nothing - to do with zonal marking or poor tactics by the manager".

You exclude the clause in which I justified why I made that claim.

I look forward to you justifying why it's 'utter nonsense' to say so.

Spot on. You have to wonder what these people are actually looking at when you read their comments.

Lets blame the youngster instead

Because, Darren #70, when a player gives away a foolish corner for one goal and then commits a totally ridiculous foul in the center circle to give the opponent a last chance for another -- and then completely misses an easy clearing header because he's too busy talking -- that player is a fucking moron.

Not absolving Ancelotti at all here -- the last two subs were foolish -- but the last time a player committed this much idiocy in injury time to cost us a game was... gee, let's see now... Tom fucking Davies.

Enough is enough with this dumb kid. 21 and local just isn't an excuse anymore.

He doesn't learn from his mistakes.

"Why the fuck is Tom Davies taking the blame again ?" probably because he gave away two needless set pieces that cost us the game. Also because since his goal against city about four years ago he hasn't shown himself adept at tackling, dribbling, passing, shooting or anything else really. I don't like abuse being handed out but I am of the opinion at this point that he's just not very good.

As for managers, since about 1988 more often than not I've been hearing how the manager should get the sack. So many have come and gone while the same players make millions and happily keep picking up their paychecks.

You could argue that he was arrogant to assume that they could do a job but Coleman, Davies and Niasse are yesterday's players.

Should never play for Everton again.

Marco Silva would have been absolutely hammered for those substitutions tonight that evidently were so unbelievably defensive it was unreal.

Ancelotti HAS to take a lot of the blame for that tonight.

I can't believe what I've just witnessed to be honest, I fuckin hate this club I really do.

That's our answer to the Redshite winning virtually every tournament there is.!

We never fail to disappoint so we?

Stupid, weak, no game management or understanding how to see the game out. Sadly we have done this so many times over the last few seasons it's unbelievable.

Plus point being it means nothing. We aren't knocked out from a cup, we aren't relegated, we havnt just thrown away European football for next season. It's just more disappointment in a poor season.

Really happy for Kean and DCL.
Ancelotti is learning about players but needs to take some responsibility for his subs. Surely he knows Niasse and Schnides don't have a future with us.

Get another 10 points ASAP then play the kids. Roll on next game to learn, improve and implement the game plan over 99 plus mins.

Ancelotti, you really fucked up with those subs.

On the plus side, there were some very good performances tonight and the majority of the players did not deserve that result. They were let down.

Tom Davies is a local lad, he's also thick as shit and a bit crap too.

If you want to see out a match send Tom Davies out of the stadium.

We offered a team whose only threat comes from high balls to camp in our box due to a planned tactical response from Carlo.

We're re-creating the same pissed logic we fall back on with every manager. He can fuck up till the cows come home, but the kids are still gonna get it

Something of a shame, as they also turned in some good football tonight.

I've got no problem with the 3 players subbed - none of them have 90 minutes in them (Kean will have but not yet).

The reason we lost is not zonal marking - we defended well for 93 minutes. It's not the players brought on. Pickford flapping at that corner put them back into the game. If he had dealt with that initial corner better, we'd be 2 points better off tonight.

We played well but Pickford has cost us again with that first goal. Whenever he is playing well, I am always still wondering when his next clanger will be. A top keeper deals with that corner and we win.

Pickford is a great shot-stopper, but on crosses, there's always a mistake in him. That's what cost us tonight.

It's been 15 years since Istanbul, Carlo. I thought you'd learnt your lesson.

But he's young and one of ours so we must overlook the fact that he's a walking disaster waiting to give the ball away and concede possession in dangerous areas of the pitch.

Mike once again is correct he plays with his inflated ego head up his own arse.

Chris #99, you may be right about the Niasse sub -- I had the same thought for a second.

Paul #110, you're right, Pickford could have done a LOT better on both. But those chances never should have happened, and I'm willing to cut him a little bit more slack because he has bailed out so many of our defensive mistakes this season with those big saves.

Sadly having been patient, I am coming round to Mike Gaines view on Tom Davies. Would struggle for a game in most other premier teams

Not sure on Gordon but I recall people demanding Barkley, Stones, Beningame, davies, Lookman etc play when they were overlooked. None of them proved their supporters right long term.

Shocking and bewildering, and as much as I rate and want Tom Davis to succeed, it's the same mistakes repeating in many games this season.
This isn't progress and it's not good enough, and whilst Tom is not solely to blame as bad defending and sluggish midfield has given the barcodes a lifeline, and they smelled blood.

Next x2 up and Watford will be ready to fight to the death and the concern is this squad won't and don't have the stomach for a fight.

Leaderless and clueless on the park, no game management, and another golden opportunity lost to claw back vital points.

Well a point is a point but in some ways perhaps we was luckily there wasn't 6 mins injury time.

Only Everton blow leads so regularly and fail to win when 1-0, down.

Perhaps some of the TW stato bearers, can add clarity to which team has blown 1-0, 2-0, leads the most the last couple of years.

And may be Carlo is curable for taking off our best player, Bernard, and yielding to Steve Bruce's Newcastle to get stuck in to Everton, in the last 10 minutes.

So much for x4 wins, and my only hope is 5gat this squad may step up in the tough away games in London, Arsenal and Chelsea, and at home against our northwest rivals United and the RS.

Hopefully there's a few rays of light still beaming bright for the future but a tough run in to the end of this season, until this team learns game management and cuts out reckless tackle# around our own box.

That's a lack of professionalism by the players on the field not bad management.

Newcastle were as bad as I've seen any visiting side. They were down to third-stringers.

Ancelotti rightly used the opportunity to try and get Niasse in the shop window and to give Davies a run in a more advanced midfield position. Sidibe was hopeless so it made sense to move him where he could do less damage.

At the point in the match those subs were made Newcastle had not had a kick.

The players on the field should have been able to manage the game out.

1) For 75 mins we looked like a really good team, and given the amount of time Carlo has actually had to coach them, and some of the shit choices he's got to work with, it's positive signs at least. The system works.

2) We now get some decent gaps between games so he can coach them more about how he wants them to play, get some more players back, and hopefully recharge the squad a bit.

The bench today was pretty shit full stop. There was no pace or skill to bring on to replace the ones that had tired. and if he'd left them on and we had STILL conceded 2 (unless you live in parallel universe you don't know that we wouldn't have) we'd all be shouting about that too.

With Richie back, we'll have Moise Kean to bring on for tired legs, and be able to keep some pace and threat. We desperately need competition for Walcott on the right, and some alternative cover for Bernard on the left.

Get 1-2 decent players in, and the walking wounded back. and Carlo will have much more quality from the bench, and less square pegs Davis at left wing? Nope.

Not only that, any other club watching with interest will soon backtrack if they see him play.

I do blame, and this pains me, Tom Davies. I like the kid, always have. But what he did this evening is just inexcusable.

He has to show more intelligence, or he does need shipping out. He can not continue giving away the ball in dangerous positions, or gifting the opposition with opportunities in our own third by committing fouls.

It's simple. If you do that, you're a detriment to the team.

He cost us a very valuable 2 points.

It's just heart-wrenching because we played very well for 90 minutes. We were moving the ball wonderfully, we were on the front foot, Kean got a goal, everything you could ask for. All of it undone, and the undoing is down to really one player in Tom Davies.

He's still young. But he has to start to show massive progress in his decision making ability, or I do believe we should sell him off and make some money on the boy. I don't want that, but the time for excusing mistakes is now up. He needs to respond, and respond with flawless decision making here on in.

aargh.

I was screaming in the Park End like a 5 year old with a tantrum at the end of that, but when we step back there was an enormous amount of encouragement to be had. We played some really lovely stuff in patches, Calvert-Lewin and Holgate were great and Schneiderlin was excellent.

Infuriating but very encouraging actually.

I'm not saying you haven't got a point on Zonal marking Darren, but that wasn't the issue tonight, because Pickford, gave a very weak punch for the first goal, and Davies completely got under that diagonal ball, for the second.

We lost because we relaxed, and we are simply not good enough to relax, which was proven the way we panicked when the Geordies scored their first goal, with so little time left on the clock.

A point that feels like a loss, and like Jamie Crowley, I also felt it was the best game we had played until Carlo Ancellotti went all Italian, and took off our forwards.

If Niasse is getting rewarded by being given game time for turning down a move to the championship, I shudder, but some good performances have been ruined, by some bad calls off our manager, and if he wants us to kill time and become better at game management, then he's got to go and bring in players with that type of character that is so sadly lacking at our club.

We had 7 defensive players on the pitch in that last 60 seconds plus that hyperactive retard in goal yet we somehow contrive to throw away two goals in 40 seconds.

I've said it so many times, we have a group of seriously stupid, and I mean mentally stupid players at this club.

Our in-game management is virtually nonexistent for a Premier League club.

I know Carlo is being paid a kings ransom but Tonight I can't help but suspect a small part of him is thinking “why did I agree to this?”

The managers tactics (whether considered poor or not) employ passing out of defence.. this, by your own admission got us into trouble.. ergo, you're contradicting yourself by excluding his tactics as being culpable.

I don't need to go much further than that. but what was also fairly obvious was the implications of bringing on Niasse and the consequences his actions had before each goal.

Exactly Tony. The subs were what they were. Carlo is going to see games out, I've said that now multiple times. We had enough quality, even with Niasse out there, to see that game out.

We lost our concentration. That's a mortal sin in any sport.

We choked. Unacceptable. At this level of football, concentration can't dip at any point over the course of the game.

They thought they had it in the bag. Hopefully the humility lesson will ensure it doesn't happen again.

To bring on utter useless, tactical shite in Davies and Niasse was unbelievable to run the clock down.

Let's not insult the majority of teams in the Championship. This month needs to see a clear out of the League 1 category players who have milked this club too long.

Serial bottle jobs the lot of them.

Good

At least Ancelotti can see the size of the task and the absolute bunch of morons he has to manage

I could understand the Coleman one, and we didn't lose total control and kept getting chances. Kean had been operating on the touchline for some reason and Walcott was playing in a 10 position, for about 5 minutes before Kean went off. Coleman was added to sure up the back line. Don't like that, but we have an Italian manager and I could understand and accept it.

The next one, Tom Davies for Bernard, I could understand that Bernard might have been tiring but he seemed ok to me, and we don't have another game now until 1st February, so not empty the tank? I could understand the desire to add a body in the middle and go 532.

The Niasse sub made no sense. Initially I thought it was Calvert-Lewin coming off. He looked tired, he was getting in scraps and perhaps could be taken off. Instead it was Walcott. So why not take Walcott off and bring on Gordon to run about off the striker (his position, not Niasse's) and use his technique and composure to keep the ball and run down the clock?

Niasse really pissed me off, I watch Delph run around him to chase down defenders that Niasse was brought on to chase after. Niasse didn't bother chasing any defenders, he gave the ball away very cheaply, as did Davies who was too cold to get up to speed in the middle, I mean he had hardly got his top on by the time he was running onto the pitch, so was he ready? Was he focused? Did he know what he had to do? He looked lost and off the pace.

I see zonal marking is blamed, so I'll have to watch it back to see the goals, as I was too far away to understand exactly what happened, there was just oo many bodies in the box.

I still cannot believe that game. I'm still fuming. And yeah, the weak willed players cost us the game but those subs, we went from in control and coasting to hanging on to lucky the ref blew before they won it.

Twice now he has substituted Coleman for a forward, moving Sidibe up from RB to RM and then the midfielder up top (last time Rich, today Theo). Both times it made perfect sense, but both times it failed.

Sidibe, who on both occasions was having a fine game at RB (he was splendid for the first 60 minutes today), promptly went off the boil when he was moved up, and Seamus wasn't at his best off the bench.

If Carlo is as smart as I think, he won't do this again. If Darren is right, he will. Let's see.

He's not progressing, Holgate and DCL have kicked on - he's stagnated. Yes, Ancelotti has to take the blame for his curious substitutions - no manager is going to get a tune out of the fading Coleman and diabolical Niasse. Pity as the joined up football in the second half was the best I've seen all season.

Those claiming the goals had nothing to do with zonal marking need to ask why the defence is riddled with uncertainty ? why has this suicidal dumbfuckery been re-introduced ? Why did so many fear the worst when that corner was awarded ?

People can bury their heads as much as they want, but no amount of apologising gets Ancelotti off the hook tonight

Coleman coming on made sense to me. Kean was knackered after putting in a hell of a shift. We were 2-0 up, having Coleman with Sidibe in front of him made us more solid defensively.

Tom Davies came on in the 83rd minute for a tiring Bernard. Bernard never lasts 90 minutes. Davies wasn't at his best but he is normally capable of getting on the ball and passing it, and getting some tackles in when we don't have it. He's certainly capable of this in a 10 minute cameo when we are 2-0 up.

Omar Niasse came on for Theo Walcott in the 88th minute. We were still 2-0 up and this was just a like for like sub, wasting some time to see the game out.

As far as 93 minutes, I'm sure we were all relatively happy at a good performance where we were deservedly ahead.

Don't let the last minute cloud your judgement. Pickford has fucked up on that corner and put us under pressure and we have buckled. That is it. We never looked like conceding prior to that. It is nothing to do with the manager being at fault for substitutions, Tom Davies being at fault for giving away a corner or a free kick on the halfway line.

If that corner is handled properly, none of us would be talking about the last minute or the manager's substitutions.

I think most of us will benefit and be glad for nearly two weeks without this calamity of a football club.

Pickford was barely called on to make a save all game.

Sidibe, while crisp and inventive in his passing in the opposition half, continues to display serious liabilities when playing full-back. He is often caught way out of position when possession is turned over. Too many times, cute short round-the-corner balls by him are easily picked off exposing us as the opposition runs away from him.

Mina and Holgate were both extremely solid. They both stepped forward with the ball at times, playing crisp and clever passes through midfield or even further forward as per Mina's involvement for our first goal.

Digne again a bit of a mixed bag, but better than Sidibe on the opposite flank, once again reviving his partnership with Bernard to good effect. For a number of games now he has got in behind the defence and pulled a number of decent balls back. Unfortunately, on each occasion, the forwards have run in on goal. An alert midfielder running from deep in anticipation of this could serve us well.

Bernard was clearly our creative spark having been such a damp squib v WHU. Not everything he tries comes off. He overcooks the ball at times, but he opens up lines of attack other players can't or won't attempt.

Delph and Schneiderlin were good in what they did tonight! They were switching position well, with one staying 'at home' whilst the other ventured forward depending on the game situation. They kept the ball moving with a nice range of passing and switching of direction.

Walcott also had a good game. Possibly his best of the season. Full of energy and running and no little skill.

Kean most definitely had his best game in an Everton shirt. An excellent goal. Good strength and running with the ball. Some nice interplay with DCL. Lots more to come from the boy.

Dom, another outstanding game. He leads the line so well. Another good finish and, as he and Holgate always do, he never backs down. Really funny moment when following the coming together with Lascelles who tried to get in his face, Dom took the piss pretending the defender had a bad case of halitosis.

The passing from front to back was much slicker, inventive and varied, with many a fine ball played through the heart of midfield to attack, not solely down the flanks as has been the case for most of the season.

As for the subs, Kean has been subbed in or out in every game he has played for Everton. Walcott assumed his role alongside Dom and both continued to create havoc in the Newcastle defence.

That was on 71 minutes. Bernard - another player who never plays the full 90 minutes - was subbed out on 83 minutes for Davies. Yes, Newcastle were getting more into our half, but not in or around our penalty area. Things were still comfortable.

Niasse only came on for Walcott on 88 minutes - yet another player who commonly never plays the full 90 minuts - with Everton still comfortably in control of the game and result.

Did it smack of one of those sub a player out to allow him the applause his performance merited, or maybe a Goodison farewell appearance for Niasse? Who knows.

But to believe either of those latter two subs dramatically changed the dynamic of the game as some are claiming is overstating it, IMO.

As I wrote earlier, but for Davies and Digne playing silly buggers deep and tight in our own corner rather than launching it down the line, the corner their first goal comes from doesn't happen and the game is comfortably played out to the final whistle.

The loss of two points and a leap up the table to 8th in the final minute of the game resulted primarily from poor decision making in-game by the players on the pitch, NOT zonal marking or the manager's tactics and substitutions.

And for me personally, there were far more positives to take from both the collective and individual performances of the players tonight than negatives that many are claiming.

Ancelotti has to take his share of the blame but he's clearly trying to get Niasse in the shop window. He won't try that again and hopefully, we never see him in an Everton shirt again, especially given the fact he's sitting on his contact and not going out on loan. It's his right but he's still a dickhead.

The other subs didn't help either. Coleman didn't know where he was playing and Tom was shite as usual because Tom Davies is not very good. Thought Schnedelin was excellent all game for a change and looked like he did in his first few months.

The game was worth playing, though. Ok, we 'Everton' it up but the game was almost worth losing if it meant Kean got off the mark.
I reckon there are plenty more goals to come from him and he should start every game, from now until end of the season. When he finds a rhythm his value will rocket.
Before tonight he was looking like another potentially failed signing. After tonight I think we've got ourselves an absolute bargain. Kean will be worth triple what we paid for him by end of the season.

If the Club decided Gordon was good enough, and they sold Davies and Pickford for an absolute stud of a midfielder and an average, solid keeper?

Would we be a better team?

The problem with egregious mental errors, is you end up asking rhetorical questions like that. Egrefious mental errors force you into that mode of thinking.

Players who continually have their head firmly planted up their ass need to forcefully and quickly pull said heads out of said asses.

I think Tom Davies can do that, in the end. I'm not entirely sure about Jordan. He's an amazing shot stopper - spectacular. But he is a nutter. And at times like this, you can't ignore that characteristic.

The lad is 19 for fucks sake can't he run around for 90 minutes?

Do Liverpool players ever look knackered the amount of games they play?

Gordon for Bernard would have kept Newcastle pushed back because Gordon has energy, whereas Davies would struggle to outrun a tortoise.

Coleman and Sidibe should not have both been on the pitch at the same time.

As I say, if Marco had made those subs he would rightfully getting ripped to pieces on here now so Carlo for me has proven he's not as tactically astute as we thought.

The same thing was close to happening at home to Brighton last week, too many defensive players on and they almost nick a late equaliser through Murray.

And yes, if it were me, I would go man for man, in the old British style.

Average but solid, seems so much better than being flamboyant, when I think about how a goalkeeper should be?

We were winning 2.0 FFS to a side riddled with injuries, away from home and who were not that arsed on the night. You don't bring on "fresh legs" to sit back and defend, you push the ball up into safe spaces and push the game out, at the same time, running the clock down.

Why the fuck have we not got players like Bernard, Walcott and Keane who came off but should surely have 90 mins in them.

Davies and Niasse should never wear the shirt again after that gutless display.

Yes he makes some goods stops but in big moments he's piss weak.

Every time that ball is in the air from crosses or set pieces he's a flapper and as a defender I can't imagine that ever instilling any confidence.

You could never imagine Big Nev or Nigel Martyn being so vulnerable on these areas, that for me is what will always stop Pickford being a top keeper, another player that has regressed instead on progressed this last 18 months.

As I mentioned earlier Walcott and Kean were blowing well before they were subbed.
We do lack leaders on the pitch but regardless the goalie has to rule the penalty area, certainly the six yard box.

2 points dropped tonight and 2 against West Ham. We could and should be well up there

You cannot polish a turd as they say and we have got a steaming hot £400 million pound one right under our noses

Absolutely lunacy

Still scratching my head, it feels like only Everton can manage to throw games away like this.

One of our most dominant games this season only to throw it away at the end.

No need whatsoever to make any of the subs. Doesn't help that Pickford is anchored to his line and that all 3 subs weakened us.

You gotta laugh following us otherwise you would go mad.

Not sure about the players needing a rest, think us fans need a break every now and then.

Got to go, the men with the white coats are at the door.

Schneiderlin put in a couple of passes which were superbly incisive and he looked back to his best.

Young Kean was a joy to watch, full of life and promise.

It's not all shit after that game, far from it. The rhythm of our play and the crispness of our transitions were a pleasure to see. God knows why the manager chose to fuck with it.

I'd give Lossl a go by the way.

Yes, Kenwright played terribly tonight. Should have been substituted.

poor subs - yes. losing composure yes - been like that for while.

I'll take the 92 minutes and try and forget the last two.

The calamities I fear will remain, until the club builds the core around some real leaders of men on the pitch.

It's almost a case of not if, but when, another cock up is gonna happen in or just outside our box.

Pray to God that our two powerhouse midfielders get back soon, but unlikely and they will take time to get going.

The self proclaimed leader of the team on the pitch Fabian Delph, doesn't do it, and I think time seriously to make a new captain to start the gradual transition, at this time in terms of psyche and in summer hopefully with new players.

But I'm not sure if FFP, means there's a limit to our spend unless we sell, and make good profits.

Whatever, this squad, could be knocking on the Europa door, but the last two games, show they have no tactical game management and combat nous, to win and see out games.

No more cliches to say, but there's some genuine rays of hope, but Carlo will need to get some players, who have heart, fight, desire to win and be professional for 96 mins, every game they play.

Absolutely. OK up until these fuck ups in the last minutes.

"And for me personally, there were far more positives to take from both the collective and individual performances of the players tonight than negatives that many are claiming".

Up until those goals that was the best performance of the season. Ancelotti has them playing. Blistering performances by Kean, DCL, Bernard, Holgate.

As for the much-maligned subs, Coleman and Davies didn't really bother me in the moment, though Davies sadly is deserving of all the scorn being thrown his way. Niasse made no sense whatsoever - even if you subscribe to the theory that he's being put in the shop window, how much of a case is he going to make for himself in a few minutes of action? There's no upside.

That being said, I'm not sure the subs really conceded the advantage to the degree some are making out though. Newcastle looked a lot more fluid over those last ten minutes or so, but they still weren't threatening in the slightest until that ill-fated corner kick. We flat-out crapped the bed at the end, plain and simple.

Think it is time to give Lossl a run out.

The subs were absolutely certifiable. Pickford (not for the first time) and Carlo only have themselves to blame. Why bring Bernard and Kean off? We don't have another game for ages! Idiotic.

1) What the fuck did Delph blast the ball back into 50/50 territory straight from the kickoff instead of trying to maintain possession?

2) Why has Tom Davies still not matured as a player with three years and over 80 games experience under his belt, why does he not realise his limitations and lack of pace will NOT take him past players?

3) What the fuck is Coleman doing standing in no mans land?

4) What the fuck is Pickford doing on BOTH goals? Why is he behind his line on the second?
The guy has major mental issues.

I still can't believe it!

Instead he passed 5 yards to Davies who was already marked and under pressure. Holgate did the sensible thing and cleared it for a throw in and that lead to the corner.

Their player, 6 yards out, unmarked scores. He was in between zones. I'm not sure who to blame for the poor marking but I do know our attempts at zonal marking have been pathetic and need to to stop.

From the restart why did we rush punting the ball forward?

Anyway.. Davies concedes a free kick. He didn't do much wrong but we had no one within 30 yards of the free kick. They had time to pass it a few times and pick out a runner. They should have been closed down and forced to rush it or play it first time.

Blaming Davies for missing a header that was 4ft above his and Holgates head is ridiculous. Digne was not in position. Holgate didn't stay marking his man and Pickford jumping 3ft behind his goal line is just stupid.

Silly free kick, yes, unlucky and totally avoidable yes. Absolutely shocking end result (not for the first time) absolutely.

But I'll look at the positives and I'm happy for both our forwards who scored and played well.

Ancelotti needs to learn quickly about players, tactics, marking and hopefully give a few more youngster a chance to impress before the season is out.

I get we all have different perspectives and opinions but once again IMO a young player is unfairly blamed for conceding 2 goals after giving away one free kick on the half way line. Go figure?

A week in the Scottish highlands in their undies (to toughen them up) would be far more suitable imo.

Tom Davies ? There may come a time when being ever so gently critical of the lad doesn't bring down the wrath of the “local lad protection league” but somehow I doubt it. We've given him a juicy new contract with no doubt wages the best Championship clubs can't match and he's unlikely to attract many offers from prem clubs. He's desperately slow, careless, lacks discipline and loses concentration very easily. But he's local,and he did score that goal against Man City. Sigh, it's so bloody Everton. We need funds this window and even after a season where I think this decent lad has been badly found out, maybe just maybe a struggling side below us could be tempted to take him for £12m ? Cue howls of anguish but for pity's sake surely he's not going to change enough or train on. and on again to survive Carlo's revamp ?

As for the rest, starting to really worry about Pickford. He has too many blips now. Couple of very good saves v West Ham but tonight conspired with Tom and couple of others to really cost us the three points. And yes I get it that we also missed a few really good chances to double the lead. It's just a thought but I'm not sure he will go to Euro's as no1 ?

Head keeps moving left to right as I still cannot honestly believe even we let this happen.

Everton Football Club goes to great lengths to embarrass its fans each time it sets foot on the pitch whilst we share a city with a team clean sweeping Europe with a machine like great team.

This season will be well and truly summed up for me watching the Redshite lift the Premier League title at Goodison at the end of March, it's a certainty.

No answer came the stern reply!

This was down to the players. Unprofessional! I suppose they will be off for a week in the sun now? Thanks lads!

Yes he hit a purple patch when he tripped a few into the net and a few went in off his arse but he's an absolutely terrible footballer simple as that, and it just makes us as fans look pathetic worshipping donkeys like this, fans at Spurs, Liverpool, Leicester even wouldn't tolerate bollox like we do.

I am absolutely seething about that tonight, I thought I'd seen it all with this club but that tonight?

That's just takes the absolute piss!

2-0 up with 60 seconds left.

From 8th to 12th in 60 seconds at home to a Newcastle team that didn't look like scoring if they'd played all week.

Nil Satis Nisi Fuckin Optimum

My fuckin arse!!

Right, had enough of this. On one hand you buddy up with a lot of our Merseyside based fans and seem like you wouldn't hurt a fly and then after a defeat you get spiteful. You have previous for this but for whatever reason don't get curtailed by Lyndon or Michael.

To call Tom Davies a moron with a low IQ is just contemptible.

Context is required here. Yes he made a mistake but Digne didn't exactly cover himself in glory.

Then let's get onto Ancelotti's original line up and subsequent subs. Can we also wonder why we weren't more goals up against a pathetic Newcastle side?

But let's not look at the experienced veterans in the midfield who didn't put them to the sword because they have no real attacking threat or the clumsy striker that was sent on. Let's just abuse the young lad who cares more for the club than anyone else on the pitch.

The way the career of Tom Davies is being managed by Everton is shocking. He gets dropped for months, then shoved in when we have injuries or are struggling and then is expected to perform well immediately in a run of crucial games with a variety of midfield partners.

He usually gets dropped as one coach after another persists with clowns like Schneiderlin and so it continues.

Tom has the habit of giving the ball away because he tries to be brave. Yes, he makes mistakes.

But we should have been either 3 or 4 up against an abject Newcastle side or the players a decade older than him like Schneiderlin and Delph able to step in and slow the game down.

For someone who features on just about every thread and claims they played the game, you don't half come across as some RS fan from Cornwall who has never kicked a ball.

jim@201 - stoicism as someone earlier said

'the endurance of pain or hardship without the display of feelings and without complaint'

tis a cross to bear

This hasn't happened overnight it has been at least a decade in the making, if not longer. Dropping points to far less-talented teams home or away has become the norm not the exception.

Duncan Ferguson must have the inside track on how this current crop will react to certain challenges and he must have his own ideas on how to avoid calamaties like we witnessed in the final two minutes of tonight's game, but will Carlo listen to him? Does Carlo seek his advice before or during a match? Did Carlo do his homework on the players he has at his disposal? Does Duncan offer his opinions and ideas to his boss?

Twice in the last two home matches, questionable decisions have been made which could have cost us points, the Brighton game we just about got away with it, tonight we didn't - citing Instanbul is hardly a good point to make to those of us who reside on Merseyside and once again a 'world' name in football seems to underestimate the strength of feeling of most local fans when it comes to our nearest and not so dearest rivals.

I'd much prefer that Carlo had said he had made a mistake with his subs or his tactics rather than say 'these things happen!'. We all know that to be the case but when they happen to our team, game upon game, month upon month, season upon season, we need more than a shrug of the shoulders to placate us. We want all the staff at Goodison to root out the reasons, why it happens so often, to our team. We want all of the playing staff to address the issues and find the solutions to prevent it from happening again.

This season is not yet over and due to tonight's silliness we aren't safe from the dreaded drop. Tonight, we should have been looking at those teams above us as we closed the gap on them, instead we are left to worry about the remainder of the campaign and how this current crop can manage to make a bad season even worse.

Get it fixed Carlo, there's no time to lose.

(1) The substitutions were a disaster.
(2)The present team do not know the basics of finishing off a game
(3)For the last goal Pickford was standing two feet behind the line. If he catches the ball it will be a goal.
(4)Pickford is a great stopper who cannot command his area on corners and free kicks
(5)We have too many players who just do not "THINK". I will not name them,but we all know who they are.
(6)I don't think that Ancelotti is an arrogant man. I think he will learn from this game.
(7)I will also learn from this game. As a Super Senior I continue to realise that you have to be strong,loyal and DAFT to be an Evertonian but I cannot change.

I beg to differ.

I've never previously had a go at Davies but it's becoming more and more apparent he's never going to be a top Premier player. He makes himself available and likes to move forward but this is far outweighed by his inability to go past a man, often resulting in him losing the ball and then committing needless fouls. This cost us 2 points tonight and ultimately cost us both the goals and all 3 points against Brighton away.

Ancelotti must take most of the blame by making some strange substitutions. Two of the players he introduced were instrumental in the 2 goals. The first goal resulted from Niasse losing possession in the centre and then not trying to retrieve the situation. Davies' errors for the second have been well documented on previous posts but, as the defender, Digne must take some responsibility, too. At that stage of the game you either belt it up the line or aim for row Z. Not too difficult to understand, even for some of our dim players

To me the obvious substitutions would have been to replace a
tiring Bernard with Gordon after about 70 mins and maybe bring on Keane near the end. I could understand bringing Coleman on at right back because Sidibe was having another nightmare. Ancelotti's substitutions disrupted the pattern of the side and we lost all momentum

Like at West Ham, most of Newcastle's attacks started with us passing the ball to them and we still persisted in pfaffing about across the back. Although Ancelotti picked up on this after Saturday's game it was happening again, tonight. Why do some of our players find it so difficult to make a 5 yard pass?

MoM, for me was Holgate. Also credit to Schneiderlin who had a half decent game as did Walcott. Digne was again poor and his corners are usually dreadful. Does he practice hitting the first defender? I'm also starting to doubt if Mina will ever get a header on target!

And you want Mike Gaynes "curtailed" by the moderators?!

Blaming his substitutions is absurd, who else could have come on and shored things up? The whole squad needs getting shot. There's not one player with a winning mentality in the whole squad!

I think it's naive to blame the manager,

How about throw away a two goal lead and suddenly it's schoolboy stuff and utter shit show from the manager.

Sorry, the players let that slip. Individual mistakes added to a collective loss of concentration.
I mean, it's not as if this same grail of players have been cocking up defensive corners or giving needless free kicks in attacking areas away all season is it?

2 nil up, cruising, shore up and see out. The fact that Davies can't retain possession should be a blotch on him not his manager! We all know how shit Niasse is. But can we expect him to track? Basic expectation

Pickford - I backed him a lot after the mistake at Anfield last season. But now I realise he is the most overrated goalkeeper I have seen. So immature it's unbelievable. How is he 3 yards behind the goal line? Lads a joke. Get rid.

Coleman - Finished!!!! He was finished 3 years ago. But typical Everton pro long a servant when their legs have gone. Same as Howard, Distin, Hibbert and Osman. Great servants but kept them too long after they were finished now Coleman is in that category. Get rid.

Mina - A six foot five centre back who cannot header a ball properly and cannot pass a ball. 30 million down the drain. Yet somehow been a slight positive this season. Shows the mess right now.

Digne - Not the player he was last season. Can not take a corner without beating the first man. Looks nervous going forward. A player who needs a kick up his arse.

Delph - Hopeless!!! Absolutely hopeless. Got this lad in because he is a leader apparently. Bollocks!!! Only thing I've seen him do is argue with fans. Another on for the final big pay. Get rid.

Schneiderlin - How many more chances does this this lad need? He is crap, spineless and a poor professional. What does he offer? Seriously what does he offer? Happily pay for his travel for his next club. Please Fuck off.

Davies - Shit!!! Not good enough in any shape or form. Typical championship player at best. Feel like some fans still live of the goal he scored against City 3 years ago. Not good enough. Get rid.

Walcott - Did not see the hype when he was at Arsenal. Was disappointed when we signed him alone but for 20 million fucking pounds!!!! Waste of time, waste of wages and a average player if that. Another one for the finalb big pay cheque. Get rid.

Niasse - Possibly if not the worst striker or player I have ever seen put on a Everton shirt. Like watching him play is like someone picked him out the stands and said go on. Clueless, wank and awful footballer. Considering the two teams he's been on loan at in England have both gone down shows not a good reading. Just terminate his contract alongside Martina. Awful awful player. Never mind get rid, more like fuck off.

However all other players too are not the greatest either. Just a few examples. Don't get me started on Sigurdsson or Keane. This club is genuienly laughable. As much as I despise them. No wonder the RS laugh at us. If I did not support them. I'd laugh at Everton. Ancelotti is hands down in for the hardest job of his career to date.

If we get European football this season. Then it's shows just how laughable and shite this league is. This league is like the SPL. Especially this season. Same mistakes, same excuses and same old Everton. Always bottling it when there is a opportunity to move upwards. Nil Satis Nisi Optimum means nothing no more.

Answers on a postcard please.

Moving on, when he began his career four years ago Tom Davies was integrated into the England squad as a potentially "bright young thing". He's never been picked since though, unlike Winks, Mount, Hudson-Adoi and others of his age.

To me, and I regret to say it, he's displaying all the career characteristics of his uncle Alan, a bright start quickly fading into mundanity but, mercifully for Everton, somewhere else in Whittle's case.

But at least at FF Davies can mercifully turn to Unsy and Dunc, and Ebbrell and Jeffers, and now Sharpy of course, to try to grasp what it takes to achieve excellence as a footballer.

Sigh!

I'm still in a state of shock. I had to go back to work with 86 minutes gone. I can't believe it. Well we've now got 2 games (Watford/Palace) in the next 32 days.

Be serious. Why are lots of "fans" on here slagging off our local lads and claiming they have great knowledge of the game and our club when they haven't played or known the game or seen it at British grounds?

It's a bit weird. If Dave or Tony Abrahams say stuff, I listen, or my Auntie and cousin. I listen.

Or Steve Ferns or yourself.

Why have you overlooked the remarks made by the plastic fan?

He said Tom Davies had an IQ score which is classed as retarded. That is indefensible.

Robbed at Brighton by VAR
Lose Gomez for the season
Gbamin out for most of the season
Concede 5 goals away at Anfield
Knocked out of the FA Cup by kids
Lose on penalties in a cup QF
Lose a 2 nil lead In a game we dominated in the 94th & 95th minute
The RS romping away with the league

Please fast forward to August

We were very, very good. There's improvement under Carlo to be sure. Kean scored, as did DCL. We moved the ball wonderfully. Things were much more joined up. We didn't faf around near as much at the back. The team is looking much, much better moving forward under Carlo.

Tom Davies is a good player. I've defended him numerous times and sung his praises previously. I desperately want the kid to succeed. A Floridian has to root for a Surfer Boi amongst a sea of Q-Tip haircuts. But someone has to have a word with him, and he simply must stop giving the ball away at crucial moments in games, in terrible spots on the field, and use better judgement. For me, his bar needs to be raised precisely now at this very moment. If he can't learn from this, he simply will never learn. Give the ball away all day trying to pull off those penetrating, offensive (Yank alert!) passes. Stop giving the ball away or committing fouls in our own third, or in crucial parts of the game. He has to change his ways. But I'm still in hold mode with him, and not sell mode. Too much potential, too young. Unless he keeps giving that damn ball away in our own end / not using his head.

This team, full of younger players I might add, is getting better. They just got kicked in the nuts tonight, along with the supporters. More focus, and more play like the first 90 minutes this evening, and we're on our way up.

I keep preaching patience, it's time to practice what I preach. Things aren't as bad as they seem. From a macro perspective, they're actually good and improving.

Tough fucking loss. Really harsh. But I still think things are improving, and will get better. That won't console anyone tonight I realize, but for me it's worth mentioning.

I know Ancelotti doesnt have much to work with, but you have to ask - and not just because we threw it away...did it really, really, need changing with no game this weekend.

All this shows the league middle places - where we are and will stay - will be decided in direct correlation to the degree of inconsistency shown by each team...all the teams above us are slightly less inconsistent than us.Which is why nobody is putting in a run and galloping up the table.

Not only does Ancelotti need to look at the quality of his Squad, he has to look at the quality of his decisions. This is not the first poor subtitution(s) he's made...but as I said at the top he hasn't got a lot to work with.

A draw snatched from the jaws of Victory - hardly new.

As always with the Country Rd Inconsistants - more questions than answers

You would have though Duncs input should be reasoned with,

After the last game, I am totally baffled at 2 nil up he did not put Gordon on, if the game is tight then fair enough, but e were wave after wave of attack and playing some of our best football of the season, the perfect time to give Gordon another cameo role.

That's out of order as per ToffeeWeb rules of engagement - read them.

Why have you overlooked the remarks made by the plastic fan?

Ouch. That one even hurt me a little bit.

I will give your insults all the consideration they are worth.

*(ponder, ponder, ponder)*

OK, all finished. Thanks again.

I'd agree. We lost to the Geordies tonight but our best manager was a lad from there not a local.

Before everyone gets on my back... YES - AS A CLUB WE ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR GIVING THIS CLOWN A MASSIVE CONTRACT. YES I WOULD PROBABLY HAVE TAKEN THOSE WAGES TOO AND I'D CLASS HIS LEVEL OF TALENT AS BORDERLINE ABOVE MY OWN.

BUT this fucker - it is quite clear he is a piss-taker. He refuses to leave on loan, numerous times so I hear. He wants to be the fucking sponge with no locker, soaking up wages, and these attempts to put him in the shop-window as embarrassing (and thats all I can assume it is, as a manager with the credentials of Ancelotti cannot possibly think he is genuinely good enough to play for EFC).

I would never wish an injury on a player, but I never want to see this fool play for us again. What a fraud. He cannot control a ball, his time on a pitch is akin to the theory of Shakespeare being typed by an infinite amount of any specific animal. Give him enough time on the pitch and something will come off the fuckers arse or chest or he can toe-poke a chance shot and it will fluke in.

DCL gets some shit on here, Niasse is treated like a cult hero by some. DCL is showing he 'could' be a top-flight footballer. Niasse has shown he is a fucking joker taking this club for everything he can, and because he doesn't get a locker (quite rightly) some people cry about him being treated appallingly. He is a shit shit SHIT footballer. He is an embarrassment to my club. He is one of the laughing stocks of English football, and that makes US the same. The fact this fucking baby giraffe of a player continues to get on the hallowed turf of Goodison wearing the Royal Blue is an utter disgrace.

For anyone who doesnt like this post... you either want a player like Oumar Niasse playing for EVERTON FOOTBALL CLUB, OR YOU DO NOT. Do you ever think we will win fuck all again with him in the squad, I would play an Ellis Simms or a Anthony Gordon or Thomas Cannon or Lewis Dobbin ahead of this fucking ice-skating fool.

"Ohhh but he tries hard" - fuck off. Hes fucking shit. Hes a fraud. Hes a clown. "Oh but he smiles". Yeah I would too if I was taking £60,000 plus a week off a club I didn't give any emotional shit about and then didn't even have to put in the graft once or twice a week on the pitch.

Stop making excuses for this clown and make it clear he is not welcome at this club rather than painting him as a victim, and he might fuck off to a league more suiting for him. Sunday League or National League maybe. But not Premier League. And especially not for a club like Everton Football Club.

LETS NOT FORGET...

NIL SATIS NISI OPTIMUM.

It's the same players that have got Martinez, Koeman, Allardyce, and Silva the sack. The same players that lost to a bunch of kids. This all too Everton, snatching a defeat at the jaws of victory.

Coleman, Pickford, Schneiderlein, Delph, Walcott, Niasse are serial losers. The latest episode in the soap opera of shite. Clear the decks, and start again. The experienced pros, are anything but.

I have no issue with a few angry words. Its the stupid comments which some people spout after every disappointment which make major set backs all the more sickening.
For twenty five years, we have had highly paid managers from different parts of Europe.
These managers have had final say on who comes in. Final say on who goes out. Final say on tactics. Final on Selection. Final say on Substitutions. They have brought in coaches from all over Europe too, all duds like themselves and when they have gone British they have brought in footballing Einsteins like Steve Round. Collectively they have drained the club of enough money to build two stadiums on the Mersey and we are STILL shite.

Don Alexander will always offer a sound solution when we have lost.

Don doesnt have it in him to recognise those who have near destroyed this club. So he batters away at the ex players working in the lower echelons of the club for a fraction of the money the shysters have stolen.

Mr Alexander never has and never will know what these ex players do. What part they play. what their roles are. What contribution they make. He just knows he doesnt like them being there because they once played for the club.
It doesnt matter when they played for the club. Twenty/thirty/forty years ago. They will always find their way into an Alexander excuse, when he is apologising for the latest outside Mercenary.

Fifty years ago Alan Whittle scored enough goals to make an enormous contribution to Evertons title success. He never did become the superstar some expected him to be.. . . But quite why he becomes part of the latest Alexander inquest is... Nah Forget it.

Perhaps you should write an article about it Don. Save you coming back to say the same thing after every set back. Show people what you REALLY know.

I'm sure you'll get lots of responses this time

My Sunday league team could've seen that game out at 2-1. The ball needed to be kept and if that wasn't possible, put it down in their corner and press them back.

Really hoping for a Fire sale in the summer. Apart from: Richarlison, Digne, Gomes and DCL, I wouldn't miss any of the rest of them.

We got rid of a much better player when we sold Joe Williams to Wigan last summer for a song.,He did his bit out on loan and was outstanding at the clubs he played for and then we sold him and kept Davies — I just don't understand that logic!

Of course it is upsetting to draw from that position. I can guarantee the players are equally of not more gutted and are embarrassed to boot.

What is positive is the way the way we are playing with much more urgency than under Silva, Bernard is performing much better and Sidibe, whilst positionally is erratic, offensively he offers much more than Coleman since he came back from the nasty leg break.

Continuing improvement in Calvert Lewin is unbelievable, I was one of those criticising him 5 games in and I couldn't see where his goals were coming from. Proving me wrong.

Kean actually looked like a player last night, I would expect Ancelotti speaking Italian will have a big influence on him. It is a real opportunity for Kean and one he looks like he wants to take.

As Ancelotti said to the players after the game, yes, it hurts, but imagine how hurt you'd feel to be 3 nil up in a champions league final and lose, this is nothing.

The improvements are what matters now. Next season set your standards and expectations slightly higher. Mine will be.

I'm still of the view that, despite last night's wreckage, there were real signs of development in our play - crucially in our attacking transitions. It was not passing laterally for the sake of it.

We should still be looking to qualify for Europe. And with a few quality signings, we will have a strong side for next season.

Horrible last night but I think there are serious grounds for optimism.

Everton giveth, Everton take the away.

The first Newcastle goal was inexcusable bad defending as so often from corners and might have been glossed over but for the ridiculous pantomime that immediately followed. For me the blame can be laid squarely at that inane restart from their goal. It was plain as day to see what they were going to do and the restart itself was held up while players were got back behind the half way line - they were champing at the bit - and then Delph (I think, or was it Davies) launches a pointless evidently aimless kick off back towards our goal. Why the fuck we couldn't have played it short and launched the ball down to one of their corners defeats me. As soon as we kicked off I watched with horror as I counted the seconds (literally) down as the team performed a sort of footballing hari-kari in front of my eyes.

However - In the cold light of day I will take comfort from what was a really good performance from what amounted to a ramshackle cobbled together teamand I was thinking "hmmm - maybe we do have some footballers at the club". Now - I am not blaming the guy but if Oumar Niasse had not been on the pitch I guarantee we would have won that, probably 2-0 and today's thread would be a much happier place to be. Absolutely mind boggling to see him appear at the death (again quite literally as it turned out). I really did not worry for the outcome, but wondered why he was brought on (how wrong I was). I understand about wasting a few seconds with the substitutions and so on, but where is it written that one has to employ three substitutes. Sure, players from both sides will be getting tired, but for fucks sake there are another 7 (I discount the GK) who have to keep going. For just 5 minutes or so.

Niasse should have stayed on the bench - he offers nothing when we are in a winning position - and we play out the game with the players on the pitch and we win.

I'm still coming to terms with it but like a sort of earworm, that ridiculous restart from their goal keeps replaying in my mind. What were they thinking of?

A very good performance against a poor side. Pickford misses a routine cross for goal one. Two defenders off the pitch and Pickford behind his line for goal two.

For me 'systems' are always a red herring. I'd like to see an Everton defence with a keeper that has presence, that commands his box, comes for crosses and takes them. You'd see a more 'settled' defence then.

Fair play to Newcastle. They were dogged and they knew that if you launch it into our box, there's a chance Pickford will do something daft. They gambled and won. And then that bunch of indifferent players exploited our mental frailty, as at Anfield.

Tony's right about keepers. They're best judged on what they don't need to do. I'd like a new one, please.

I don't blame the manager. An amateur side should see out a two nil lead in injury time. However, Digne needs to be taken off set pieces immediately. Corners are absolutely woeful. Then that free kick which he put literally about 20 feet over the bar. I don't rate him at all.

And Newcastle - credit where it's due - have won themselves 4 points from about 3 minutes of playing time in two matches. Astonishing.

Look on the bright side - we could be Chelsea. Imagine how their fans felt at the weekend.

25 years of nothing whilst Blackburn Rovers, Portsmouth, Birmingham City, Leicester City, Aston Villa, Swansea City and Wigan Athletic have all won major trophies.

Add to that ridiculous last minute winners in the derby. Losing to kids in the derby. Not having won a derby for a decade. Blowing a two goal lead after 94 minutes.

Everton make the impossible a reality, sadly this is often in a negative way but I think many posts on here are a good example of what is wrong with the club.

Rant, rant, rant, blame, blame, blame..

I don't like my house, should I just shun it and buy another up the road?

Sounds great, only I need to put it up for sale, hopefully a buyer will be interested, I can agree to sell it and hopefully find another I like and can afford to buy before I move.

Reality is we want to do lots of things differently, but they take time, money and other people are involved with their own agenda's. It's not easy, especially when everyone else is is looking to buy and sell too.

In the meantime it helps to support and do the best with what we have. Smile people, we've nothing to play for anyway

What made it worse was they even took a striker off for a defender so it's not as if they even through the kitchen sink at us and got lucky.

https://www.themag.co.uk/2020/01/thank-goodness-for-jordan-pickford-and-small-mercies-short-arms-everton-2-newcastle-2-newcastle-united/

This morning, I'm still furious!

But I have a tad more optimism. It was one of the best 90 minutes we have played this season. We were in total control and created alot of chances against a low block (something we have struggled to do under Silva). We really should have been 3 or 4 goals up when injury time rocked up.

What happened then I'd like to consign to a combination of football freakery and a soft underbelly that is going to take more than a few weeks for Ancelotti to weedle out.

I'm loathe to blame the players too much after what was a great 90 minutes by most of them but for me Pickford is one of my prime concerns. He may be Englands number one and (like almost every keeper in the top leagues) he makes some impressive saves at times but I just think he's a very mediocre keeper. We know that he's not fantastic on crosses and the idea that he's a top class shot stopper is, i'm afraid, just not true. His save % this season is 62% which has him in the bottom 4 keepers in the league. Allison is on 84% while Dean Henderson (the next england keeper?) is on 76%. Pickford's highest percentage at us was 68% in his first season. He does not seem to be improving and I really don't see a top 6 keeper.

As for Everton I think if we keep playing like we did last night then we will win more than we lose. We were missing arguably 4 or 5 players in our strongest XI and yet controlled the match very comfortably for 90 minutes. Kean scored his first which is a great boost to him and we seemed to be creating far more chances than we have most of the season. Plenty of time now to re-gather for Watford who suffered their own collapse and if we can win that and get a few players back then I still think Europe is very gettable.

Kean turned up
Bernard turned up
Walcott looked reasonably dangerous
DCL continued his improvement

I even thought Schneiderlin had a decent game.

Just a ridiculous ending. It's nothing to do with Pickford's arms. It's everything to do with his decision making. Just ridiculous.

The club looks absolutely ridiculous and is a dumping ground for other clubs' trash.
And that doesn't even take into account the various relationships with agents.
What is going on ? This isn't nil Satis, Nisi optimum.

A keeper that can't command the box and punch that ball away well enough for the 1st goal is going to cost Everton about 10 points a season.

A top keeper adds 10 points a season.

That's a 20 point swing.

Think about that Ancelotti.

I would argue Allisson at Liverpool has added 10 points a season at Liverpool.

Everton has become a dumping ground for players that agents can't shift.

Mino Riola and his ilk are good friends with Kenwright.

He wasn't good on the cross but I think it's harsh to blame Pickford for the capitulation.

I also think it's mad to start assigning a specific amount of points a keeper will cost / win you over a season. It's just not that simple.

Did he win us a point against West Ham?

He was warming up when Duncan Ferguson waved him over. As is the way, he had his shorts, socks, boots, and undershirt on, with tracksuit bottoms and top and bib on over them. He rushed over, got mostly changed and then was on the side-lines trying to take a drink and struggling to get his shirt on. He had barely got his shirt on as he ran onto the pitch.

I suppose everyone is different and every situation is different, but surely you need time to just set yourself, concentrate and focus on the task at hand. Of course once you cross the line you should be able to snap into it, and there must be similar situations were a sub has run on, looking ill-prepared, and then scored with their first touch.

It just seemed less than ideal, and perhaps we should have delayed making the substitution until he had his shirt on, focused, and Duncan or Carlo could have a quick word.

Instead, he ran on the pitch, and was immediately sloppy and off the pace. I may be wrong here, I just felt that the way he came on set the tone for how he played.

Oh and by the way, the comments against Mike Gaynes were uncalled for. However Mike, whatever you think about Tom Davies, the fact his he is a very intelligent young man, particularly for a football. Him and Matty Pennington are the only Everton footballers I've ever known to continue their education whilst playing for the club and both got their A' levels (exams taken by 18 year olds that preceed getting into University or College as you call it).

Can't agree, would have to say the opposite.
100% The Manager's fault.
He made the subs. The subs were baffling.
You don't have to make subs!
If your team are playing well (for once, but are ultimately quite fragile and desperately need the confidence boost of a decent performance) then why disrupt their flow when you're only 2-0 up? Even though, I'll admit, the game did have the strong illusion of appearing over.

Still, mistakes are made. And this one was the Manager's mistake. A bit more wisdom was needed there, Carlo. Think twice before changing the team dynamics, willy-nilly. Doesn't seem too smart or wise to me, Ancelotti.
I think he's a chancer, he's just been winging it his entire career.
A Napoli fan I spoke to said he's the worst manager they've ever had, which really shocked them because they thought they were getting an upgrade on Sarri.

The thing that stood out from this brief exchange was ‘baffling substitutions'.
To those who say this was on the players, I say this, no one was injured, no one needed taking off.
If he'd have kept those players on, we'd have scored again and won 3-0.
Maybe at 3-0, with 6 mins or so to go, then make some pointless subs.

Manager's fault - he disrupted the flow of that game for NO REASON. And he'll do it again.

Mike Corcoran, I asked the question about Butland a few times. I've seen nothing of Stoke so have no idea, apart from he supposedly had a good game last night, of how he has been. There was an opportunity to sell Pickford straight after the World Cup to Chelsea. We refused, and it was good at the time to be seen to keep hold of our star man, and look like a team that is going somewhere.

However, if someone was to give us, say 㿔m for Pickford, and we could pick up someone like Butland (or someone else who is decent) for half that and have 㿀m more to spend on a midfielder or centre-back, particularly a leader that we need, then it's a no-brainer for me.

Plus his pathetic attempt when he was on, almost contradicted his alleged education, what was he thinking? It's not as if it was his first appearance for the first team, and he was nervous or not sure. It was basic, see the game out, and don't do anything stupid!

Admittedly he wasn't alone, but that is hardly a mitigating excuse, I have been bombarded with RS mates sending texts and jokes about our pathetic relinquishment of a two goal lead in a minute.

I could reluctantly accept it if we had been outplayed for most of the game and our goals had been flukes, but it was the exact opposite, Newcastle did absolutely nothing until the 95th and 96th minutes.

Admittedly we should have been out of sight, and their two goals would have made little difference apart from denting our Goal Difference. We still lack that killer instinct, and complacently sit back on one and two goal leads!

His education has nothing to do with football. Mike Gaynes said his IQ was 65. It's clearly a lot higher than that. But I knew plenty of very clever people who were brainless on a football field. I also know plenty of clever footballers who are far from it off the football field, our own Wayne Rooney springs to mind.

Derek, don't forget that Calvert-Lewin hit a lovely shot from just outside the box that hit the post and went against the keeper and out for a corner, another day that either creeps inside the post or comes back off the keeper and in. That would have been 3-0 and game over.

John Boon, I agree. Great Post Sam.

I blame Coleman because when he came on the impetus swung just like last week. Forget the fact that we take our best attacking outlet off to manage a left side which was causing no problems and forget that this sub entailed 3 defensive positional switches and had a winger playing up front.

I blame Davies because he was at fault for the goal and is so careless on the ball. Forget the fact that he was brought on by the manager to replace our best technician when we need to manage the game with 7 minutes to go.

I blame Niasse because he's the worst player to play for Everton. Forget the fact that Gordon was on the bench and that the previous subs had meant we were now facing direct balls into our box with 2 mins to go and we had one of biggest players on the bench when they had brought on 2 6ft centre halfs.

I blame Pickford for flapping at the cross. I don't blame the manager as one of the CBs they had brought on was free to challenge the keeper due to us bringing on Niasse and not Keane and Carlos love of zonal marking meant he was first free to challenge and then free to volley it into the net.

I don't blame Carlo I blame Kenwright, Martinez for signing Niasse, any other player I can, Finch Farm, and Everton for being Everton, Walsh, Koeman and the fans.

Actually I've just thought about it I blame no-one. Our mastermind has informed us "I've lost a CL final after leading from 3-0 so it can happen sometimes..there are things in football you can't control. We conceded without any reason..it's just unlucky for this game"

And there you have it despite Carlos 1990 tactics which should have cost us last week and has been a critique at his last few clubs this can all be put down to bad luck.

This happened to us in the Liverpool Pickford derby. As soon as Allison taps the ball to the defender and the ball is hoofed forward, the game is over. Ref's seem to be allowed to continue play as they see fit but with no repercussions as to why more time was added.

When they score they all hurried back, there was hardly a time delay. Yet the ref allows more time which gives Newcastle one more opportunity. In my opinion again, when the defender taps the ball to the other player on the halfway line, the game is over. Madness that the ref's can get away with more time. It's so inconsistent because some ref's will blow bang on time yet some continue to play. Let's allow one last attack here crazy.

I think an overhaul is needed of the system. Official time keepers are needed, they tell the 4th official what added time there is and no matter where the ball is on the pitch, as soon as the time is up the game is over. Simple as. I love late goals but really the advantage was given to Newcastle last night because the ref allowed it.

The positive side is that we were well on top, and could and should easily have won.

The negative side is the usual one of being mentally not quite right. There's no way we should be loosening the grip or relaxing because we're 2-0 up with a few minutes to go against a poor team.

It's that negative, mental fragility, side that really needs to change if we hope to really progress. And it's been a big issue for a long time.

Individual players need to stay focused, but we show a repeat pattern of not being able to do that. The goalkeeper needs to focus, to reduce the chances of stupid mistakes, but at the same time the outfield players need to focus to reduce the number of times the goalkeeper is exposed to such situations.

Pickford is a good goalkeeper, but makes costly mistakes. All the more reason for not exposing him to unnecessary situations where such mistakes are made. Keepers like Pickford are nothing new. There's a whole history of very good keepers who can be too prone to mistakes, but the ones who manage to thrive in successful teams do so because their teammates don't expose them too often.

This difference between mentally strong teams and ones that make too many cock-ups is the difference between being a top team compared with remaining midtable.

Derby shambles
Newcastle away last season
Man City away last season
Man City away this season
Newcastle home

The list goes on and on. He had nothing to save for 94 mins, yet when he was called upon he messed up. He punched a cross and missed the punch and is a yard behind his line for the second save, so so poor. Not good enough. Never has been, never will be.

And I mean the top, top, top drawer.

That is the difference between the mentality that runs through our club and that of the RS. They can be 2 goals down in injury time and still believe they can win the game. We have to be at least 3 goals up in stoppage time before we can all think that the points are in the bag.

It's probably unfair for me to comment having not seen it but I've read a few comments above criticising Pickford. I really think he is overrated and I don't like his attitude. This is the second game against the barcodes that we have thrown away a 2 goal lead because he gets too embroiled in a personal battle against his boyhood club's main rivals. He is too hot headed and plays like a kid in the playground who wants to make glory saves and be involved. He palms the ball back across goal so he can make a double save. I'm sick of seeing it. His distribution was supposed to be his strong attribute but I just see a player who invariably finds touch or an opposition player. Every now and again he finds a team mate and starts an attack but those few moments cloud our judgement. I'd like to see the stats on how many times he relinquishes possession. I'd prefer a keeper who is as reliable in the first minute as he is in the last and is a calming presence at the back.

In some ways, this result might prove to be a blessing. Ancelotti needs to realise the lack of quality in key areas and address it. The likes of Schneiderlin, Mina, Davies, Niasse, Keane, Delph, Iwobi, Walcott are not good enough for what this club expects and will prevent Ancelotti from achieving anything with us that would justify his huge salary. At the very least we need a reliable centre-half, creativity in midfield and a goalscorer. We also need to start recruiting players who are born winners because it is the same old failings that cost us: silly free-kicks in dangerous areas, switching off at set pieces, not being able to close out games etc.

Same old Everton.

Crazy comment.

This guy has managed some of the best teams in the league and let's have it right Newcastle couldn't of got any luckier last night. They brought a defender on who went up front because they had no fit strikers, he then scores an overhead kick and a goal mouth scramble goal, in 94th and 95th minute. Madness.

Yes I think his Niasse sub was a strange one but bringing Coleman on who is a defender and Davies who is a midfielder to see out our victory was tactically correct and if we would of won the game it would of been lauded as the correct decisions. It was a complete fluke but if you want to point the finger at someone, do it at Pickford not Carlo.

Let me ask you who you wanted in instead of Carlo?

Its Everton again though isn't it, supporting this club scambles your brain.
I think we need to get a witch doctor or one of our mystics in to exorcise the evil spirits.
Not that I believe in mumbo jumbo but its worth a try is it not!

As it is I think we will finish in 9th or 10th position, Ancelotti has the players performing well in the short time he's been here.

If Carlo had brought on Gordon instead of Niasse, would we have won 2-0?

The reason we lost this game was down to Pickford not dealing with a cross for the first goal, and then standing behind the line to stop the second goal.

It's nothing to do with the subs.

He has won the Champions League, Ligue 1, Budesliga and Premier League within the 10 years alone. So there must be some weird time continuum shit going on here to explain it all.

Last night was an embarrassing farce all round. Let's move on.

He seemed in upbeat spirits after the match, refused to criticise the players and said we played well.

However, in private behind that closed door I'd like to think he's read the riot act after that collapse.

Then everything collapsed.

The ball is round so things like this can happen but the probability must be extremely unlikely.

We must now move on. We played really well and if we continue like this (except for the last 2 minutes) there will be no problems in the future.
Rome was not built in a day so we must give Carlo time to turn this super tanker on the right course.

Up the Toffees

If Anthony Gordon had come on, he would have put in more effort for sure. Niasse came on and strolled around the pitch. He didn't close any defenders down. Delph had to practically push him out the way to do just that, doing his job for him. Playing even 10 minutes last night, would have meant the world to Gordon. He would have given it everything. He would have chased after defenders and when the ball came to Niasse, he would not have surrendered it so meekly.

The other factor is, Gordon would have given the crowd an extra impetus. There's nothing like a local lad taking his first steps to get the crowd to roar encouragement, no matter who it is or how good he is. And I do mean roar, not polite encouragement.

But yes, Danny ultimately we lost that game, not just because of the subs, but due to errors.

Let's see the season out, hope the above players continue their development, hope one or two (Gordon? Gibson? Branthwaite?) can move up from the U23s; let Carlo have a look at Gomes, Gbamin, Iwobi; shift the weaker parts of the squad; get in a few mega signings.

Onwards and upwards.

And my apology to anybody I might have offended last night. We were all angry about that ending.

Think it was Souness or Redknapp, one of the pundits.

You've seen the u23s more than myself, particularly live, would you trust 19 year old Ellis Simms on the bench now? Or would you go with Walcott?

I was critical of CA following the Brighton game as I felt we escaped with the points despite of, not because of his substitutions. I believe the same of last night, although we didn't get the points we deserved.
Although some players were gassed (M Kean for one. he worked his arse off), we were bossing them prior to the subs and if any strategy was justified, to boss them more and bury a vital 3rd should have been front and center.

There's something that makes absolutely no sense to me still and that's the introduction of Niasse while Gordon remains on the bench. There must be a reason beyond CA's tactics for his use in this and the last game as Brands has been explicit at the AGM that he has no future at the club and I can't imagine CA rates him. If the goal was to get a player on the make a nuisance of himself and badger the Toon's defense, then why not Gordon who was buzzing after his lively last cameo and has a future with the club.
There's more to it with the use of Niasse. Contract related? Shop window if he manages something semi-special? Whatever the remit, let's shelve it. Contributed to dropping 3 points and collective morale.

We've suffered a recent run of managers who seemingly become 'locked in' to their tactics and let's hope this doesn't not become the case with a manger who has proven to be intelligent and flexible throughout his career. I can't help but put last night's dropped points at his doorstep, even after the dust has settled. Onwards.

A contribution roughly every 11 games Slow, can't pass, can't tackle, an absolute liability, strolls through games. He's simply not good enough. Everybody is entitled to an opinion but 107 games in, he's not improved at all and had his chance so it's time to get shut.

Those who think he did should watch that game again.. watch what we does everytime he makes a pass... he stops, doesnt attempt to find space, or anything to accomodate receiving the ball back.. absolutely nothing, nada...In some instances he even hid behind an opposing player to make sure he didnt get it back.

What players do with the ball is only half of the story (especially when 90% of it is cautious, protect my stats, sidewards and backwards 10 yard passes)

The man is a grade A coward and a fraud of a footballer... and he is certainly fooling some of you.

The key is for the players to concentrate and play until the final whistle blows something they failed to do. There was no excuse for what happened last night and it certainly wasn't the fault of the referee and the amount of added time.

And you positing that I only ever have a go at ex-players is a bit silly isn't it? You and I are, with more than a few others, lambasting Kenwright for his endless tomfoolery and worse, you know, the guy who's employed all the managers you lambast and the coaches in my sights.

Morgan has one more season left after this. Let's hope he can be persuaded to take a wage cut to get a new club on the basis that he needs to think about the next 5 years (he's only 30) and not the next 12 months (after the summer).

You're right about it being a minimum time, but as far as I know, a goal being scored or a substitution being made, each adds 30 seconds minimum to the the added time. It's where the added time comes from in the main. So a goal scored in added time would add 30 seconds minimum to the added time.

Everton came unstuck a few years against Chelsea when they scored against Chelsea in added time, Barkley I think. They were deemed to have over celebrated, which resulted in Chelsea, Terry, scoring in the 97th minute of 5minutes of added time.

Exactly what I said to the guy next to me last night, and we've said this before. He'll argue no doubt that he's covering space. There's only one space I'd like to see him in - NASA might be able to help.

Steve, God I wish I had a crystal ball. What I do know is that, although Walcott, in fairness, has some good "moments", every time I see a U23 player step up I get a thrill of anticipation and hope (not just hope for us but for the lad himself). Simms has developed well this season IMHO. Yes he could step up, no he couldn't. God I wish I knew. The thing is he can be tried at the end of a game, when and if we're a few up (because we never lose a lead of a couple of goals right at the end!) and he'd be upfront where any error can't be directly punished.

Can't wait to see Branthwaite in a run of U23 games. This Friday and next Monday all get your arses to the Southport Superdrome to see the U23s.

Our younger generation of Evertonians having to put up with nothing for 25 years.

We the older generation are gut wrenched as well, we have had our fair share of let downs, but also seen some great Everton teams.

I really hope Carlo lands some success for you to enjoy because you deserve a medal spending a life time of nothing at our Club.

So gutted as I am from last night, I still have the memories stored of standing on the Gwladys Street and watching some of the greatest players we had playing in the a Blue Jersey.

So for you younger generation, my heart goes out to you, I really hope we land some Silverwere, not just for every Evertonians but for you guy as well.

Keep the faith.

Still miffed at the injury time. 4 minutes is fine but to allow them one more attack is what haunts me. Seems to actually to us quite a lot when you think about it.

They could have been in 8th. position this morning, not that is really something to gloat about given the mediocrity of the Prem. this season but as usual Everton blow the opportunity anyway.

Who gets the chop from this squad is a big topic for discussion but as I keep mentioning, the team lack a solid leader in the Peter Reid mold. What happened late in yesterday's game was the perfect example of a lack of concentration and discipline when it was really necessary.
Carlo's substitutions where also weird and did't help at all.

These days there can be so much time added on at the end of the game that these professionals must know a game is never over until that final whistle goes.

Remember the RS game last season at Analfield when they blew it in the 96th. minute. and they still haven't learnt from that.

On Simms, I thought first 5 games he looked out of his depth, then he found his feet, then he started scoring regularly, and he seems to grow every single game. For me, he's reached the point where he is too good for that level.

So, now Brands needs to ask himself the question, can I persuade Carlo Ancelotti to give him a go, and he'll need to start by getting involved in first team training. If not, would another 6 months of u23 football actually beneficial or would it be better to get him into League 1? (Note the Championship might be his level, but I'd want him to get games, to score goals and to get some confidence for 6 months, and then see where he's at in the summer, and if still short, then try himself in the Championship).

I think Simms has effectively completed his education, and now he needs to get some first team football.

What I'm worried about, is that Carlo's subs sent a message out to the fans and players that this game was over and we just need to see it out. But there was 25 mins left!

He tried to preserve 2-0 instead of going for 3-0, that's my gripe. It was wide open for a hammering of Newcastle, and a confidence boost for everyone.
I don't think this game is an anomaly, I think it was a poorly managed last 25 mins, that led to certain players, who can be liabilities, making crucial errors.
He changed the backline, Coleman is not what he was, he put Davies on the left, why?

He also tried to close the game out at 1-0 against Brighton. If he doesn't learn from this, and keeps making these negative and disruptive and daft (Niasse) subs, then we'll all start pointing the finger towards him.

We played brilliantly for 70 odd mins, we should have won 4-0. I know ‘these things happen', but let's see how often they happen.
It's just plain complacency. Learn from it!
I'm on board with Carlo for the way we played in most of that game, I just think we're seeing his weak points very early on in his reign here.

Carlo's subs caused the complacency.
From that point on, the players have to take blame too, BUT, they're not a supremely confident side who can see games out professionally. They need to build confidence. Score more goals.
I'm frustrated and angry because we've got a 10 day break now, we could have kept going and scored more and run ourselves into the ground, and left the pitch feeling good.

Ancelotti created the anxiety of trying to ‘see the game out', he didn't have to do that.
The way the players responded to those tactical changes, yes, it was amateur.
This has upset me more than the RS game, only because I was so excited when Kean scored. FFS

That's a great should about Nick Pope. That kid is a ridiculously solid keeper. If there was anyway to swap dollars by offloading Jordan and bringing in "The" Pope, I'd jump at it.

Quality keeper, level head, shot stopper, commands his area, all of it. Not as acrobatic as the keepers that grab headlines, but goodness he's fantastic. I know, I've seen a fair number of Burnley games.

Good shout.

We do need a central midfielder to improve, but the question is, do we really it need it now, or does it make more sense financially to wait and see where we are at in the summer. The reason for waiting is threefold:
1. The recovery of Gomes
2. The recovery of Gbamin
3. That FFP will have relaxed a little to allow us more money to sign better quality and there will be a better selection of midfielders to choose from.

In other words, do we go to Lidl now and spend what's left of our rainy day fund, or do we wait until after payday and go to Waitrose?

Agreed. The other thing is (as with Erickson at Spurs -- allegedly), players near the end of their deal aren't going to bust their ass and risk injury knowing they are out of work in a few months.

Wait. Wait until summer, Carlo sees what he's got, make an astute and impactful signing.

Bring in someone in now, for me, doesn't make sense. We really need to trim more deadwood this summer if possible, and get our financial house in order, while the kids grow into players or real quality.

When your son is young, you attempt to provide every opportunity for them to succeed, and nurture their talents. We've done that with Tom.

Around 13 to 14 years of age, you start hammering home the "responsibility lesson." You need to ween them off of providing for them, so they can begin to take personal responsibility for their actions. Lines like, "I'm not punishing you, you, by your actions, have chosen to be punished." Ya, know, stuff like that. The introduction to manhood as it were. We've done that with Tom the last two years, in a footballing sense. Forgiven his mistakes, knowing he's going to make them, and then suggesting he needs to take responsibility for his actions.

Finally, your son around the age of 16 or so, has the cord cut. It's your life, make your own decisions, I've taught you what to do, now go do it. Own up to your decisions and live with the consequences of your actions, good or bad.

That is where we are at with Tom Davies, for me. The ball is entirely in his court. It's time to cut the cord. You either start making good, intelligent, solid decisions, or you'll need to take responsibility and live with the consequences of your actions.

Good luck Tom, I'll be rootin' for ya.

I see no point investing now. There's every likelihood the "big six" will take the Euro spots albeit via winning cups in the cases of Spurs/Arsenal/Utd. Leicester are out of reach. Sheff Utd and Wolves also look out of reach however bizarre that sounds. So I see little point spending a lot of money when the upside is maybe 5 million more based on finishing say 8th instead of 10th. Also when have we ever had an immediate and lasting impact from a January signing? Donovan was OK but came and went in 2 months. Arteta did well eventually but was on the bench when he first arrived so it wasn't instant gratification. Then we've had the likes of Walcott, Tosun, Beattie. It's not a pretty story.

Still pissed off about us collapsing. I had a feeling they would score the second Digne hesitated to clear the ball after receiving that backpass from Davies. He should have just belted that as far up the pitch as he could get it. So aggrevating!

My issue with Schneid is the same as my issue with Davies, Gomez, Sig. All of them have the odd game where they play well but all of them have more games when they're either anonymous or terrible. As a group they're not consistent enough if we want to be more than a mid table team.

Point being - we've tried shopping at Waitrose (overpaid for average products), and we've been successful in the past shopping at Lidl (bargains for the same, if not better, products).

It's time we were more savvy in general in the transfer market, shop for the Lidl products and only go to Waitrose when we really need to.

We'll see, if he's a ‘total changer'.
A euro to uk adapter? We'll see.
Some of the comments on here slagging off the manager. Disgraceful.
He's on £11m a year and he's doing his best, so leave him alone.

I'm not saying he's perfect or infallible. I am just weary of every manager we have going from "messiah" to "sack him" in about 5 games. There is an element of "it happens" in football. When Moyes was here, we came back and drew 4-4 with Utd. Fergie has won a ton of trophies by then so no one questioned his credentials.

And also Steve at #347, this was Schneiderlin's best performance since the spring of 2017 -- and you are correct that this is as much an indictment as a compliment. Having seen again what he is capable of only increases the frustration that he hasn't been playing like this all along. Where has it been for the past three years?

Jamie #344, some here have mentioned Pickford's save percentage as one of the lowest in the league. So is Pope's. Yes, he commands well in the air, but he gets down to low shots like a tree falling. There's a reason why all the big-club-transfer buzz that surrounded him several years ago has faded away. If the desired new standard for Everton signings is "is he a top 4 player?", the answer on Pope is no.

If we get another Goalie, we'll scrutinise and analyse and find his flaws pretty quickly, and there'll be another more solid, reliable, taller, less daft, mysterious Keeper out there (who we don't watch play 90 mins football ever) who we'll all be pining over like Nick Pope.
It'd be Nick Poop on TW inside 18 months at Everton.

Dave @359, as much as I would have loved to be at game, I'd argue that the vantage point of multiple TV cameras and close-ups offer a much better overall view of the pitch. On the TV, Schneiderlin moved around quite well I thought. No, he doesn't run around with the energy of Gueye or even McCarthy, but he's never been that type of player so I don't expect that from him. In fact, I don't seem him as a box-to-box ball-winning type of player at all, in my eyes he's more of a supporting type holding midfielder. A bit of a quarterback type if you like.

On a different note, I just saw the school children's drawings of the Everton players. Pickford ROFL!!

Confidence runs through a player and a team and they can achieve a lot. If it doesn't then they achieve very little. I think we are getting much better over the last few weeks and will continue to. What happened last night... answers on a postcard please.

I haven't read every post, but certain players are being blamed for last night's defeat as though they were deliberately intent on presenting Newcastle with their goal-scoring efforts. From my seat in the Park End, it was difficult to see exactly what happened, I will have a better take on it after I watch 'Match of the Day' this evening.

I believe that there were a number of reasons that contributed to the defeat and the loss of two points, the mistakes that I have alluded to, plus the substitutions of two of the most influential players, Kean and Bernard, who, with the assistance of Calvert Lewin, led the Newcastle defence a merry dance.

I reach this decision with the benefit of hindsight, although I was surprised at the time, but apparently like Carlo Ancelotti, I did not anticipate the effect the substitutions would have. I feel that some have condensed last night's game into the additional time, ignoring the performance of most of the previous 90 minutes.

I also find it difficult to believe that some supporters with years of experience, do not appreciate that anything can happen in a game of football. That's the 'Nature of the Beast'. Some have expressed anger, embarrassment, and, in some cases, the 'shame' of being an Evertonian. I have long since left the anger phase, and have never been embarrassed or ashamed, in fact approaching the age of 82, I retain my pride in being an Evertonian. My emotion now goes no further than extreme disappointment, we as football supporters have no option but to accept what the 'Football Gods' bestow on us.

433 games 383-goals 60 league goals in one season 37-hat-tricks 2-league-titles 1-fa-cup William Ralph “Dixie” Dean the greatest ever Everton player was born on this day in 1907

Believe it or not even Shearer had no idea whatsoever of that amount of hat-tricks - embarrassingly he thought his own 11 was the most!!!!!!! Aguero now has 12 - LONG, LONG WAY TO GO

You've been around twice as long as me but I've also thankfully passed the anger stage. It is football. Luckily it was a fairly meaningless game. We will get over it just as Munich did when they thought they'd won the European cup and two minutes later were losers.

Steven Fry once said (maybe not original - was it Liverpool's own George Melly?) "I like Sainsbury's - it keeps the riff raff out of Waitrose".

I think we have to have patience and see what CA can do in the market and also with our players - DCL and Schneiderlein show signs of improvement for example.

I agree cashing in on Pickford makes sense while he is England's goalie and getting in someone more stable and reliable. Tom Davies I think doesn't have the physical or mental attributes to play at this level. Shame, really.

He was involved in making basic mistakes for their two goals.

First goal. He made a mistake trying to play out from the back, near his own corner flag. He exchanged passes with Digne but his final pass was on Digne right foot. The basic mistake was if he played it on his left foot the ball would have been played where it should go, up the line. Result: Corner and goal.

Second goal. He tries to take the man on by knocking it past him and out pacing the defender. Defender deals with him easily by out strengthing him and by superior pace.

Defender can only go back to the keeper. Tom jumps on his back, giving the free kick away. When the free kick comes into the box Tom, who you would think would want to rectify his mistake, jumped under the ball. Result: goal.

I reckon it would be good for Tom to have the rest of the season out on loan.

Last night;

Davies gave a ball to Digne who fucked it up Royally and conceded a corner - Lets blame Davies.

Davies first contribution was a surging run which resulted in a free kick outside the box. Once again Digne Royally fucked it up - Lets blame Davies.

Davies gives away a free kick near the half way line. Its central which makes it quite possibly the easiest free kick to defend against. We've got 11 men back who all show zero desire - Lets blame Davies

The ball is in the air so long you could have strolled down from the top balcony and still had time to clear it, but none of the eleven we had plonked in and around our area managed it - Lets blame Davies.

Ancelotti has the team so riddled with uncertainty after reintroducing the cursed Zonal Marking. Every fucker knew where the ball was going to end up before the corner was taken - Lets blame Davies.

Ancelotti had already insulted the intelligence of all present by bring on a the least talented footballer the premiership has ever seen. Predictably he surrenders possession and the initiative by miscontrolling every fucking pass - Lets blame Davies.

Davies's critics claim he is lower league standard who should never wear the Everton shirt again, Ancelotti still put him on - Lets blame Davies

The names and abuse directed at this TWENTY ONE year having to learn his trade surrounded by ridiculously paid, cowardly, non contributing Gobshites makes me deeply ashamed of this club. What a fucking fan base we have

When Holgate tried bucking the trend by refusing to be a light house and insisting on playing football like it should be played. On the deck. These experts murdered him

When DCL had to play left and right and then up front on his own for two years while expensive, guileless, liberty taking, fuckwits stood thirty yards behind him knocking "get-after-that" hoofs into the corners and expecting.
him to do all their graft - These experts murdered him

Now its Toms turn. Sure he sometimes looses the ball, but he is surrounded by cowards whose sole purpose is to protect their passing stats, his determination to be positive and get forward is a breath of fresh air. As the junior in the team, he should be helped by seniors Like Siggy and slidingin, but he isn't They hide from him. . They fucking hide from him. Just as they hide from each other
I look forward to the day when Tom realises his potential. when, like the other two, he can consider himself established,

I would dearly love to see Tom, Mason and DCL stand in the center circle and raise a finger each to these incredibly poor judges. One beautiful poetic "what-the-fuck-do-you-know ?" three fingered Gesture

I have just been informed that a friend of mine, an ex team-mate from our footballing days of 50 years ago. has passed away. A gentleman and fellow Evertonian, he will be greatly missed by all who knew him, it's at times like this that we should remember that football although a part of our lives, is [exactly that] a part of our lives.

You skip very lightly over Davies giving away the free kick -- a silly, pointless foul when he wasn't even challenging for the ball, just a pettish bump, and the only way Newcastle could possibly have gotten the ball down the pitch and earned a clear chance before the clock ran out. And an utterly needless exposure of our longtime weakness defending set pieces. If he just stops in his tracks, the game is over.

And of the "11 men back" who "could have strolled down from the top balcony and still had time to clear it", the closest of all, the one who didn't react immediately because he was busy pointing at people, the one who stumbled back and jumped and missed the ball completely, was Davies.

So yes, this "TWENTY ONE year" old veteran of well over 100 Prem, domestic cup and Europa appearances, considered mature and professional enough to wear the captain's armband on multiple occasions, fully deserves every word of blame he is getting. Not him alone, certainly (Carlo/Picks/Digne), but he's at the top of the list, and nobody else is a close second.

And yes, it's Ancelotti who sent him on, but that's kind of a circular argument -- are you saying Ancelotti made a mistake subbing him in because he's not good enough, or because the situation was wrong for him, or because somebody else should have gone on instead? Are Davies' mistakes Davies' fault, or are they Carlo's responsibility because he put him out there? Either way, both arguments seem to be saying the same thing about Davies: Not Good Enough.

And ever since then I have agonized watching him work so hard and leave everything on the pitch and just... not... get... better. And I've tried so hard not to get frustrated seeing him make the same mistakes again and again. I'd have waved him off a year ago, but he was Tom Davies, the guy who scored "my" goal.

Yesterday was it for me. I just can't bend that far anymore. Maybe John G is right and a loan would salvage the player, but I'm not optimistic that will happen.

I get where you come from about Blues complaining about young talents who cone through academy or we pick up for a pittance. Undoubtedly some truth but I think you over egg it and I think people slag off anybody who they don't think good enough, perhaps many should give more slack to youngsters which as a fan base as a whole I don't think we do. I actually thinks it borne of frustration because we're more desperate for these people to do well than the other players who are simply mercenaries - even Mike Gaynes I can see so annoyed because as he says, he attended a game and he made him cry (presumably Man City game) / its all frustration.

For me, I'm v hard on Pickford / I'm 40 and only remember one great player for us being Big Nev who was and is my idol so I'm always hard on others that follow him! My son's only 10 and plays in goal and in hard on him already! I should lay off Pickford a bit who is young also.

In terms of yesterday, I must admit Davies did my head in a bit / just frustrated at him / I think that's a natural reaction the way the game unfolded. I do agree completely OTT to write him off / 5 or so managers (many without a clue) - but he's only 21 clearly talented, clearly loves the club and I've never seen him hide (unlike a lot of our shower)

As more senior poster mentioned above, only a game and we should all support the younger players in particular more and no doubt our experienced personnel in terms of players and management staff have been letting us down over the years more than our youngsters.

Best wishes to all Blues - hopefully things will get better!

Condolences on the passing of your friend.

" It seems that most on here see themselves as more knowledgeable and tactically aware than one of the most successful managers of all time."

Reading comments on here about various managers always makes me think of Statler and Waldorf in The Muppet Show heckling Kermit. They can heckle but there's a reason he's down there and they're just in the audience.

No one on here has ever managed at the top level and they never will TBH, the reason is, they don't possess the nouse or acumen to do so.

A bit like the majority of pundits on the telly, they point out all the faults of players and managers but have either failed at the job, or don't have the balls to go and take it on.

Rendered those obnoxious fans silent.

"Strong, fit and organised will never go out of fashion"

He's right you know.

He is not fast or strong or athletic and for a player who has played 100+ games, he tends to make bad decisions at important times. Probably not relevant, but he looks sloppy with his socks rolled down.

Perhaps ok as a squad player but not really good enough to start at this level, I think.

You on the other hand have made a complete meal of it. Daft foul ? well yes, but I cant assure you that wasnt the reason we conceded.
Be very certain if he didnt make that challenge the first thing Newcastle would have done when they got it would have been to launch it anyway.

We didnt concede because of a daft foul near the half way line. We conceded because as a collective we have a pathetic inability to defend them. Every alehouse team in Liverpool could do better than that.
Every team commits fouls. and every single defensive players in our squad has committed fouls in a worse position than that. Mina, Digne and Schnieiderlin seem to be making a living out of it..

Instead of lambasting the short guy why are you not screaming at one of the taller guys for not moving their feet and dealing with that ball. It wass in the air that long anyone of them could have done it,

I hope I'm wrong, but I suspect we may not see Tom Davies for a while and all those who groaned when Schneirderlin was named ahead of him will be groaning on a regular basis. Do you think that will solve the problem ?

Its not the fact that TD is local which is making me so pissed at the hysterical outrage. Its the sheer stupidity of it. The embarrassing lack of judgement.

I don't care if people accuse me of being a know all. I'm telling you right now, that we will continue to concede in this way with or without Tom Davies.
We have 80m quids worth of defenders, playing for one of the highest earning managers in the history of the game and yet next time we concede a free kick or a corner, every Evertonian will be watching through his fingers. THAT is the problem.

Instead of hanging the twenty one year old out to dry, why are'nt you berating the experienced pro's for defending every dead ball situation on their heels ? Why are you telling everyone that Yerry Mina is the next greatest thing when every time he defends a free kick, he demonstrates the lateral movement of a fucking lighthouse ?
Why are you screaming that Tom Davies is the moron when when we have a manager persevering with a system which relies on a group of players who defend corners with all the desire and Movement of the the slugs on our patio ?

Tom Davies is twenty one. I dont care who hates that being brought up, .its an inescapable fact. I do know that the fuckwitted managers who have stunted his development, by asking him to play here, there and everywhere, have failed on one score They havent manage to make him Twenty two.

He will never be top, international, class. but basic logic would suggest that anybody who has made over one hundred premier league appearances by the time he is TWENTY ONE has a very good chance of making a living in this league. He is an asset who will be worth millions... Yet we have hoards of fans screaming for the club to get rid after a couple of mistakes.

And TOM DAVIES is the moron ?????

If as a team we want to move to the next level then Tom is not the answer. Neither is Schniederlin or Delph but give me the choice on current form then Tom is not in the top 3 for a centre midfield spot. My opinion has nothing to do with Tom being “one of our own” but on pure ability.

i do not wish ill of him but he frustrates the shit out of me. He showed so much promise but unfortunately he looks to me at the moment that he is not going to fulfil that promise.

I can't imagine anyone goes to the match intending to slag a player off just for the sake of it but I think the common consensus seems to be that Davies is willing but limited.

Will we concede goals when Davies is not in the team, yes we most likely will but that's not a reason to blindly say he wasn't a main factor for why we didn't pick 3 points up on Tuesday night.

'Blaming Davies for missing a header that was 4ft above his and Holgates head is ridiculous. Digne was not in position. Holgate didn't stay marking his man...'

I will add that whilst it was poor defending all round, Holgate may have been more interested in pushing one of the Newcastle players in the back rather than concentrating on marking the guy coming round the back....which probably would have led to a penalty.

The free kick is pivotal. Yes, Newcastle would have launched it anyway but not with ten players able to pick their positions in our box. There was less than a minute on the clock and giving away that free kick there was horrendous game management. As was Delph booting it up the pitch; surely we could have passed it around and back to Pickford to perform the same hoof and soak up another 10-20 seconds. Panic had set in.

As for the header; the only other player who is near it is Holgate who could have done more but Davies looks like he has it and is relatively uncontested; until it goes over him. Either he totally misjudged the flight or he should have communicated that he didn't have it. I've certainly seen worse mistakes go unpunished but it wasn't great.

Everyone makes mistakes and I can handle that. My bigger concern with Davies is I just don't see what he is going to bring to the team. With DCL it was clear to me that you had a fast, strong youngster who won alot of his headers and worked unbelievably hard for the team, his finishing was not great but hopefully that might improve with confidence. With Holgate there was clearly an elegant defender with good pace and great composure on the ball; I was worried about the mistakes and lapses of concentration but the raw materials were there.

With Tom Davies I don't really see the basic attributes to be a top class midfielder. He's not quick or especially strong. His touch and technique are decent but he's no Bernard or Gomes. His tackling is ok and he makes a decent amount of interceptions. His passing is a bit wayward though he is brave and mainly tries to move it forwards, I think he has decent vision. He certainly works hard and shows for the ball.

What sort of player would he be at his best? He's not quite quick or strong enough to be a destroyer, he's no Gueye or Fernandinho. He's not quite creative or skilled enough to be a 10, a De Bruyne or Mata type. He could maybe be a box to box player but again I'm not sure he quite has the athleticism to be a Wijnaldum or Doucore.

I think he certainly has it in him to become a Mark Noble or a James Ward Prowse but would that be good enough to merit a starting place in our midfield if we have genuine top 4/5 aspirations?

Maybe i'm being too harsh (fuelled still by the disappointment from tuesday) but I struggle and have struggled for a while to see what sort of player he is meant to become. Certainly there could be space for him as a squad player and perhaps that's enough' as you say yourself he will never become top class but could still be a useful asset. Tuesday was of course not all his fault though he should learn from his mistakes. As should Ancelotti!

Midfielders come in 2 categories, you have the dynamo who never stops running for 90 minutes and tackles everything that moves aka Gueye and Alan Ball ( bows in homage ).
Or you have the Pierlo type midfielder who isn't blessed with pace but can read the game superbly and can dictate the pace, direction and flow of the game.
Tom is neither of the above unfortunately.

I don't claim Tom Davies to be top draw. I actually say he is neither top or international class.
I would say you have pitched it about right when you put him in the Mark Noble bracket. . That's were we part company. Mark Noble would walk into our team. He may not be top class either, but he is a regular 6-7/10. Our midfielders often struggle to even register that they are on the pitch. They are cowards who hide.

I get that anyone who has a Ferrari and a Porche in his garage would be within his rights to turn down a VW Passat, but we have 5-6 clapped out Vauxhall Astra's in our midfield. Beggars cant be choosers.
Davies does not get into our side because he is a local boy ( an oft used and half witted argument raised by those oblivious to the lack of real alternatives) He gets in because the others are shite.

Tom Davies is quite simply braver than those around him. He will put his bollocks on the line rather than hide. He will look to win rather than settle for a draw. He may make the occasional mistake, but that doesn't set him apart from his Team mates. The disproportionate abuse he takes does that.

You claim you could see signs in DCL and Holgate. I say a blind man could see signs in DCL and Holgate. . but there were an awful lot of people on here who dismissed them every bit as readily as the Dismiss the still twenty one year old.

I may be being a little generous with Davies, but nowhere near as generous as those wanting to hang the Tuesdays lost victory on him are being to the other gutless frankies who have slipped quietly away form the scene of the crime - Again

Everton that!

Still only one defeat in the last nine Prem. games (City) cannot be that bad so just perhaps things are slowly changing for the good and next season's hopes'

Chris #430, I think you're right that he's likely to be shipped out -- doesn't seem like a Carlo kind of player. I believe he does bring energy and intensity, but you and others make a good point that it's generally considered his strongest attribute as a player -- and that's not enough to make him a quality footballer, even a Noble or a Ward-Prowse.

It occurred to me last night -- as I (again) couldn't sleep thinking about those last few minutes -- that I cannot recall a single man-of-the-match performance from him, ever. We always have MOtM debates on the Forum at the final whistle, but Tom's name never comes up.

Genuine question mate.

Who did you consider showed the character of a coward out of the players who played on Tuesday night?

The only saving grace for this season has been seeing Holgate and DCL make complete toby jugs out of those shrewd judges who so savagely hammered them.
I cant wait for Tom Davies to do the same.

These people wouldnt recognise a footballer if he crashed his gold Bentley straight through into their living room, staggered out in a cloud of charlie and made a bee line for their missus.

Six different managers have selected him to play premier league football even though he has only just turned 21... but he's "never going to be a premier league player".

The shrewd judges have spoke Tom. You better retire lad.

The problem though for Davies is that he has not made progress. It's hard to know what his natural position actually is and given that he plays in Midfield the attributes that are expected are seemingly lacking.

Comparing Davies to DCL and Holgate is interesting. DCL has played 100 games for Everton, Holgate around 50. The stats in terms of performances would rank Davies between the two, the difference though is that DCL and Holgate have shown measurable improvement. I don't think that you can say the same for Davies. You might be right, and I might be wrong and Davies may come good. Time will tell and only Ancelotti will really know if Davies has a future at Everton. It would be sound to see a Scouser making it and it would save Everton a lot of money in the long run.

Both DCL and Holgate are older than Davies. like so many sportsman They are making huge strides as moving fro their early to mid twentys. This period is a crucial time in the development of these young men. When they were Toms age they were taking dogs abuse from people who insisted they were Championship at best.

The comments made and the abuse directed at this twenty one year old doesnt surprise me, but I've always known that one day I will walk away from this club and this would be the reason.

Not going anywhere until Tom Davies has shown the world who the real morons are though

Davies might have played 80 games at this level, but he's played all his football in the engine room, asked to do numerous different jobs, and never in a settled side, which must be very unsettling in itself?

!!!!

Darren, you'd cease to be an Everton fan because of comments about the players from people on TW?

Coleman. Mina. Keane. Digne. Shneiderlin, Sigurdsson, Gomes, Delph all earn more money. They are All older and have all given away more goals than Davies.. but hey

You keep battering away at the younger fella...Makes you look soooo Knowledgeable

That Pickfords a cracking goalie too ist he Len . .totally blameless for the Newcastle goals

I think Davies, will prove to have enough stamina, but he's chased and played for a lot of lost causes, during his Everton career so far, and playing the kid in a settled position, in a settled side, might be what both settles him down, and also hopefully brings him on?

Another contradiction maybe, but although Everton have definitely got one of the most loyal fan bases in the country, (it's quite possible, they have the best) they have also got a lot of desperate supporters, supporters who have mostly only known despair, and are absolutely desperate for a bit of success, and when things go wrong, that desperation inside, rears it's angry head, and some little fucker is going to get the blame!

If Delph, would have been “calmer” from the kick-off, this thread would probably have also been much calmer, but it's a team game football, and I'm sure that Ancellotti knows that good teams need leadership, because it's what keeps everyone calm!

Your defense of Davies is admirable.

Would you agree with my assertion that Tom Davies can not continue exercising poor judgment, and needs to be held to a higher standard moving forward? All the while sticking behind the kid, but recognizing he simply has to change that portion of his game that hurts the team?

Genuinely curious. Cheers.

If you're going to make daft statements do some homework.

He's mature for his age and was when a teen. He's courageous; always shows for the ball, fights for everything. He has an attackers instinct; turns up-field with the ball to run or look for a forward pass. As a bonus, a local lad, playing at Goodison for his boyhood Club. So I think it fair to add that young Tom "Gets the Club", has the "Everton DNA". Good stuff all round.

Yet, he's never going to be a first-rate big league player. Those saying so are projecting what they want to happen onto a player who's lacking in critical attributes, particularly for playing in the EPL.

What's glaringly obvious is that young Tom lacks foot quickness, is devoid of pace, and even lacks the quick, 2-3 meter burst to clear some space for himself to do something good with the ball. His passes are slow, his shot soft. He's not going to develop these attributes because they come with the physical gifts.

Gifts that DCL and Holgate possess, which is why they're developing on a upward trajectory and Tom (as dedicated a player as the other two, mind) hasn't developed at all. This is the fourth season with the First Team for all three of them. All three have been right there during the chaos of those seasons. Two improving, one not. Davies.

A good kid, he should continue making a nice living as a pro. But if we want the CL and better, which we all do, we'll need higher quality mid-fielders than Tom Davies.

2014 cannot be included in the last 5 years because it's not in that timeframe since it's 5.5 years.

In the last 5 years

He finished 3rd in a two horse with Real Madrid

Won the bundesliga in a year when Dortmund were still struggling after Klopp so no competition and did so with a diminished points tally. He was then sacked after a poor start to the following campaign. He did not win a cup in Germany, he won the community shield twice.

Took Napoli from a title challenging team to finishing 12 points worse in his first season before their collapse this year. They don't want him back after the mess he left them in, they just don't want Gattuso.

In the last 5 years all 3 teams were on a downward spiral and he was sacked accordingly