A penalty gift turns into a two goal defensive nightmare with O'Brien seeing red

Our game must've been called off due to rain, ah well...

The stage is yours, young man. Credit when due to Moyes.

Hope the crowd get up for it and the lads on the pitch step it up. We have to win games like this to build any sort of momentum.

Moyes has plenty of options on the bench, will we see some earlier changes at 60 minutes to freshen things up? Doubtful but you never know.

Win this and we could realistically chase in 5th if we have a lucky good run, which makes me fear the worst (we often seem to lose when such opportunities arise).

Still, I'm going 3-1 to the Blues with Barry, Ndiaye, and a set piece for us! COYBB!!

Our home record is really poor, 4 wins out 12 so we need to get a flyer and no early gifts. Let's pop our cherries!

Two games in 3 days is too much for Gueye, in my opinion.

I would consider Armstrong a bit too loose as a defensive midfielder.

I don't think the front trio has gelled, they lack understanding and cohesion.

And Mykolenko was also poor.

Four years and they still wait to see where the ball goes... Four fucking years!! Amateurs!!

He should have started.

The team and tactics are just not good enough... bottlers.

Did any think we were going to win tonight? They always score. That means we had to get 3 tonight to win. When was last time we scored 3?

David Moyes is a boring knob.

This bloody Premier League drives you mad, anyone can beat anyone, and nothing can be taken for granted.

Moyes has to take some blame for that shit show.

Tarkowski, Gueye and Mykolenko need releasing in the summer.

Kind of knew when it went to 1-1 how it would end.

Two mistakes, 2 goals, shocking... and O'Brien sent off, with Tarkowski in no man's land.

So we didn't need a striker or full-back in the window? Bullshit.

Woulda, shoulda, coulda - a bit like Fulham against us, we should have been home and dry before they got back into it.

Barry misses a sodding sitter (not even mentioning the one in the first half), to potentially put us 2-0 up and game to bed. Then Mykolenko doesn't even challenge at the back post to let Rayan score and then what the hell were we doing on that free kick? Blame squarely with Pickford for that one as he is completely in no-man's land.

Then O'Brien off due to terrible defending and allowing Bournemouth to break through easily. Game over. Never looked like scoring.

Absolutely fuming. We were so so poor. Not one player tonight looked to have a good game.

Just when we have the opportunity to kick on, we do a textbook Everton move and throw it away. It's the hope that kills you!

Surely we've got to consider Iraola in the summer.

But why does he persist with O'Brien at centre-back? It must be so easy to play against Everton because everyone knows exactly how Moyes will set us up.

Iraola saw his tactics weren't working and was proactive. Moyes is only ever reactive. Didn't some of our Moyes backers tell us how the so-called young, progressive managers were all below us in the table?

Well one of those progressive managers has just rolled us over. Six games without a home win is bloody disgraceful!

These two clowns up front are killing us!!!

Brand new stadium bounce has quickly turned into a soulless experience. The style of the team and the lack of intent doesn't get the crowd off their feet either.

It's different for those who attend away games, as they have experienced some joy. But for the 40-odd thousand who only get to Bramley-Moore Dock, it's becoming an unbearable chore.

Moyes also believes only central defenders can be in defense and that it's preferable to have another defender playing in center-mid.

These issues -- plus his complete ability to improve any striker during his entire career -- are why we are stuck in this boring pattern of plucky wins and woeful defeats.

O'Brien is never a right-back and never will be, Patterson done well when he played there but it's obvious Moyes doesn't fancy him; he's got no option but to play him now.

As for Mykolenko, a very weak limited footballer who looks like he's still making his way in the game. He's a seasoned pro now and should be a lot better than what he is, time for Aznou now but I won't hold my breath.

I'm not going to comment on the 2 strikers other than they are an embarrassment to Everton Football Club.

Good luck to those wanting to "get behind the manager". In all honesty, will it improve our football club, which Moyes is taking to mid-table mediocrity or lower?

That's 5 home defeats. Goodbye Everton.

Why?

Let Mykolenko go and do not even think about giving Coleman another contract.

Sell Dibling or loan out, sell McNeil and Patterson.

Rip it up and start again!

Barry gets sympathy every week. He's garbage. He can't play football.

And he's cost us three points tonight. We have the worst centre-forwards in the Premier League. Forget any fanciful ideas about Europe.

Dewsbury-Hall and Ndyiae have chipped in but there's nothing from the rest of the team, a smattering from the defence and I think Garner in his Everton career averages a goal every 33 games. Just not enough threat in the team.

Also, how the fuck do we concede two headed goals when we have 3 centre-backs on the pitch?!!

Barry should have put the game to bed, but our limitations are constantly being exposed at Bramley-Moore Dock, unfortunately.

You can't play another year with the lack of full-backs and the cross centre forwards we have, you can't expect progress if you do.

It's also time up for Gana I feel now, you can see more and more now the games are catching up with him quicker.

The new stadium, the whole match-going experience for fans must be horrendous now, terrible place to get away from, hard getting in and having to watch endless failures at the brand spanking home, this wasn't what it was supposed to be like.

They have to rebuild every Summer, having sold their best players. And they do, and they are well coached, play better football than us, and are better managed.

They were the better team tonight and we were a mess.
Our forwards… Barry in particular tonight, I'm lost for words. Not alone, however; we were poor all over the pitch…

No wonder it's the same old shit.

Hopefully 8 more points at least away to consolidate mid-table.

He was saying he thought that the Premier League have been a little bit unfair on both Everton and Bournemouth, and felt that, with both teams having a free weekend because they are both out of the FA Cup, that maybe they could have given them an extra day's rest and played the game on Wednesday night instead.

Quite plausible, but when you're watching players running out of steam, then why doesn't he use more substitutions, considering what he has already alluded to when he was complaining???

The home form isn't just down to moving to a new stadium. It's been like that for a number of seasons now.

We'll need to bring in players who can play on the front foot with intensity and pace.

George has replaced Grealish but McNeil won't play for us again after the Palace fuck-up, so we're in effect a player down before the window opened.

Shit show from TFG and the "recruitment team".

He's more comfortable when the opposition are in possession.
A few do it, Dyche included.

In my 60 years, they are the worst I've ever seen, even worse than Bernie Wright.

So fucking disappointing, it's beyond words. What is the fucking point of Everton now?

The mentality whenever there's a chance to kick on and acheive is missing something. Whenever there is expectation, they cannot deliver; I don't know why.

One up at home and in control, but over a season, the absolute lack of a proper centre-forward is going to cost you points. Tonight, 2 up and the game would be over.

Perhaps the lack of ambition to resolve the dire forward situation is related to the failure to deliver when expected as the malaise over mentality runs through the whole club.

I don't know what it is that brings success but we just don't have it.

I don't care if you ban me. It's been happening for years, and the muppets who coach and manage and earn millions still don't see it,.. shocking!! Sad! Disgusting!

I don't care if they perform, every now and then, but half the team has no quality to even stay in the Premier League: Tarkowski, Keane, Patterson, Mykolenko, Gana, Barry, Beto...

I don't understand why they always gave the ball to Ndiaye, they had George on the left, but always turn their heads to Iliman.

I saw it happening a lot of times this season, in the Wolves game at home, they always gave the ball to Grealish and forgot Dibling was on the pitch: same story, different characters, so something doesn't feel right.

I'm going to bed anyway before the return of service is given by the so-called Anti-Moyes brigade after reading so many posts from the Pro-Moyes group after Saturday's victory.

We could have been out of sight but we ended up looking a sorry sight... but at least we aren't looking over our shoulders.

Patterson will now have to start and it's only Man Utd at home under the lights next, could be the making of him...

I would love to know what Rohl has done wrong since a promising first start too! Dibling and Aznou he will just never even try, even though the team is desperately crying out for pace and youthful fearless abandon!

Actually, Seamus will probably make one of his rare starts v Man Utd. Premier League experience you know...

Not a great time to be playing them as they surge into form under Carrick. But we have got to find a way to crack this home game malaise and very fast, pressure (and inability due to stupid selection, no pace and appalling excuses for "strikers") to get results at HDS already getting to the players big time, you can tell.

I understand the importance of winning but the money that people are paying for the complete lack of entertainment must be something that a lot of people must be beginning to question right now, mate?

At home again, they, as usual, stuttered in the first half an a hour and got lucky with the penalty but cannot shut up shop defensively.

However, the bottom line is always the same thing -- poor offense especially finishing.

Everton have not been defending well all season but sometimes they get lucky and one goal gets them out of jail but today they ran out of luck after the red card.

It seems Barry just isn't the answer, and Beto similarly, but Moyes is persisting with what he has and it's not good despite a few lucky results lately.

A perfect chance to get above RS for once and of course they blew it.

Next up: yet another home game against Man Utd and, unless they tame Fernandez, it will be a tough game to get a result from.

He was virtually under the crossbar and managed not to score!

The two chances Barry missed were dreadful. I don't want to see him or that other lump Beto again. We need to put Alcaraz or even Keane up front.

I'm fuming... fuck off, Everton, you have been letting us down for 30 years.

Alcaraz should have been on in place of Barry up front at 60 minutes -- good feet, can shoot and head the fucking ball even Keane, try something different for fuck sake!
Rohl or Iroegbunan in place of Gana, who is clearly looking off it, as is Ndiaye -- Afcon taking it's toll.

Yes, Barry missed again - great defending for his second chance.

Terrible defending from all our "giants" and both Mykolenko and Pickford could have done better with the first goal.
Same shit different day with Moyes -- always reactionary, never proactive.

I bet our manager's message to the players is the same every week: "Don't lose it" -- and I bet Iraola message to his players is: "Go try and win it!"

Are these owners ruthless enough to show Evertonians they care? Have some fucking balls and let Moyes wander off, no matter what position we end up.

Iraola is available right now for free -- we would be the perfect club for him.

My take on your point is he's not even getting that right.

O'Brien at full-back when we have a full-back on the bench, Armstrong on the wing whilst we have 2 wingers on the bench.

Strikers haven't been addressed in the window. The owners are shysters. We have thrown away a great chance to get into Europe.

When the impetus is on us to create and attack, we are lost. Hence why the home form is shite and the away form is good. This season will just drift away and we'll all celebrate an 11th or 12th place finish.

Hooray!

I met my youngest son, who has exorcised his demons to grow to be a lovely young man, and then met some ToffeeWeb legends, and Rob Halligan as well, before the game.

Then a football match broke out and ruined my day.

I can accept that shite if we come away with a last-minute point or win on the road... but the team we have should be winning home games like this without breaking sweat.

This was absolute shite. No excuses.

A great day out -- ruined by a game of football.

Also, I think one of our many midfield players should be playing up front for the remaining games. The chances missed by Barry and Beto this season are costly.

I admire your dedication travelling up so far, especially on a foul night like that. I only live in Huyton and was home for 10:30, so I don't envy your journey home after that shambles, unless you're staying over.

I knew once they equalised, they'd go on and win it, because our so-called senior pros are a gang of cowards. I won't name them but you all know who they are.

We are so awful in possession, it's quite embarrassing. No pace, no cohesion, no fluency... in fact, we actually create very little, maybe 2 or 3 chances a game, especially at home.

Ndiaye and Gueye have looked out of sorts since Afcon finished and have offered next to nothing. Yes, Ndiaye -- who I love, by the way -- has his moments... but he's offered next to nothing.

I know who I'd like to see line up against Man Utd but Stubborn Davie won't change a thing. I'm seriously thinking of giving that game a swerve because I think this ground move has been a curse already, and I'm actually sick of the place, even this early on.

Then you can either play Alcaraz in front of them or keep Dewsbury-Hall in the 10 and play one of Rohl or Armstrong alongside Garner. They proved at Villa they are good enough.

Then keep the faith with Tyrique George on the left and let's hope the 13 days before our next match is enough to revitalise Ndiaye as he is nowhere near the levels he was at when he went to Afcon.

You may as well blood in Armstrong, Rohl or Alcaraz now as the season has gone for us, and get more minutes for George and Dibling to get us ready for next season. We can't rely on Gueye for next season (again!!)

I couldn't tell what the plan was today, other than pass it back to Pickford to belt it forward, for Barry to fail to flick it to no one, because no one's near him.

Bournemouth weren't good, didn't create loads but punished us with only their two decent efforts.

As some have posted, now might be a time where needs mean the right team falls into place through suspensions, and the manager sees Jake O'Brien should not play right-back. I'd play Garner every week first as we have loads of central midfield options.

I thought they couldn't waste another great opportunity to stamp our claims for Europe, but why would we hope? It's Everton after all.

We have 2 strikers who are the worst in the Premier League so it shouldn't surprise us when they miss chances game after game.

A mad 10 minutes turned the game on its head. Do we ever score goals like we conceded tonight?

Their young Brazilian winger looks a player and gave Mykolenko a torrid time.

We have the makings of a half-decent team but then we have some right donkeys alongside them.

I wouldn't bother playing either striker again, I have had enough of both of them.

Play Ndiaye as a Number 10 and pack the midfield.

I have been to most of the home matches this season, and I have yet to see a team worse at passing a football to a colleague than Everton. Short and medium passing is shocking, the opposition seem to manage it no problem, so why can't we?

Also marking, every Everton player has an opposition player breathing down their neck as soon as the ball is passed to them. As usual, Bournemouth players had the freedom of Hill Dickinson Stadium when the ball was played to them.

Despite only having to defend on a few occasions tonight, Captain Hindsight and his merry band of losers managed to royally cock it up. If only he was as good at organizing his defense when a threat emerges, as he is as shouting at all and sundry afterwards. Both goals were a gift-wrapped disgrace.

I can put up with Barry receiving the ball, resembling what happens when someone throws a ball to a newborn giraffe, when he is at least, lethal in front of goal, but not when he misses 3 sitters. We had at least 6 good chances tonight, none converted, another disgrace.

Our much vaunted central defence is really not all that. Both their goals were amateurishly defended.

Our promising attack isn't really all that promising. It's shite. A few goals in La Liga doesn't make a striker the next Lukaku (or even Niasse). Barry is an awful footballer, full stop.

Mykolenko isn't good enough, nor is O'Brien (neither at right-back nor centre-back). Tarkowski is past it and we need to clone Gana Gueye, cos without him we're fucked!

Watching Keane thrown up front at the end was embarrassing. Chasing a goal at the end with the attacking talent we still had on the pitch and they hadn't a clue.

Moyes Out.

Nights like tonight are unbearably bad, but even when we win, it feels like you're having your teeth pulled. I don't think I have smiled during a game since Carlo and we know Moyes well enough to know what will happen even if he's here another 10 years.

No pushing too hard for Europe; no “over-exposing” of young players, substitutes at the death, and in some cases designed to preserve a loss, and consistent dampening of expectations.

I want to be entertained once in a while. Now and again, I would like to see us have more of the ball than our opponents. I would like to see evidence of a Plan B or C and less of an over-reliance on some players because of a fear of trying someone different.

I'd like to go into a derby with a manager with a have-a-go attitude rather than a “Well, they're better than us, let's not try to lose by too many” approach. Moyes is a dinosaur and it shows.

Tbf though, it always feels like we're one short with Jake O'Brien at right-back -- not to mention whichever lump is up top, thus feeling like we're two short..

I think Keane should've played instead of Tarkowski or maybe given Jake and Jarrad a go to see how they would get on.

Tyrique George did okay, he was exciting on the ball and didn't deserve to be taken off.

I said the other day that Gana Gueye looks tired and I don't think he should've come straight back in for Rohl. It seems Moyes just selects his favourites.

It was good to see Mykolenko get a few crosses in but Armstrong just isn't a winger and it was a bad decision to put him out on the left.

I wish people would chill out over Barry, he's a young player who couldn't even speak English at the start of the season. I'm hoping he will come good but agree we should have got a proven striker in. But Beto is the one who should be legged, he's absolutely wank.

I went down for a pint at half-time and it was great to look at the table and see us above the redshite for all of 20 minutes. If Moyes had just picked the right players, we could have been above them for a little bit longer, so I blame Moyes on this one.

If the owners are serious about this club, then they will search worldwide for a half-decent striker. I know people are going to blame Moyes but, let's face it, had we had a decent striker, we would have been 3-up, then, all of a sudden, the pressure is taken off the defense and confidence grows.

It must be hard for our outfield players when they're working their butts off only to see centre-forwards who miss sitters and can't keep the ball.

People will say "tactics" but it wasn't the tactics that lost us the game. It was forwards who missed sitters and two defensive errors that cost us.

Personally I'm actually relieved that O'Brien is facing a ban, as Moyes will surely be now forced to play Patterson at right-back, where he should've justifiably been all along.

Every manager in the Premier League except Moyes knows that playing O'Brien at full back is our weak link, with Mykolenko a similar proposition at left-back. Teams continually target our flanks and we are subsequently punished.

Their teams continually exploit O'Brien's weaknesses. He's been well sussed out. Branthwaite must play left-back for the time being as Mykolenko is a liability. Tarkowski should not be exempt from being benched just because he's club captain.

But for the time being, I'd go with Patterson, Tarkowski, Keane, Branthwaite, as my back four. Garner, Gueye, Dewsbury-Hall and Armstrong across the middle and push Ndiye and George up as my strike force. Good old-fashioned 4-4-2.

Because time has run out for both Beto and Barry now. Only a fool could possibly believe that there is still a footballer in either of those pathetic big galloots!

Moyes Out for me, his tactics are as baffling as apparently Sorensen's were: square pegs, round holes etc.

He needs to take McNeil, Mykolenko, Beto, Barry, Tarkowski and Gana with him. Sorry mark M (84), but Gana has been replaced in my eyes by any of Garner, Rohl or Armstrong, but I agree with all the other parts of your post.

Next game: Patterson, Keane, Branthwaite and Aznou our back 4.
Rohl, Garner, Dewsbury-Hall midfield
Dibling, George and Ndiaye up front.

Never happen in a million years with our manager unfortunately.

Pathetic.

Why does it feel like Roma are the fucking priority here!!! They don't want us getting into Europe, they just want to make money and finish around 10th place with hefty gate receipts and increase in player values.

Us and Roma both occupy league positions near the Europa Conference League places. The Friedkins are making Moyes play Barry and Beto to keep their values up.

Moyes is famous for playing a false 9 when his forward options are shite. He used to play Cahill up top, and Bowen at West Ham etc.

I can't believe that, with how ruthless he is, he wouldn't drop Barry and Beto for a midfielder. I'm sure he's being told to play Barry by the big dogs upstairs.

That being the case (or is it the true case? - because this is Everton after all, appealing to acquisitive owners for decades on account of an evidently somewhat malleable fan-base, to put it mildly, I'm sorry to say, despite me and many other fans recognising the cancer within us for decades) and a self-serving acquiescent manager when it comes to avowing ownership and boardroom credibility.

Just who decided to sign Beto, Barry and Dibling for nigh on £100M? Other clubs of no comparative football history having consistently spent way less for way more?

I have no hope this season of anything more than a corrupt bung from the self-aggrandising Premier League shysters on account of whatever league position we end up in and, infuriatingly, I don't think that, without way more savvy signings, we'll be any different next season.

In the first half hour, both teams pushed the ball around... Bournemouth slightly more confidently, but the only troubling of any keeper in that time was a save by Pickford.

Moyes definitely doesn't get any blame for this as what can you do when your preferred striker misses a couple of sitters? I can't even bring myself to think that he was at least there to miss them.

As for their goals, the first looked like Pickford's ball all night and given how Mykolenko half pulled out and Pickford's lack of his usual reaction, he thought so as well, does anyone know if Pickford actually called for it?

As for the second, the offside rule has to be sorted out. If an attacker deliberately stands in an offside position from a free kick, should it matter if he actually plays the ball if it passes near to him? If not, then it won't be long before all defenders line up on the goal line. And again, there is a case for Pickford claiming this one as well.

Starting to get a bit like your holidays, Bournemouth or Europe?

They should have been rested after Afcon!!!!

We benefited at Brighton when they had a goal disallowed from a set piece -- I didn't know why it was ruled out -- and I thought Bournemouth's second last night should have been ruled out. When a rule is too difficult for pundits and supporters to understand, it needs to change.

Three other observations on another terrible home performance:

1) No-one in their right mind can still think it was a good decision to allow two transfer windows to pass without signing full-backs.

2) We have the worst strikers in the Premier League with Legs Akimbo I and II.

3) As admirers of both, I do not understand how James Tarkowski and Idrissa Gana Gueye continue to be picked based on current form.

There is no curse on Hill Dickinson Stadium, by the way: it is the way Moyes selects his teams and their inferior attitude in comparison with the opposition.

I have always said of Bournemouth, their attitude is spot on with their 'never say die' nature, and they keep going till the final whistle.

Iraola's contract is apparently due for renewal in the summer. Moyes (allegedly) said he was only here for 18 months, coincidentally. I would love to know if TFG are even considering him as a Moyes replacement? I sincerely hope so!

I thought that was a terrible result but not actually a terrible performance overall.

The Man of the Match (deservedly) was one of their defenders.

A for effort but F for finishing led to us not getting anything from one of the few games this season we clearly deserved more from.

Again, the calls for Patterson without any details of exactly what he would have brought to the game that we definitely lacked. Pointing out the results of other games is meaningless; that isn't how things work with ever-changing opponents bringing different challenges with each game.

Small margins just tipped against us today. Barry just concentrating on a solid finish, not anticipating the last millisecond recovery of the defender and countering it by aiming at the inside of right hand side post; a perfect, inviting cross from a full back who had otherwise done practically nothing offensively; an extremely subjective red card for a foul out wide and a long way out.

People saying they just saw the same old negative approach are simply ignoring facts. We had a majority of possession and created enough good quality openings (two things that typically haven't been true this season) to have deservedly won this game.

They had a purple patch of a maximum of 10 minutes in the second half and scored 2 goals. That was a huge set-back but we didn't give up or stop looking to score at any point, even after having a player sent off.

Yes, the bottom line is the result... but that shouldn't be allowed to obliterate all that was positive, any more than an undeserved victory should be rapturously received.

I can't see Iraola coming to Everton to be honest.

Unless TFG can promise to back him with immense money and play a blinder when interviewing him.

There will likely be at least four top jobs available this summer that will look more appealing to him than us. I hate to think the likes of Spurs are but I think the London thing swings it for them.

Many decent managers have been appointed and failed, or sacked before given time to turn things around!

As every year passes, Everton fans are growing more expectant and more demanding -- and that's to be expected, by the way: 32 years without a trophy, millions spent on not getting a good side.

It's as hard a job as any here now.

Decent cross, but Mykolenko loses his man way too easily, and then the 2nd is poor with Pickford in no-man's land. They took their chances; Barry & Ndiaye didn't.

O'Brien looked poor in possession and went for a deserved red. Whether he was right-back or centre-back, he's got to be better in that situation rather just bringing his man down. The lad was still a long way from goal to dribble with the ball, and he could've used his pace in that situation, I'd have thought.

Disappointing result at home once again.

Another opportunity down the swanny.

Of course it was a terrible performance! 2 players worked their socks off for Everton: Ndiaye and Dewsbury-Hall... forget the rest. We were playing at home, for fuck's sake!

Barry is useless. Absolutely no football brain -- like his manager. What'll be Moyes's strategy for the next game?

"I'll shuffle it round a bit so supporters think I'm a real manager. Hmm, yes, I'll start with Beto, then sub him late on and bring on Barry. That should do the trick! Alcaraz? Who's he?"

I actually thought Bournemouth were poor but fair play to them -- they took their chances and kept at it. I really don't see the clamour for Iraola... he's a decent manager, done a good job at Bournemouth, but is he really any better than what we've got?

He got sacked in the Cypriot league too I remember. I'm not a big fan of Moyes but he's doing a steady job and we have definitely improved under him. Although I admit going to home games is painful and definitely not entertaining.

But, hey-ho, at least we are not down the bottom for a change. If we do decide to change managers, I'd rather have Fabregas than Iraola.

The day out, or two if you stay over, is brilliant; it's actually what we live for (or used to in my case) but the football is often shite. I've lost count of the number of times I've been out of away grounds and back on the ale within the hour, but you carry on going because it's a lot more fun on the road (especially if you're on the train) and you meet some wonderful people.

John @69, that makes a lot more sense because we are such a poorly set-up team at Bramley-Moore Dock. One of the major things that stuck with me last night was when we were attacking towards the Bournemouth goal, passing for passing's sake, in a similar position to where Mykolenko sold Harrison short just before O'Brien got sent off, and I heard about 1,000 voices, all shouting out the same word, coming from the south stand.

Football is all about movement, so when you hear a thousand voices shouting “Move!” -- all at the same time (not "Fuckin Move!" -- which is what I was saying to myself under my breath), then I knew it was time to get moving myself, because I didn't want to get stuck in traffic after watching such a mundane performance.

I mentioned yesterday, he shouldn't play Gueye, two games in 3 days. Garner and Dewsbury-Hall at 8 and Armstrong at 10 was the perfect option, but Moyes is too static and rigid and won't give an opportunity to certain players...

Can he not see also how poor Tarkowski has been, and the amount of mistakes he's made this season?

Thoughts...

I thought that Harrison Armstrong looked good when he came on, even though he was out wide and drifting inside.

Early doors, but I saw very little in George to get excited about.

Barry was appalling. My sympathy for "that is what it is" has one or two drops left. That glorious first-half chance was tragic and comical. He didn't even hit it to the right towards the goal but to his left... pitifully, sadly, out of play.

That said, it was so sad to see Barry head in hands and shirt for so long after he was subbed and, on the multiple times the camera was on him, not a single one of the team-mates offered him any sort of consolation.

Beto's 100th game for us. How? Does anyone get a stream of excitement when he comes on to replace Barry? But like Barry, he tries. Bless.

Will Moyes ever dare to play a false 9? Ndiaye could do that. George has played there too. Could it be any less worse if we were to see Garner, Armstrong, Dibling, George, Dewsbury-Hall, Ndiaye?

For fuck's sake, play Patterson at right-back, not just because Jake got a red but he is the better option.

Mykolenko had two good games in a row.

Keane & Branthwaite rather than Tarkowski & Branthwaite?

This game showed again just how negligent that last window was. TFG, for the second window in a row, failed to redress critical issues and left us in a tricky situation. But don't worry, our company megaphone tells us that we will have a bumper dynamite summer and it's all part of a big plan. Boss.

In Saint Daniel the Absent we trust.

Another depressing home performance, no matter what Si (99) said, but good for you for posting that.

ISDTAWT.

He is making the players fit the 4-2-3-1 system he likes.
Most managers go with a system that suits the players; I don't think we have played really well this season using his system... We've been over-ran and out-numbered in midfield on many occasions this season.

Is he too stuck in his ways to adapt the system?

I agree, we are the most pedestrian team in the Premier League.

The lack of options for the man in possession is shocking and has been for some time.

If our centre-forward was anything better than utterly useless, then we win the game easily.

They look dangerous on the break, but so does any team that has a bit of pace.

The first cross in was decent but the performance was more poor play from Everton than a tactical genuis on their side. Certainly how they had such little ball and chances in the 2nd half, which could have seen them squander 2 points gifted.

I was surprised by the subs. Armstrong to the left and an early change by Beto weren't what I expected. But Jimmy Garner played very well in a right-back and centre-midfield mesh. I thought we'd lose something in midfield, but he just worked a double shift.

Absolutely furious over those 2 goals and the red card. Really poor play.

Question marks over full-backs, Gana and centre-forward continue to be raised again. O'Brien banned against the Mancs. Will it be Patterson, Garner or another random at right-back?

Don't get me started on Barry, him and Beto should not play for us again, the pair are useless. Mykolenko and Tarkowski have both been awful for most of the season. Why does Tarkowski keep his place?

I'm sick of this club, but it's a love-hate thing -- I can't stay away.

We love you, Everton, we do. Or do we...???

If Patterson played right-back, he probably doesn't get sent off.

An argument to play centre-backs at full back, but like Morecombe & Wise said, not necessarily in that order.

Whenever the expectation rises, we crumble. Everton all over.

The answer is not only corporate shite and tourists.

The football we play is depressing.

You have been screaming on a weekly basis for Keane (our best defender all all season) to be dropped. Not once have you called for Tarkowski to be ditched.

You and many others got their wish last night.... This is what it looks like - Although I'm still half expecting a couple of posts blaming Keane for the Bournemouth goals.

Now is the time to look to the future. The penny really has to drop at some stage. Even for those who defend Tarkowski religiously.

He has been finished for some time now. He will continue to struggle No matter who he partners.

Both strikers added together don't even make one Stracqualursi. Time for false 9 type shenanigans with one of our 'wingers' going in there.

Patterson is not the answer but he is more of a sticking plaster than Jake O'Brien.

And the wind, mate.

No wonder... like going to see a band you love who turn up pissed, out of tune, and bereft of rhythm.

Keane never got started imo.

Are you saying we would not have conceded the goals last night if Keane was playing?

Ah, Goodison Road and the people!

Remember that Arsenal had a tough first season in their brand new stadium. But we have been fucking abject at home.

I can't imagine the thought of Moyes being here next
season.

"Keane to blame for all the mistakes", you said - Good luck with that accusation today.

"Keane never got started", you said, Yet it is pretty much universally accepted that he has been our best defender this season... pretty much. You always need to make allowances for those who keep exonerating Tarkowski's howlers.

Like I say, you got your wish. Now you know what it looks like.

Surely now Barry has had enough chances and is only used on the bench - at best

No doubt the experts will have an answer but still not sure the difference between O'Brien's disallowed goal against Villa and last night's second?

But 'Surely now Barry has had enough chances and only used on the bench'.

Who replaces him?

I would play Branthwaite and Tarkowski next game without hesitation. I already know what it looks like when Keane plays.

Their second goal was from a free kick well into our half, their centre halves up for the free kick.

How would you have liked to see us defend that free kick if you are not happy with 11 defending the free kick?

However, in the real world, I ain't no Sinatra, but I am nearer to him than Barry is to a footballer. Beto is just as bad.

Sorry, you shouldn't laugh at Barry, but he is comic genius. We were playing a game one Saturday afternoon, and a fresh new player had turned up, with much praise coming from our manager:- "This kid is the dog's, he's brilliant, just what we need" et al.

After 20 minutes, it was very obvious that, whilst he had some ability to run, his football nous was somewhat missing -- incapable of doing it easy, never moved, didn't help out, didn't read it, lost possession everytime, refusal to pass it to our strikers and took players on instead and lost it.

After much cajoling, from a number of the team, me included, to just play simple and easy, he just wouldn't listen. Eventually our striker, who, if you put the ball in front of him, would score, just waited for a break in play and called the ref over.

Ref:- "Yes, player, what's the problem?"
Striker:- "Ref, you wouldn't happen to have a revolver on you, would you?"
Ref:- "What? A revolver? Are you taking the piss, player?"
Striker:-"No, Ref, I'm not, but if you do have one, shoot that twat over there please cause that's the only way anyone is ever gonna remember him from playing footie."
Ref:- [Trying not to piss himself laughing] "Okay, player, let's just get on with the game, shall we?"

Cue laughter amongst both sets of players.

Matey bloke never turned up again, we put a young lad in there who just listened, and he turned into a great player for us. Hard world, isn't it?

Yep, we are shit at home, but new stadiums do that to you. Just thought a bit of a laugh might help, that's all!!

Oh, and get a couple of lads who just stick it in the net... or it's gonna get worse, I promise you. I'm up for a stadium tour on 22 February and to see my bro's slab in the Walkway outside. I'll bring some "Whitchcraft" with me (that's a Sinatra "in" joke) and try to rid "the curse" for all of us!!

Frustrating isn't it? Ah well, it's only footy!

You say you know what it looks like when Keane is playing. Yet you must be the only Evertonian alive who hasn't spotted the one common denominator in all those horrific home defeats we have suffered for the past two seasons.

Of course you'd pick Tarkowski for the next game. He might treat you to the sight of a shot hitting him on the goal line and then shake his fist.... just for you.

And your advice as to how to defend a free kick, from well in to your own half, is...????

We played better with 10 men, some fans said. I thought the reason we did was because Bournemouth for some reason mostly shut up shop and defended their lead when the opposite was the best option. We were fucked and open to concede more goals.

Not going to blame anyone although there were many to blame on and off the field... But — yes there is a big 'but' — there were a few players on the bench that were left there: Rohl and Alcaraz for two who might have done better. They couldn't have done worse, let's be honest.

And there is a young lad who has been on the bench, with no chance of coming on, one Braiden Graham. No guarantees but I doubt he would have missed the chances galore missed consistently by players we all know are going to bleedin' do that — miss them!

Do we play with a plan? News to me if we do. Off-the-cuff football usually meant the team and players knew each other's game off by heart and played smoothly together. This bleedin' lot look like they have been put together by an off-the-cuff tailor with a few fingers missing.

Through all the non-movement and consistently poor passing, both long and short — which have been there for a very long time, I made James Garner my MotM again.

Last bit —- I watched Alcaraz's face when Moyes made his first two subs. It was a picture. I don't think he will be lingering around at Everton when the season ends — I hope you know who isn't allowed to.

Have a nice day Jethrine

I was looking forward to reading on your defensive plan to defend the free kick we chatted about.

What's that? You don't have one?

Never mind. :-)

Performance-wise, Moyes must sort out why we are so bad at home. This has gone on too long where even our victories at home were somewhat fortunate. He has done a great job away from home but enough is enough.

I'm not a "Moyes Out" person; he is our manager for the moment and screaming for him to go is generally the prerogative of those who never wanted him and every bad result gives them their justification.

It is a manager's job to get the best out of the players at his disposal. Moyes has done that last season and away from home this season but has failed miserably at BMD.

I leave it to those who think they know their football to figure that out but here is a summary of my assessment of the team.

Firstly, we have limited players who have no pace or speed of thought with the exception of maybe Garner and Dewsbury-Hall.

Ndiaye is tired and for me was a major reason that cross came in for the first goal which, as pointed out above, should have been Pickford's ball all day long... as with the second.
Good and all as Garner and Dewsbury-Hall are, there is no defence-splitting pass in their locker.

Our forward is woeful.

I did argue against wholesale changes to bring on the younger players because it was too early but, if we lose against Man Utd, then we need to start seeing where are the strengths of Rohl, Dibling, Iroegbunam, George, Aznou and Alcaraz and whether they can be moulded into a faster-paced team.

We were better by far last night, even with 10 men, but Bournemouth were quicker moving the ball and also recognised the same weakness in our defence that others have, namely the ball between our defenders and goalkeeper.

Calls for Iraola to replace Moyes is fantasy football for me. Bournemouth looked way worse than we did but they took their chances; there was no master switch to change the game.

We don't want another Frank where the stepping up to a bigger club is a whole lot different. I don't know who we should look to next but, unless we sort out our home games, we need to think of our next move now so he is up and ready for the Summer.

Just saw the news that Frank has been sacked by Spurs.

Just the usual boring run-in left.

We must not just blame the lack of striking prowess, several headers from defenders went over the bar, we had sixteen goal attempts but if the defense can't deal with crosses yet again, ie, Tottenham, Brentford all over again, then what chance do we have???

I think the 10 men of Everton showed great commitment and heart and deserved something on that alone.

As for the squad's shortcomings, they were well documented and we will see what transpires in the summer.

This was the complete opposite of our last game at Fulham where they had chances to put the game to bed before we scored and we all know what happened. Last night, it was us who should have been out of sight before Bournemouth scored.

Barry is like Bambi on Ice and sadly Beto isn't much better. The reason we didn't win last night was down to Barry and Pickford.

Their first goal a cross to the far post and, not for the first time, Pickford didn't punch or catch it. Had that been Southall, he would have flattened their attacker and cleared the danger.

The second was another error by Pickford, he started to come for the cross and then stopped, leaving himself stranded and left an empty net for their attacker to head into.

I thought Garner and Dewsbury-Hall were our best performers. i also thought Armstrong did well when he came on.

For those suggesting that Rohl and Alcaraz should have come on, it's goal scorers this team lack and neither of those have that in their locker.

Surely we may as well give Braiden Graham from the Under-21s a game... he can't be any worse than Barry or Beto. Just shows how bad our summer signings were -- nobody obviously calling for Dibling to start.

While O'Brien has done a decent job at right-back, that along with a decent striker, has to be our top priority in the summer.

As good a footballer as Ndiaye is, he has to up his goal tally... and that can be said of all of our front 6, apart from Dewsbury-Hall.

TFG, we have a problem. Loads of empty seats again last night.

When the novelty of the new stadium has worn off, the place will be half empty if we continue with this abject rubbish.

Seeing 10 men drop back to our own box to defend what was essentially the first serious Bournemouth attack, was just blind panic, but it was a sign of things to come. The writing, I'm afraid, was on the wall.

Then, when I saw 11 blue shirts drop right back to our own penalty area to mark 6 Bournemouth players for a free kick just inside our half. I feared the worst.

It may have suited Tarkowski, Moyes and apparently some of our fans, but most observers would have seen it as a combination of cowardice and abject stupidity. Talk about too many cooks. Even if we had cleared the ball, it could only have come out to a Bournemouth player and invited more pressure.

Watching our skipper run back facing his own goal after, once again, misjudging the flight of the ball was like watching one of those films that come on the BBC every Chrimbo. We've all seen it so many times.

This was not a corner. It was a free kick from a generally central area. By leaving 2 players higher up the pitch, we would not have seen the confusion caused by an overcrowded penalty area and every Everton player would have known exactly what his job was.

We could also have prevented Bournemouth from attacking with the certain knowledge that we could pose no counter threat.

Clueless. Cowardly and Cringeworthy. We got exactly what we deserved.

Without a doubt it will be half empty, the football is woeful and does not even represent half entertaining.

As for Frank, I'd get him now... Spurs are a toxic club, it can't be the fault of all the managers they've sacked.

He looked like a rabbit in headlights for any game I saw. Responsibility of managing a bigger club.

I can't see what he would bring to us considering he has a better squad and support in transfer market and yet his team has 8 points less than us.

Sounds like an "anybody but Moyes" comment.

There's an outside chance of Europe, so enough to keep everyone honest. But, on the balance of probability, it's over. Add a derby win and I'd chalk this off as a good enough season by recent standards.

I respect your comments and your belief that Tarkowski should be dropped.

But, for me, Ndiaye, Pickford and Mykolenko were also culpable for the first goal.

Speak to any Spurs fan and they'll tell you the same, the culture at the club is poisonous with certain players refusing to play the system the manager sets out.

I can't remember the name of the player who was sent off for them at the weekend (Pedro?) but apparently he's running the dressing room (I've been told).

He put one on the Man Utd player and walked straight down the tunnel, did you see Frank's face? It was a look of resignation, he knew his days were numbered.

Moyes has been with us long enough to know what we're getting and if that's good enough for you then all power to you. It's not good enough for me.

I liked Frank before he went to Spurs and he is a great upcoming coach. Spurs are a basket case. They could make Pep look like Mike Walker.

Ndiaye was very poor.
Gueye worked hard but offered very little.
Pickford's distribution awful and even if it hit the player nonsensical as no one could do anything with it.
Tarkowski is a shambles -- he is getting worse by the game.
O'Brien was only beaten in the shit race by Barry
Barry was truly abject.

Moyes - cowardly. Playing O'Brien and Tarkowski is a profound problem. And I have defended Moyes on these pages.

And to round the night off, how is it that, when designing and building a new stadium, we can't get a bloody roof to keep the rain off? I sit on Row 14, not right at the pitch side, and got soaked. Poor around.

Here's hoping that O'Brien's ban forces a change. Small mercies.

I would take Frank in a heartbeat.

I sit in Row 56, and could swear I got wet last night.

Surely not?

I think for most of the game we were the better side but, when you make fundamental mistakes, like Pickford did, and with our non strikers, we were playing with 10 men anyway. When we did go down to 10, we still dominated possession and still created some opportunities.

I have said for months Tarkowski is a liability and, the sooner he is gone, the better we will be. I thought young George did well considering he hadn't played a competitive game since December before his cameo at Fulham.

Harrison Armstrong looks the real deal. This kid will end up an England regular, he has everything. The more he plays, the better he will get. So last night was an awful result but overall we were by far the better side.

The fact is, we've had years of fighting relegation, years of having to sack managers, and years of instability. We're having a dip that typically comes when a club moves stadiums, but we're not far off European qualification because Moyes has vastly improved our away form.

We've got a patched-up squad that was assembled by half-a-dozen different managers. Moyes has had one full transfer window to address the problems under PSR pressures. These problems need longer to fix.

Lastly, the reason why Frank lost the dressing room was because his methods were questionable, his man management was failing, and team set-up and selection was at odds with the players available to him.

Based on Iraola's time at Larnaca, where he didn't win a game in his 2 months, presumably you wouldn't touch him with a barge pole?

You can't just rule Frank out because of how he got on at Spurs. Seriously, the situation at Spurs is as mad as a box of frogs.

Another satisfied customer?

We've had three transfer windows under TFG. We all pretty much know where the issues with the squad are but these haven't been addressed.

Grealish on loan worked until his unfortunate injury and Dewsbury-Hall has been a success but the rest of the deals have been poor. Whoever scouted Barry must have been off their heads and it makes you think: Did they actually see him play in the flesh???

I don't think Dibling or Rohl were Moyes signings as he rarely picks them. Hopefully George works out as he has the pace we've been desperate for.

If we don't get the fullbacks, at least one striker, and a big imposing pacy midfielder through the middle this summer, then things will continue as is.

It's small margins, we made more chances than they created, they put the ball in net when they had a chance; we didn't.

We should know by now that we are nothing special, we just don't score enough goals -- that's why we are never a good thing to beat anyone, even Wolves.

When we get two good full-backs, another one or two top class midfielders, and a couple of top-class strikers, then we can start getting optimistic. To be a top team, you need top players.

I'm more for than against Moyes, but if we do change the manager I would opt for the Brighton manager Hurzeler.

Now that sounds strangely familiar. It reminds me of someone I know but I can't quite remember who it is...

For as long as I've been watching sport, I've noticed a range of views on exactly the same games, with emotion often seeming to affect what people see.

I've not claimed things couldn't be better, and I'm certainly not a Moyes advocate, but I still reckon I've seen worse performances this season that didn't generate as much approbation because we actually got something from the game.

I actually think a lot of Evertonians are still ‘sensitive' about games against Bournemouth due to the "3 points lost in 10 minutes debacle last season.

Human beings are great at conjuring up patterns that don't exist, it's where superstition comes from, and it seems the ‘Curse of BMD' is already a ‘reality' for many of our match-goers.

Do you suppose that the players will automatically be immune to the negative muttering and shrieks of anguish arising from the jittery nerves so obvious in the spectators? That can be like a debilitating disease all by itself and I don't see the point in actively ramping up the negativity.

I didn't see any player not trying in that game. I saw a few momentary lapses but no-one being awful throughout. For instance, I actually thought Gana Gueye showed two games in such a short time aren't automatically out of his capability yet, which I had very much feared.

I would like to see much more of Alcaraz, especially when we have to chase a game.

Barry is literally hit and miss; that hasn't changed much at all unfortunately. I don't know if he just doesn't have it in him or whether nerves or the weight of expectation are seriously affecting his co-ordination.

I thought the first of his chances was a little trickier due to the pace, height and angle it came at him, but some goal poachers would have taken it in their stride. The second one he ideally needs to anticipate a potential block from his blindside automatically and place it where no lunge could have gotten to it, but it was still brilliant defensive play.

It was largely for his defensive work their centre-back got his MotM award, but it did also take into account his exceptional contribution to their second goal. Their players came across as mainly relieved in the after-match interviews rather than smug in their supposed overwhelming superiority.

Sometimes we win or lose because we deserve it, other times the opposites happen. I believe I've often seen supporters over-celebrating dodgy victories, or too depressed by marginal losses (it may feel worse to lose a close game because hope is dashed rather than not having really featured).

I'm wary of the ‘twin imposters'. I try to judge things in the grand scheme of things rather than hyper-focussing and making assumptions... like players should automatically feel advantaged simply because they are playing at home.

Maresca, Marco Silva, Franks, Iraola, Glasner, Tuchel, Ancelotti, Deschamps, Low, Pochettino, Xabi Alonso, Edin Turzic, Zinedine Zidane, De Zerbi; perhaps also Eddie Howe.

Stick or twist?

Rinus Michels you ain't.

The question is: Would any of them want the job?

At £100k per week, the current manager's wages, there would be a long queue, mate.

Please read my post properly before you make a statement that “if that's good enough for you, more power to you, but it's not good enough for me.”

Here is what I said:

“Calls for Iraola to replace Moyes is fantasy football for me. Bournemouth looked way worse than we did but they took their chances, there was no master switch to change the game. We don't want another Frank where the stepping up to a bigger club is a whole lot different.

"I don't know who we should look to next but, unless we sort out our home games, we need to think of our next move now so he is up and ready for the Summer.”

Moyes needs to sort out why we are getting results away but not at home. If he can't, then it is time to replace him.

If we are talking about up-and-coming managers, why not Keith Andrews (the only one who has more points than us) -- isn't he doing better than Frank even after losing key players in the summer?

I can imagine the reaction to that proposal.

His demeanour suggested a small tyrant at Brighton.

Amorim, Rodgers, Potter -- to name but a few.

You ask who would replace Barry. Well, to be honest, at this time, I would suggest, anyone!

As I mentioned @128 he has had numerous chances and to all intents and purposes, in my opinion, improved not a jot! A complete waste of space. Bringing his mate Beto on appears to make no difference.

Play Keane up front, play one of the young Under-21s up front, play anyone! Could they be any worse than Barry or Beto?

I appreciate they may not be getting the service from other players; however, look at the chances they miss, look at their hold-up play, their first touches, bringing others in to play.

Barry may well come good in the future but at present he's doing nothing for us and for himself, he is just losing confidence.

With our defence losing concentration and being made to pay for it, we need someone to put it in the net. Barry and Beto are, at this time, not the answer.

Why do all the big clubs buy as many top players as they can afford? Until we can do the same, we will continue to be making up the numbers.

He bombed at Spurs and he was also holding back Brentford as it transpires!! Brentford have been better since he left!!!

That said, and we can name all the managers we would like, none will deliver unless we put a good recruitment team in place, and we back the manager financially. Otherwise, it's more of the same.

Iraola isn't doing the recruiting, he was forced to sell Semenyo and his recruitment team identify Rayan,19, at less than half the price. He'll be sold in a season or two at a huge profit.

I'm not advocating the buy-sell model, last thing I want; I just want a management team that can identify proper footballers with the right attitude and a manager that can blend them into a football-playing team.

I can blame Moyes for square pegs round holes, for tactical set-up, for poor substitutions... but I can't blame him for what he's given to work with, until we can identify and add quality then we're mid-table at best.

There are huge frustrations in our fan base, also plenty of allowance given for where we've been in recent years, new owners rebuilding etc, but I would suggest the period of grace ends this Summer if the recruitment is not substantially better.

Of course, I am sure some might try to say that “there is no way any of them would come to us.” I think that our new owners, a new stadium, financial backing for transfers and our amazing fans would prove attractive to a number of them.

The list of potential managerial talent should excite you, unless you think what we have is the best we can expect (and we should be grateful for it)?

Defensive players, paid staggering amounts of money to concentrate, simply couldn't. At 60 minutes, we were ahead and cruising; but only when the wheels later come off, does it suddenly become the manager's responsibility.

Read my post @141. No, I'm not happy with what we have. We have very few pacy quality players, most of our play is pedestrian because they either don't see a pass or there is no movement in front of them.

We have made progress in the last year but I also would have thought Moyes's tenure would end in the Summer unless he did achieve European football qualification. That will only happen now if he sorts out the home performances. If not, he must go.

My comment relates to the long list of Who's Who of Football Managers and the decision on who it should be -- which should be very carefully thought through.

As I said, in a few posts, many of the so-called dream managers often mentioned here in the past: Frank, Postecogleul, Potter before Moyes took over, all found that managing bigger clubs was a much more onerous task.

What makes us think that appointing Iraola, Glasner or any other flavour of the month will solve everything? Just look down the road at Man Utd, which is a similar graveyard for up-and-coming managers. Even there, Ferguson was there a few years before he won anything and was nearly out the door. What a mistake that would have been for them.

It's easy to speculate on line-ups, managers etc but, in the end of the day, it's a results business and where we end up at the end of the season will be how everybody will be judged. Faith is a different matter and some of that was lost last night.

But then that's what good management is -- trying something different, I suppose.

I am sticking to the facts. You have been coming on here with monotonous regularity calling for Tarkowski and O'Brien to be paired in the centre.

Not once did you call for Tarkowski to be dropped. It was always Keane you left out. That's fair enough if it's your opinion, but at least have the courage of your convictions.

It's a little bit rich that you come on criticising Moyes for not noticing "How poor he (Tarkowski) has been, or the amount of mistakes he has made this season" -- especially when you yourself have repeatedly advocated that he plays.

I really don't like to hear people defend Moyes at every turn, but to damn him if he does and damn him if he doesn't makes a total mockery of the whole debating process.

BTW; Me saying Keane has been our best defender this season isn't an "exaggeration" -- it's a considered opinion. One which I know may not be shared by others, but I would love somebody to cheer me up by telling me which one out of Curly, Larry and Mo has had a better season???

It's the player's fault, though... Then and now.

Yes, Barry was woeful (he is), but I also think Pickford was poor (for both goals). As usual, he was immobile for anything resembling a cross.

He gets the plaudits for shot stopping but still costs us with crosses (we all remember Spurs at BMD).

There were more than enough chances to put the game to bed and defend properly. If they can't, then they can forget ever winning trophies or being competitive in Europe.

Those who failed last night are usually the same weak players who fail regularly. Those player ratings are all too common for some.

Who is at fault for the tactics and set-up that has seen us score at a rate of just slightly over one goal per game during the two Moyes management eras?

Wow... what a stadium, and very well served with knowledgeable stewards.

The team was announced and I was pleased to see Branthwaite and George starting and pretty ambivalent whether O'Brien or Patterson played right-back.

I thought the two teams were pretty even up to us getting a deserved penalty. Cue 3 points until we went into Barry miss mode. If only we had a goalscorer who could even hold the ball up -- let alone convert clear-cut chances.

Second half, normal service resumed and we gave simple goals away -- although I believe their second was blatantly offside as he went for the ball -- much like the Ndiaye goal which was disallowed.

Out into the rain with disappointment still prevailing and realizing that, until we get full-backs and goalscorers worthy of the shirt, we will not be back at the top table anytime soon.

I posted yesterday after getting home and was angry and frustrated at Moyes, moreso about how we are trying to play. But, after watching it back, there were opportunities to win this, shut up shop and just take away a home win for once.

The whole back 4 were awful for both their goals. Ndiaye should have done better for the first too.

Your striker bags the 2 chances, your defence stays switched on, and this is a comfortable win. I don't think we can put that on Moyes.

The players should hold up their hands: Barry, Tarkowski, O'Brien, Ndiaye and Mykolenko, if they show concentration and intensity, desire to stop crosses, to not lose your man... we win!

I will go for one to your question though: Moyes selected O'Brien at right-back. This is not the first time the manager has failed to adjust when the opponents have picked up tempo.

Moyes is often caught in a position to need performance from players who have not had adequate match time in the same position to perform well.

More shifting the blame until Moyes can get a result, and then it is all due to him (yes, that is a gross simplification).

Especially team set-up and selection.

Weak from Mykolenko, and beaten near post. That ain't good enough.

They scored a second with a player clearly offside competiting for the ball, with Pickford a country mile from the cross. If that's for England, he's getting hammered for another failure on crosses.

I'll agree with some why the need to be so deep was ridiculous, but again, that's players organising it, not Moyes with a bloody tape measure.

And we missed a boat load either side of O'Brien making yet another error.

Hair pulls, face slaps, hand balls, rugby tackles. These are on the players. Any manager would be tearing their hair out over such stupidity.

Ndiaye up against the angle, but if he roofs it, it's unstoppable.

If Barry scores the 2 good chances he had, there wouldn't be much chatter on here about the manager.

I thought we started the 2nd half on the front foot and looked the most likely. The game changed when Barry missed the sweety... The next 10 mins couldn't have gone worse.

Weirdly enough, the movement people had been shouting for happened once we went down to 10 men. Garner, Armstrong, Ndiaye, even Mykolenko showed greater movement.

Moyes doesn't rate Alcaraz but he must be in contention for an attacking role.

I would be trying any formation possible that didn't include those 2 oafs, it's like playing with 10 men week on week.

Moyes agreed Barry was worth £30M and rubber-stamped the deal.

If that costs him his job, he will always at least be able to say he had final say on who comes and who goes.

Moyes had full control of recruitment first time around so it's hard to think he hasn't been involved with Barry, Dibling and Rohl. The jury is out with all 3.

It's hard to see why we paid £30M for Barry. He isn't quick, isn't strong, can't hold the ball up and looks ungainly when in front of goal.

Moyes's brother isn't Barry's agent, is he?

Which of them would have scored this goal?

Alcaraz vs Newcastle

We have survived the last few years and the ship has been steadied. It is time to move on.

In my opinion, to do that, we need about 4 new players and a new manager. A daunting prospect but not impossible.

Teams like Brighton, Bournemouth and Brentford still compete regardless of who the manager is. Which must point to the way players are recruited and ethos at those clubs.

Bournemouth sell Semenyo and bring in Rayan who looked class last night. We brought in George and Dibling and, without writing our 2 youngsters off, the lad Bournemouth brought in looks top drawer.

We need an identity and strategy that we can get behind.

Yes, Barry missed a sitter first half. The second-half chance was a fantastic bit of defending by the Bournemouth player.

Finally Seshko at Man Utd has 5 goals all season; Gyökeres at Arsenel has 6 or 7 with 2 penalties... both of these strikers cost over £70M.

Barry has 5 goals, no penalties, and cost circa £27M yet on here people believe he should be scoring every chance he gets.

Newsflash: If Barry was that deadl,y he would not be at Everton and he would have cost triple what we paid.

Oh, I see an unmarked Cole Palmer at Chelsea missed from 2 yards out. Just saying... let's have a reality check.

Post more often!

I think it was Sean in another thread that predicted this kind of result. It's boringly obvious to the point of being switch-off football. We don't win with style and we lose in the same way.

But for an unambitious, or perhaps cautious owner - Moyes is a dream, particularly for a club that has struggled in recent years. He's generally going to get you around 8th, safety and some nice income for already rich men.

As a fan though, you'll have a lot more fun supporting the teams Rob @198 mentioned.

Ian # 199 - Arsenal and Utd paid too much for them just like we did for Beto and Barry. Nevertheless I have to ask the question do they bring their team mates into the game because I don't think our two do very often.

Isaak has also failed at Mordor which really surprised me but comparing those three, and what was paid for them, with our two, only deflects from our problem. We need a goal scorer.

I forget who it was said it and where on here but a fan of 60 years said our two were the worst strikers he had ever seen play for us.

I don't like bagging players and I have never booed one or the team but we have to face our reality.

Playing either of those two handicaps us from the start so it's worse than pointless. Moyes needs to do something different.

To conclude my rant. The last player I really bagged was Steven Naismith (Schneiderlin was another) but the lad went and did this a couple of weeks later:-

https://youtu.be/1yP0Whs9R_M?si=Ny0osWxl4L74C0CW

So I came on here and ate humble pie.

The list I posted is not a “long list of Who's Who of Football Managers” -- whatever that means. It is a list of managers who will definitely be available for hire this summer. Not dream managers, not fantasy football managers, people who will consider a job offer if one is presented.

I am guessing the inference in your post is that we shouldn't assume any of the managers listed could do better than Moyes. I have heard that argument before a number of times in relation to this particular manager over a period of years.

But given the list includes managers who have won World Cups, Champions Leagues, League titles, domestic cups, I am guessing there might be a hidden gem among them who can match Moyesie's managerial stature.

Perhaps you are overlooking the fact that our owners also have a company in their group that provides statistics on player performance which might see pressure on the new owner-appointed management team, aka the Transfer Committee. Do TFG also have entertainment interests which might reinforce that now popular expression, "Show me the money"?

Mind you, given one of their other interests, Cannes FC, have taken an Everton junior on loan and another, Roma, loaned and then sold an English striker to a Turkish club who immediately onsold him to an Premier League side for a £7M profit makes me wonder if anybody oversees the group's entire sporting enterprises or if there is a pecking order.

Now, where have we seen this type of management before, the Boys Pen?

I would like to think that someone senior at TFG is asking those responsible for recruitment how they assess the additions made last Summer.

What has worked well, what hasn’t and what the plan is for those that haven’t, plus the learnings from those poorer decisions.

We have to have a big ( there are another half dozen out of contract in a relatively small squad) recruitment plan this Summer.

This is supposedly the big 2nd stage of the rebuild.

It will be a very big Summer for us, we have to have the right people making the right recruiting decisions. It is so important.. Our better players will only stay if they can see ambition and good players joining.

If not they will leave for clubs playing in Europe chasing honours.

I see Moyes as a Dyche 2.0, better man-management and more effective in possession. Other than that, not a lot of difference.

Someone like Glasner and Iraola are my initial interests but others may have deeper lists. These two strike me as football theory managers who can continually inspire solid performances from players wanting to prove themselves.

With Frank falling out at Spurs, it isn't a sure thing hiring the brainy types. However, those two seem capable of coming here and building something durable as opposed to direable.

He surrenders the cup completions for this mindset and it annoys the shit out of me.

I don’t think we need an out and out football theorist as a manager, just a modern day manager, developing players and teams who are comfortable with the ball and play as a unit.

It is noticeable we are better behind the ball, than with the ball, making the game. Hence the home/ away form difference.

We have a few quality players, we need to keep, and add to. Is Moyes a manager that attracts players, the jury is out on that one. Grealish and KDH joined, plenty of others turn us down it seems.

Plenty of forwards would decline the opportunity to be isolated and have long balls thumped at them. Plenty of wingers want to spend more time in the opposition half than their own. Petrified of taking a player on and losing the ball.

A better style of play would attract better footballers imo.

The manager is very important but every managers success is defined by what he has to work with and the quality of recruitment.

Quality of recruitment is also dependant on footballing philosophy and joining an ambitious club.

I guess I’m saying that style of play, winning mentality, quality of recruitment are all interwoven.

And do you think that those better players attracted by European football would improve the style of play and winning mentality?

I remember that movie Moneyball seeming to be about a bunch of less than stellar players being put into positions where they would contribute to the winning of games irrepective of their ability.

With Keane as centre-back, we have logged 27 of the 37 points we have, with Keane contributing 5 of those points with his goals.

With O'Brien as centre-back I think it's 12 points? No goals?

So going back to Moneyball, which player is contributing more, the 27 pointer or the 12 pointer?

So European football is an attraction for the best, albeit there has to be a big difference between Champions League elite and Europa Conference.

Yes I think European standard footballers would improve us, do they all have hunger, winning mentality? I think that’s where your recruitment due diligence comes in.

I can also understand why our better players would want to play on the biggest stages and why they will seek to do so if they can’t see a club with the ambition to take them there.

A couple of quotes from Frank on joining Spurs:

"He explained that the offensive flair should not necessarily come at the cost of defensive solidity, pointing out that it is important to defend well to win titles."

"if you want to achieve something big and consistently over the years, you also need to be pretty good at defending. I haven't seen one team achieve something fantastic without being good at defending."

Comment on the Spurs - Newcastle game: "All of what we saw, including the abject performance, the inability to create chances, and the constant jeers from the crowd, have been regular occurrences at the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium this season."

The Athletic headline: Managers can't change their style

"There was next to no entertainment across his miserable 38 games in charge, especially at home in front of an expectant crowd.

Too often, he seemed more focused on nullifying the opponents' threats rather than focusing on his own side's attacking strengths – and it wound supporters up no end.

Regularly, there seemed a lack of idea over how to break teams down from open play.

Tactical switches confused players. But soon it became too much, too often… and frequently at the last minute, as well."

You don't like Moyes? Fine. But why replace him with this guy who has all the attributes ypu dislike about Moyes?

Something our manager lamented during the summer window when he said some targets weren't interested 'cos they'd get no more money from additional competition in Europe.

Brightons owner is no mug and he plumped for Hurzeler, he seems a bright young guy.

Changing the manager without improving the overall quality of the team wont get us anywhere though, its the players that have to do the business on the field after all.

Looking at our fixtures to the end of the season is a bit scary, I don't see many wins to come.

I see a big difference in Moyes to dyche

9 league places and 20 points from where he took over just over 12 months ago.

People calling for frank, even hurzeler need to get a grip.

Frank has a squad way better than ours, Newcastle too, all below us, with our tiny squad, our minimal spending over the last few years.

I think it was suggested that Roma loan him to us though, but TFG seem to have priorities other than our squad shortages.

I thought it was reported that Roma had some temporary money problems which may have been some reporting problem.